Unplugging patent breech? Loaded rifle…

SeaBee133 · Sep 9, 2024

Deep cleaned my TC .50 “Hawken” last week. Had fluid running out of the nipple. Dried, lightly oiled, kept muzzle down.
Got it out this evening. Loaded in the house, went out back, brand new tin of CCI #11 Magnum caps. Triple 7 3F 100gr load, lubed patch and ball (noidea how old, was white). 5 good hard cap set off strikes. Pulled the nipple, dislodged some crud. Tried again, no change. Ran the pick into the breach, hitting either the ball or a hard obstruction.
Is it safe to pull the nipple, add 5-10gr of Swiss 3F and try to fire it out? Did the breech plug ingest the entire charge and the round is blocking the channel? Not sure that is actually possible…
I know I can, and likely should, just use a ball puller. First time the rifle has been loaded in at least 10 years. Almost never have to pull a revolver ball.

Phil Coffins · Sep 9, 2024

Did you pop caps on the unloaded rifle before pouring powder? If not there’s the problem, priming under the nipple is a common way to try to fix it.

wiscoaster · Sep 9, 2024

Use the ball puller or some other method. I recommend the grease gun method as the safest and most sure of success. Messiest, also, but it sounds like you've already made a mess. If you don't know what the obstruction is, I think trying to blast it out isn't a good choice. Good luck.

Stykbow · Sep 9, 2024

You’re on the right track. Pull the nipple, dribble in some powder and shoot it out. Out of curiosity, when you cleaned did you pull the nipple to pump water thru it? I’m with @Phil Coffins on this one. I always pop a cap or two before loading on a clean barrel. It’ll dry up any leftover oil and push out any crud.

SDSmlf · Sep 9, 2024

Stykbow said:
I’m with @Phil Coffins on this one. I always pop a cap or two before loading on a clean barrel. It’ll dry up any leftover oil and push out any crud.

What do you do with a flintlock? Obviously no nipple to put a cap on. Personally, have always relied on a clean oil free dry bore. Prevention always seems better than some sort of bandaid workaround.

Phil Coffins · Sep 9, 2024

The flash channel on a flintlock is generally shorter then a cap lock.

Stykbow · Sep 9, 2024

SDSmlf said:
What do you do with a flintlock? Obviously no nipple to put a cap on. Personally, have always relied on a clean oil free dry bore. Prevention always seems better than some sort of bandaid workaround.

I don’t do anything with a flintlock, don’t have one. I don’t use a ton of oil in my barrels, but they all get lightly coated. I could probably skip the cap pop, but old habits die hard.

SDSmlf · Sep 9, 2024

Phil Coffins said:
The flash channel on a flintlock is generally shorter then a cap lock.

So oil in the shorter flash channel with flintlock isn’t a problem? Why not just use something that drys to a film? Think Eezox or Barricade.

SDSmlf · Sep 9, 2024

Stykbow said:
I don’t do anything with a flintlock, don’t have one. I don’t use a ton of oil in my barrels, but they all get lightly coated. I could probably skip the cap pop, but old habits die hard.

I’ve got bad habits too, but learned early on that too much oil in a muzzleloader breech was one that had to be kicked.

akroguy · Sep 9, 2024

oil down a muzzleloader bore is dancing with the devil.

But, it's a dance we have to do else battle the demons of corrosion.

A dry patch wipe (or two) followed by a snapped cap is the path forward but getting that %^&#! patent breech clean and dry can still be problematic. (A patch on a .22 cal brass bristle brush can work or a sub-caliber bore mop)

I am not a fan of these breeches.

SeaBee133 · Sep 9, 2024

Phil Coffins said:
Did you pop caps on the unloaded rifle before pouring powder? If not there’s the problem, priming under the nipple is a common way to try to fix it.

I did not, never have to with the ROA, so didn’t even think of it for the rifle. Completely spaced the odd travel path in a patent breech.
I’ll try to pop it out with some Swiss 3F. If that doesn’t work, I’ll just pull the ball.
Thanks for the reminder.

SeaBee133 · Sep 9, 2024

akroguy said:
oil down a muzzleloader bore is dancing with the devil.

But, it's a dance we have to do else battle the demons of corrosion.

A dry patch wipe (or two) followed by a snapped cap is the path forward but getting that %^&#! patent breech clean and dry can still be problematic. (A patch on a .22 cal brass bristle brush can work or a sub-caliber bore mop)

I am not a fan of these breeches.

I scrubbed it out with a new .22 phosphor bronze brush. Mop and soggy patches, cleaner ran out the nipple. The “oil” was T-17 that melted, was 98*F outside when I cleaned it.
Swabbed it out with 91% rubbing alcohol before loading, forgot to clear the nipple/breech with a couple caps before loading.

Stykbow · Sep 10, 2024

SDSmlf said:
I’ve got bad habits too, but learned early on that too much oil in a muzzleloader breech was one that had to be kicked.

Well yeah, but if someone using so much oil it puddles up then they’re doing it wrong.

sussexmuzllodr · Sep 10, 2024

Couple of squirts of p blaster and mop the bore after cleaning.
Ready to shoot? Mop it out with straight alcohol.
People tend to over complicate things. Aside from storing it submerged in water nothing is going to degrade the barrels inside.
One of the most over wrought subjects on this forum.

Grenadier1758 · Sep 10, 2024

SDSmlf said:
What do you do with a flintlock? Obviously no nipple to put a cap on. Personally, have always relied on a clean oil free dry bore. Prevention always seems better than some sort of bandaid workaround.

SDSmlf said:
So oil in the shorter flash channel with flintlock isn’t a problem? Why not just use something that drys to a film? Think Eezox or Barricade.

I use the dental floss picks or a stiff brush for cleaning paint sprayers through the touch hole and to keep the bore clean, a wipe of the bore with an alcohol damp patch.

You are correct. Best quality is obtained by preventing problems before they become a problem.

Paul Kenney · Sep 10, 2024

SeaBee133 said:
Deep cleaned my TC .50 “Hawken” last week. Had fluid running out of the nipple. Dried, lightly oiled, kept muzzle down.
Got it out this evening. Loaded in the house, went out back, brand new tin of CCI #11 Magnum caps. Triple 7 3F 100gr load, lubed patch and ball (noidea how old, was white). 5 good hard cap set off strikes. Pulled the nipple, dislodged some crud. Tried again, no change. Ran the pick into the breach, hitting either the ball or a hard obstruction.
Is it safe to pull the nipple, add 5-10gr of Swiss 3F and try to fire it out? Did the breech plug ingest the entire charge and the round is blocking the channel? Not sure that is actually possible…
I know I can, and likely should, just use a ball puller. First time the rifle has been loaded in at least 10 years. Almost never have to pull a revolver ball.

Just went through that with a Hawken percussion I hadn't shot for several years. I had popped a cap on it to clear the nipple and did 5 shots, all good. Been reading here about swabbing after a few shots so I did. Either I dislodged some gunk to plug the nipple or too much liquid on swab, used quick drying bore cleaner. Anyhow back in the day when I had this happen occasionally and this last time I put about a .22LR cartridge of powder under the nipple and it was enough to dislodge the ball.

Reds · Sep 10, 2024

All mine are stored “Muzzle Down”. Wipe them out, pop a couple caps and load! Never had a problem in 44 years!!! Hope this helps, Reds

airiest-falcon0n · Sep 10, 2024

SeaBee133 said:
Deep cleaned my TC .50 “Hawken” last week. Had fluid running out of the nipple. Dried, lightly oiled, kept muzzle down.
Got it out this evening. Loaded in the house, went out back, brand new tin of CCI #11 Magnum caps. Triple 7 3F 100gr load, lubed patch and ball (noidea how old, was white). 5 good hard cap set off strikes. Pulled the nipple, dislodged some crud. Tried again, no change. Ran the pick into the breach, hitting either the ball or a hard obstruction.
Is it safe to pull the nipple, add 5-10gr of Swiss 3F and try to fire it out? Did the breech plug ingest the entire charge and the round is blocking the channel? Not sure that is actually possible…
I know I can, and likely should, just use a ball puller. First time the rifle has been loaded in at least 10 years. Almost never have to pull a revolver ball.

It sounds like you knew what to do, but forgot to do it! As a relatively newcomer to bp ( maybe 8 yrs.?) I made a list of proper loading/shooting/cleaning sequence to refresh my memory each time. I have percussion and flintlock now, so refer to lists when I go from 1 gun to the other. It’s been a year since I last fired the caplock, so will glance at list before I take it out again.

westrayer · Sep 10, 2024

Silent ball discharger. They use a CO2 cartridge. I use them in hunting season after a day in the woods. I can empty the gun without having to shoot out the ball and charge. And the gun is still relatively clean.

Grimord · Sep 10, 2024

westrayer said:
Silent ball discharger. They use a CO2 cartridge. I use them in hunting season after a day in the woods. I can empty the gun without having to shoot out the ball and charge. And the gun is still relatively clean.

One caution when using the c02 discharger. Sometimes, the c02 blasts a hole thru the powder and exits the projectile, but leaves a ring of compressed powder around the inside of the barrel like a donut. With the next loading, you may get a hangfire, or will have a much larger powder charge that may affect your sight in point of impact. When using these dischargers I run a bore scraper down the barrel to dislodge any remaining powder ring before re-loading.

Unplugging patent breech? Loaded rifle…

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