It's a nice knife, but not a Old Original Patch Knife.
-
Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.
We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.
Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103
patch knife?
- Thread starter olskool
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
It's a nice knife, but not a Old Original Patch Knife.
i do not think it was made in our time period. if you could hold it you can just tell. i know there are fake everything, but this looks and feels right. but anyway, it is cool,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
i have to say, you are incorrect,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
My two bits is the knife might be a harness makers knife or a knife to be use in some kind of leather worker's trade.
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2021
- Messages
- 2,809
- Reaction score
- 6,023
Show one, just one, example from an archeological site that has a blade shape even similar to the one pictured and then you will have a better idea of its age.
- Joined
- May 6, 2014
- Messages
- 17,431
- Reaction score
- 16,433
Not sure how old the blade is, as it looks like it was ground down from a longer blade.
However, the use of cutlers rivets on the handle means at least the handle, as we see it, is no older than the 1880's.
Gus
No it's a fact, there is no documentation of using a small knife ( patch knife ) for the purpose of cutting patches. Don't blame the messenger .
Those aren’t cutlers rivets, they’re solid brass pins that have been peened over, and they’re documented to the Bronze Age.
here are a few better shots.
Yeah, definitely pins, not rivets. Mine often get the same cracking from not being annealed quite enough. 
There’s a real beauty in the simple, clean lines of this little knife. A lot of modern makers- myself included- could learn a lot from studying these older pieces. Like how to not stress about not getting the pins right.
There’s a real beauty in the simple, clean lines of this little knife. A lot of modern makers- myself included- could learn a lot from studying these older pieces. Like how to not stress about not getting the pins right.
Looks well done, no matter when it was made
- Joined
- May 6, 2014
- Messages
- 17,431
- Reaction score
- 16,433
Yep, with the better pictures, I can see they aren't cutlers rivets. Now I'm wondering if they are rivets and burs?
Gus
I’m not seeing any evidence of that- if it was, we should see a more-or-less circular mark indicating the two separate pieces of metal.
The first picture here is a locust-handled butcher knife I made in the late 90s. It has brass pins. The second is an antique I got from a friend- it had been in his family since at least the middle 1800s. It has 2 steel pins and a brass pin and burr.
Jay
Attachments
Mike in FL
50 Cal.
I don't t
I don't think we can know or declare there were no patch knives or ball starters. All we really have is circumstantial evidence. Just like ball starters and flintlock Hawkens. I think we should consider what COULD have been made. Maybe there were individuals living here and there who had such items but left no trace. I mean we can say with authority that the people 16th and 17th centuries had no 3D printers or helicopters or rifle scopes, but some of their activities and gadgets may have existed but have not been discovered.
Mike in FL
50 Cal.
I don't think we can declare or say as fact that the 16th and 17th folks didn't have patch knives or short starters. They would certainly have the means to make such things. About the strongest thing we can say we can say circumstantial evidence indicates they did not and that none have been found. Everyone does things out of the norm to address individual needs and concerns. We CAN say as a certainty they didn't have 3D printers or cellphones or Chevrolets.
In an article in a 1935 "American Rifleman" on the Flintlock Rifle is a figure showing the contents of a shot bag associated with a flintlock rifle. There is an item that looks like a short starter but is identified as a "Bulger". In the article the Bulger is used to start the ball. No patch knife was in the figure although an arch punch device is shown and labeled as a patch cutter. Precut patches are shown on a thread.
How many items that we use had a different name back then?
Now back to the original posting of the patch knife. The shape of the handle appears more modern with the curves and full tang. The blade does look old. I have been mistaken when aging items before. I do like the looks of that knife and it should do an excellent job of cutting patches at the muzzle. Great find.
How many items that we use had a different name back then?
Now back to the original posting of the patch knife. The shape of the handle appears more modern with the curves and full tang. The blade does look old. I have been mistaken when aging items before. I do like the looks of that knife and it should do an excellent job of cutting patches at the muzzle. Great find.
Mike in FL
50 Cal.
Phooey, I posted that twice. I thought the first one didn't go thru.
- Joined
- May 6, 2014
- Messages
- 17,431
- Reaction score
- 16,433
Hi Jay,
I have seen rivets pounded into burs and then the top surface filed smooth so the circular mark cannot be seen, especially when the metal ages. I'm not definite this is what is happening here, though.
I will also say if those are brass pins, the diameter of the pin must be far larger than I would ever expect to see on a knife handle.
I can't rule out cutlers rivets, though. Those shown below when pounded with a hammer and so much of the surface on each side is above the surface of the wood, it seems the cracks along the circumference could easily result.
Two-Piece Press-Fit Rivets for Wood
Installed
Also known as cutlery rivets, the two heads provide a finished look on both sides of your material. Use a hammer or press to join the mating parts. Access to both sides of the material is required.
Gus
Last edited:
Similar threads
