English lock build

Philip Chua · Jul 29, 2024

Some uploads of the English Lock project. Decided to go with another blank - this time curly cherry. I didn’t leave myself enough room for this giant lock on the ash stock. Some pics of the wood, some pics of a Stanley 45 combo plane and a V1.0 inletting iron. Already have a 3/8 oval I’m gonna try to use to inlet the ramrod. Just stuff to try. I plan to use the flat blade for the main and side channels then the Stanley 45 to remove the diagonals. It’s swamped to only can remove the smallest dimension of the barrel then chip out the rest.
Might be interesting to use on a straight barrel project.

Anyway, just some stuff.

Doc van Phil

dtruex · Jul 30, 2024

I'm interested to see how this progresses. Is that iron one you ground yourself or is it commercially available?

PathfinderNC · Jul 30, 2024

Following

Flint62Smoothie · Jul 30, 2024

Doglock … yes, an ‘English’ lock, but the last development thereof …

dave_person · Jul 31, 2024

Hi Philip,
Dog locks and other early English locks usually do not have an internal bridle to support the tumbler from the inside. Consequently, all the support comes from the hole in the lock plate. You want to make sure the fit of the tumbler through that hole is very precise. Drill it undersized and then ream or stone it to fit the tumbler exactly. In time it will wear and loosen up but if the parts are properly hardened and tempered, including the lock plate, it will last a long time.

dave

Philip Chua · Aug 11, 2024

An update on “progress”. I have begun to inlet the barrel and breech plug. I have found new and creative ways to chip the wood. Fortunately the worst bit were the end that will be cut off and then a few areas outside of my vertical chisel hits. There is almost 1/8 extra at the top here so I am not worrying too much.
Observations/
This is curly cherry. I have read about curly maple and you can’t appreciate how the wood has a mind of its own until you start chiseling/gouging your way through it!!! There are so many small knots in the wood it’s hard not to tear stuff. I have tried to take small thin gouges so the sharp bits can do their work. I’m down 1/2” or so to the bottom of the channel all the way across so now I’m going to work on the ends again to start dropping the barrel into the first (bottom 1/3) cut out.
Quite a learning curve this is.

ChuckJonesWagon · Aug 12, 2024

I've never worked with cherry so that may be the reason I'm looking at what appears to be tears more than cuts.

Are your tools razor sharp and are you re-sharpening (touching up) the edges after every 5 or so cuts?

Philip Chua · Aug 12, 2024

ChuckJonesWagon said:
I've never worked with cherry so that may be the reason I'm looking at what appears to be tears more than cuts.

Are your tools razor sharp and are you re-sharpening (touching up) the edges after every 5 or so cuts?

This was just the initial channel so that I can use in letting black to the bulk of this was done with the chisels which as very, very far from sharp. There are smoother sections done with the gouge which is sharp-er but will require attention before I start really in letting this to the wood. I will sharpen the chisels as well. I have been using (for my planes) the glass/sandpapaer setup but I ordered some diamond plates so I can keep the sharpening stuff up with my workmate and hit them with it regularly. I also have an electric wet sharpener but the jury is out on that.

James Kibler · Aug 12, 2024

Sharpen your tools and understand how to read the grain. In many areas, it's clear that you were cutting against the grain. No, this isn't because it's cherry or has some curl, but just cutting in the wrong direction. If the chisel wants to dive you are cutting in the wrong direction. If it tears out wood, it's the wrong direction. The cuts should be almost shiny when in the right direction.

ChuckJonesWagon · Aug 13, 2024

James Kibler said:
Sharpen your tools and understand how to read the grain. In many areas, it's clear that you were cutting against the grain. No, this isn't because it's cherry or has some curl, but just cutting in the wrong direction. If the chisel wants to dive you are cutting in the wrong direction. If it tears out wood, it's the wrong direction. The cuts should be almost shiny when in the right direction.

Yes....what he said. Cutting the "wrong" direction and using dull tools will get you in trouble quickly. (I don't know how this Kibler guy seems to have all the answers. He must have built a few in his time

)

Philip Chua · Aug 13, 2024

James Kibler said:
Sharpen your tools and understand how to read the grain. In many areas, it's clear that you were cutting against the grain. No, this isn't because it's cherry or has some curl, but just cutting in the wrong direction. If the chisel wants to dive you are cutting in the wrong direction. If it tears out wood, it's the wrong direction. The cuts should be almost shiny when in the right direction.

Steep learning curve. Learning to read the grain has been hard! I’m hoping with the slower work I’ll do a better job with it. I’ve only done inletting with basic pre-inlet rifle stocks (like 98 Mauser from Great American Gunstock etc) and none were like this!!!

ChuckJonesWagon said:
Yes....what he said. Cutting the "wrong" direction and using dull tools will get you in trouble quickly. (I don't know how this Kibler guy seems to have all the answers. He must have built a few in his time )

I'm just thrilled that he hangs out here to help! I plan to attend one of his classes next year. Just couldn't make it work with my schedule this year. This project is part of the skill building toward making one of his kits (which seems backwards but really isn't - I have minimal $ in this wood - just time).

PathfinderNC · Aug 13, 2024

Philip Chua said:
Steep learning curve. Learning to read the grain has been hard! I’m hoping with the slower work I’ll do a better job with it. I’ve only done inletting with basic pre-inlet rifle stocks (like 98 Mauser from Great American Gunstock etc) and none were like this!!!

I'm just thrilled that he hangs out here to help! I plan to attend one of his classes next year. Just couldn't make it work with my schedule this year. This project is part of the skill building toward making one of his kits (which seems backwards but really isn't - I have minimal $ in this wood - just time).

I hope it goes well for you. That’s a nice piece of Cherry to be learning on.

Philip Chua · Aug 13, 2024

PathfinderNC said:
I hope it goes well for you. That’s a nice piece of Cherry to be learning on.

Have quite a bit of it left. In WV we have lots of small volume guys cutting. I actually have a bandsaw myself but no seasoned wood. This was barn dried for a few years. Board was prob 12’ by 24” and 2.25”. I have a bunch of deadfall trunks sitting stacked waiting for me to get off my ass and cut them! I live on 100a with probably 60% old timber. I just had an ancient oak go down so my hobby time has been eaten into by that.

Rawhide67 · Aug 13, 2024

I've been inletting an ash stock and find it's damn hard. Cut by power company linemen on the edge of my property about 5 years ago. I slabbed it immediately and let it air dry, cut it in to a rough blank last summer. It's chippy and brittle, hard to work with. My lock inlet got messed up, slightly oversized so I'll need some sort of boundary filler.

I modified a cherry stock a few months ago and found that decent to work.

Larry (Omaha) · Aug 13, 2024

ChuckJonesWagon said:
I've never worked with cherry so that may be the reason I'm looking at what appears to be tears more than cuts.

Are your tools razor sharp and are you re-sharpening (touching up) the edges after every 5 or so cuts?

I am no expert, but made my 48" barreled smoothie out of Cherry and to me it shapes and cuts similar to Walnut. It may appear a little more stringy, but sharp tools are essential for any wood. JMO
Larry

Philip Chua · Aug 13, 2024

Rawhide67 said:
I've been inletting an ash stock and find it's damn hard. Cut by power company linemen on the edge of my property about 5 years ago. I slabbed it immediately and let it air dry, cut it in to a rough blank last summer. It's chippy and brittle, hard to work with. My lock inlet got messed up, slightly oversized so I'll need some sort of boundary filler.

I modified a cherry stock a few months ago and found that decent to work.

The ash was definitely more dense feeling and there were knots right in the wrist trigger area that were not evident when I cut it. I have more ash but the cherry is pretty. Obviously I’m learning the hard way but what other way is there when you’re on you own! Only so much you can learn in books and YouTube. But I feel like as I got toward the end of my work the other day it was going much more smoothly and I was not tearing the wood so much as shaving it (smaller bites using my gouges which are a lot sharper). The chisels were definitely not sharp. I also have a bunch of curly maple but it was relatively more expensive than the cherry and one of those boards (the nicer of the two) prob needs a year or more as it’s two years out and 2.5 wide but still to me feels very heavy.

Rawhide67 · Aug 13, 2024

I was advised by a wood worker to soak the ash stock in warm water for several hours. According to him, it will soften the outer layers to make it more workable and “shouldn’t” cause any warping or twisting.

Philip Chua · Aug 15, 2024

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Welp. This is not an oak is a massive red maple. Guess I better get the blade sorted out and get to cutting! The heartwood looks interesting.

Philip Chua · Aug 23, 2024

I don't want to brag but if bad chip outs during inletting was an olympic sport I'd win the gold medal. Was having tons and tons of fun with "opportunities for improvement" as we say in leadership classes.

Philip Chua · Oct 27, 2024

Since my English lock is on hiatus at a gunsmith I decided to switch this to a matchlock. So I have been scratch building this “tricker” lock off some photos of one from the Winchester Collection in Cody WY. I’ve never seen one in person so working out how the tumbler works without binding has been a trick. Should have it sorted this week and then the project can resume!

English lock build

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