so im now lookin at getting one of the walkers or dragoons or whatever they are called, the big sucker that can handle 50 or 60 grain loads. i know very little to nothing about these guns, and really dont know which one i want. looks like there are 1st, 2nd, and 3rd model dragoons, and i dont know if ther is just a walker colt or what. could anyone help with clear this up a little for me? thanks guys!
which one?
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Dave Rosenthal
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IMHO I think that since you're new to revolvers, that you try to go shoot one with a friend that owns one, or visit a club in your area, so you can politely ask to handle several revolvers to help you decide which to buy. Or show-up at a STORE and handle the goodies before you buy!
I own both an Uberti Colt Walker and an Uberti Colt 3Rd Model Dragoon. Both weigh about 4.5 pounds each, unloaded! Neither should be considered as a "first purchase" in this hobby, IMHO, since it's easy to develop a flinch lighting-off a RIFLE charge in a hand gun!
What types of hand gun experience do you have now? .22LR, .50 AE, .44 Spl, or something in-between? It's easier to help when we know what you're doing now.......
Dave
I own both an Uberti Colt Walker and an Uberti Colt 3Rd Model Dragoon. Both weigh about 4.5 pounds each, unloaded! Neither should be considered as a "first purchase" in this hobby, IMHO, since it's easy to develop a flinch lighting-off a RIFLE charge in a hand gun!
What types of hand gun experience do you have now? .22LR, .50 AE, .44 Spl, or something in-between? It's easier to help when we know what you're doing now.......
Dave
Sharps1863
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I agree with Smokin .50, if you are new to C&B pistol's I would start off cheap and work my way up. I would look for a cheap Brass frame and put some rounds through it 1st.
Try Cabalas, they always have a sell going on. The dragoons and walkers are a hand-full with full power loads..
But if you really want to start with a dragoon I would go with a 3rd model. Try this web site it gives an in site to the Walkers and Dragoons. http://www.vincelewis.net/coltdragoon.html
Try Cabalas, they always have a sell going on. The dragoons and walkers are a hand-full with full power loads..
But if you really want to start with a dragoon I would go with a 3rd model. Try this web site it gives an in site to the Walkers and Dragoons. http://www.vincelewis.net/coltdragoon.html
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ok thanks guys. right now i have a colt navy .44 and a bison or buffalo or whatever you call that big twelve inch barreled sucker. i grew up around guns, and shoot alot. i just dont know a heck of alot about the c&b revolvers. my buddie just bought a ruger .357 blackhawk, so now i gotta get a bp revolver thats just as intimidateing lol. :grin:
The Walker has a place in history but only 1000 were originally made and serious shortcomings were seen. The loading lever latch was a poor design and they were not strong enough to handle the full 60 grain charge, many blew up. The Dragoons were just a modified Walker with the cylinder shortened so that only 50 grains could be loaded. That apparently solved the blow-up problem. Both were "horse pistols", too heavy to be comfortably carried on the belt. The 1851 Navy was the first real belt pistol and the 1860 Army improved upon the Navy, being the same size and weight but with the more effective .44 caliber. The Walker is cool and has a great story behind it but an Army or Navy is more practical for actual carry and use. The question is "do you want it for show and tell or for actual shooting?"
I have read, many yrs ago, that one of the reasons that Walkers blew up, was that Some of the people, of the time, loaded the bullets backwards,IE (pointed end toward the cap end of cylinder). Round balls were not used that often, then, in C&B revolvers. Remember, C&B revolvers were The High Tech Of the day then. The conicals of the day were not like the ones most of us use in our revolvers. They were short, and more pointed.
barracudadave67 aka Rebel Dave
barracudadave67 aka Rebel Dave
I too have read of the old theory that the blown cylinders were caused by loading the conical backwards, point first into the chambers, but I have always suspected this excuse was made by some Colt employee to cover the questionable strength of the cylinders.
After all, when the powder is ignited it really doesn't care if a flat base or a cone is stuck into it. All it really cares about is the weight of the projectile.
I suppose someone might think that the square shoulder of a bullet that was loaded backwards could 'hang up' on the forcing cone in the barrel but in reality if it did it would just shear off any of the lead that was interfering with it.
It should be remembered that some of the early Walkers were made by Whitney, a company later known for its low cost copies of Colts and the idea that they may have used materials that were not up to the task isn't totally unreasonable.
Getting back to the big horse pistols, if I were to select one that can use large powder charges and not have some of the Walkers shortcomings it would be the 3rd Dragoon.
This model solved the loading lever problem, the cylinder notches have a lead in to reduce the lock up problems that can occur if the hand and latch aren't timed just right and the roundbacked trigger guard isn't as likely to damage fingers like the squareback guard has been known to do.
The comments about weight are well founded.
Shooting a 4.3-4.5 pound revolver single handed can become a bit tiring after 10-20 shots are fired.
After all, when the powder is ignited it really doesn't care if a flat base or a cone is stuck into it. All it really cares about is the weight of the projectile.
I suppose someone might think that the square shoulder of a bullet that was loaded backwards could 'hang up' on the forcing cone in the barrel but in reality if it did it would just shear off any of the lead that was interfering with it.
It should be remembered that some of the early Walkers were made by Whitney, a company later known for its low cost copies of Colts and the idea that they may have used materials that were not up to the task isn't totally unreasonable.
Getting back to the big horse pistols, if I were to select one that can use large powder charges and not have some of the Walkers shortcomings it would be the 3rd Dragoon.
This model solved the loading lever problem, the cylinder notches have a lead in to reduce the lock up problems that can occur if the hand and latch aren't timed just right and the roundbacked trigger guard isn't as likely to damage fingers like the squareback guard has been known to do.
The comments about weight are well founded.
Shooting a 4.3-4.5 pound revolver single handed can become a bit tiring after 10-20 shots are fired.
The backwards conical causing cylinder failures story does have at least some credibility; it's entirely possible that the backwards conical could leave a significant volume of open chamber above the powder once the tip is seated. That open volume could produce a pressure spike capable of causing a failure in early metallurgy cylinders.
I'm just saying...
I'm just saying...
ok these are really the reasons im interested in one: i want a revolver to hunt with, and i refuse to buy a cartrige revlver that costs atleast ten or more times as much to shoot as black powders. also, ive always been a fan of haveing traditional equipment that i can use just as well as my friends can use their modern gear, hence the intrest in primative archery and now black powder. plus, im a huge guy and love huge guns for some reason lol. these big honkin pistols just seem really cool to me. :grin:
missionary5155
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Good morning
For a revolver to hunt with then you would want either the 3rd Dragoon (I have one and it will easily do in deer) or I would consider the Ruger Old Army ( I have one of these also). The Rugers are very accurate and able to withstand any BP load you put in it.
Between the two I would go with the Ruger whenever accuracy is more important that having a replica in my hand. Both will get the job done.
For a revolver to hunt with then you would want either the 3rd Dragoon (I have one and it will easily do in deer) or I would consider the Ruger Old Army ( I have one of these also). The Rugers are very accurate and able to withstand any BP load you put in it.
Between the two I would go with the Ruger whenever accuracy is more important that having a replica in my hand. Both will get the job done.
CaptainKirk
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You might consider a Lyman Plains Pistol in either .50 or .54 cal....either should pack a wallop, if you like "big guns".
The Walker has it's pros and cons, the former being you can stuff up to 60 grains in each chamber, the latter including the annoying loading lever drop, the excessive weight, and the square-back trigger guard (which I personally like).
The Dragoons hold almost as much powder (up to 50 grains), have a loading lever latch, weigh less, and come in either square-back (Whitneyville, 1st and 2nd Model Dragoons) as well as rounded trigger guard (3rd Model Dragoon).
Any and all will thump up to deer-sized game easily.
Good luck! :wink:
Link to Uberti's site:
Walker: http://www.uberti.com/firearms/walker.php
Dragoons: http://www.uberti.com/firearms/dragoon_and_pocket_revolvers.php
Lyman Plains Pistol: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/muzzle-loaders/plains-pistol.php
The Walker has it's pros and cons, the former being you can stuff up to 60 grains in each chamber, the latter including the annoying loading lever drop, the excessive weight, and the square-back trigger guard (which I personally like).
The Dragoons hold almost as much powder (up to 50 grains), have a loading lever latch, weigh less, and come in either square-back (Whitneyville, 1st and 2nd Model Dragoons) as well as rounded trigger guard (3rd Model Dragoon).
Any and all will thump up to deer-sized game easily.
Good luck! :wink:
Link to Uberti's site:
Walker: http://www.uberti.com/firearms/walker.php
Dragoons: http://www.uberti.com/firearms/dragoon_and_pocket_revolvers.php
Lyman Plains Pistol: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/muzzle-loaders/plains-pistol.php
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