Gunshows are dangerous. Whitneyville Pocket

Went looking for any cool black powder stuff, and found this thing. Thought it was a chopped Whitney Navy at first glance.

It's smaller though. Didn't realize Whitney made a pocket pistol that wasn't an oddball attempt to get around patents. It's just like the Whitney navy, just small.

Quite close in size to a colt pocket. And internals are basically identical to colt. 5 shot 31 (maybe, chambers look a bit bigger than repro 31 cals). Will need to get home and check after the weekend.





Original finish is gone, but function is perfect. Lockup and timing are solid and spot on. I'm also amazed at how smooth action is. Way, way smoother than any reproduction revolver I own. Well, one that haven't been aggressively tuned.

Only real issue is a broken arbor pin release key/screw. Think I'm gonna have to make one, when I can get the broken piece out.



Think I'll be cutting a screw slot into the broken pin with a tiny bit and dremel. Hopefully some pb blaster will loosen things up.

Anyway, couldn't find a single thread on these here, and thought you all might find it interesting.

Well, the "broken" key is just a pin. I thought it was the same as the full size guns. Glad I decided to push on the back side of it.



That's simple. Don't see threads in the pin holes. May be worn out or something.


I now know all the numbers match, which is cool. They stamped just about everything.

Can also now see the bore much better. Rifling is shallow, but in good shape. Muzzle end is a bit pitted.

Here's the cylinder next to a tiny 1963 Remington. Chamber mouths might be slightly larger, or it's just an optical illusion.

Seems possible they're tapered. Will need tools from home to find out.

I've always found the Whitneys to be fascinating. I've been planning on getting one, but something else always seems to get in the way.

Nice piece

Trot said:

I've always found the Whitneys to be fascinating. I've been planning on getting one, but something else always seems to get in the way.

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I'm surprised there aren't more reproductions of them. There were a good number involved in the war, as well as a lot of civilian models. Guess the Whitney name doesn't have the pull of Remington, even if what we call an 1858 is essentially a copy of the Whitney.

I'd like to grab a Whitney Navy at some point. Having a frame size between a pocket and a Colt Navy would be good. Always found the 1851's to be heavy for their caliber.

BCWILL said:

Nice piece

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It ain't pretty at the moment, but I think after the surface rust is carefully removed it'll be quite a bit nicer. Will be fun to see how it shoots.

Don't think the nipples are going to be easy to remove. May shoot it before tackling them. Heard boiling the cylinder can help. Then maybe put it in a bag of penetrating oil and drop onto the ultrasonic cleaner.

KingOfKindling said:

Went looking for any cool black powder stuff, and found this thing. Thought it was a chopped Whitney Navy at first glance.

It's smaller though. Didn't realize Whitney made a pocket pistol that wasn't an oddball attempt to get around patents. It's just like the Whitney navy, just small.

Quite close in size to a colt pocket. And internals are basically identical to colt. 5 shot 31 (maybe, chambers look a bit bigger than repro 31 cals). Will need to get home and check after the weekend.

View attachment 363862

View attachment 363863

Original finish is gone, but function is perfect. Lockup and timing are solid and spot on. I'm also amazed at how smooth action is. Way, way smoother than any reproduction revolver I own. Well, one that haven't been aggressively tuned.

Only real issue is a broken arbor pin release key/screw. Think I'm gonna have to make one, when I can get the broken piece out.

View attachment 363864

Think I'll be cutting a screw slot into the broken pin with a tiny bit and dremel. Hopefully some pb blaster will loosen things up.

Anyway, couldn't find a single thread on these here, and thought you all might find it interesting.

Click to expand...

Very handy! Great little gun! Bet a replica from Uberti, et al, would sell well!

KingOfKindling said:

Then maybe put it in a bag of penetrating oil

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A 50/50 mix of Dexron II ATF and acetone will out preform any commercial penetrating oil on the market. It is on a par with Kroil and a lot less expensive.

bpd303 said:

A 50/50 mix of Dexron II ATF and acetone will out preform any commercial penetrating oil on the market. It is on a par with Kroil and a lot less expensive.

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Might give that a shot. Got plenty of acetone and various partial containers of ATF. Currently have the frame soaking in PB blaster, the trigger and bolt screws did not want to budge, and have had plenty of abuse heaped upon them in the past. If PB blaster doesn't do the trick, I'll break out the custom blend.

Measured the Cylinder, the size difference was largely an optical illusion due to a more significant chamfer, and the larger cylinder diameter. At the mouth, they cylinder bore is .316 - .3165. That about a thousandth larger than the modern Remington. An insignificant difference.

The interesting difference is that the cylinder bores are in fact tapered. My smallest telescopic guage was only small enough to get about half way down, but it's clear there is a taper. At the halfway point the size has shrunk to .310 consistently in all chambers. Maybe after some some more cleaning I'll bust out some gauge pins and see what size they are in the very bottom.

KingOfKindling said:

Might give that a shot. Got plenty of acetone and various partial containers of ATF. Currently have the frame soaking in PB blaster, the trigger and bolt screws did not want to budge, and have had plenty of abuse heaped upon them in the past. If PB blaster doesn't do the trick, I'll break out the custom blend.

Measured the Cylinder, the size difference was largely an optical illusion due to a more significant chamfer, and the larger cylinder diameter. At the mouth, they cylinder bore is .316 - .3165. That about a thousandth larger than the modern Remington. An insignificant difference.

The interesting difference is that the cylinder bores are in fact tapered. My smallest telescopic guage was only small enough to get about half way down, but it's clear there is a taper. At the halfway point the size has shrunk to .310 consistently in all chambers. Maybe after some some more cleaning I'll bust out some gauge pins and see what size they are in the very bottom.

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Might try a really small acetylene torch too too, if you can get those cones cherry red it should burn off the rust on the threads. I'm not a gunsmith, but that works on old engine parts and other mechanical things. I always try to re use the original hardware on antiques, and I find if I burn off the rust with heat they come apart easy without stripping and rounding off bolt heads. As they cool you can drop a little oil to wick into the warm threads with capillary action too, works really well.

Don't know if you know the trick to holding the cylinder still while trying to take the cones out when it's out of the frame. I use 2 pieces of dowel rod that fit the chambers snug, then clamp the dowels in the vise, keeps the cylinder from turning. A good fitting nipple/cone wrench and try to loosen then tighten and usually the cone will start unscrewing, a little penetrating oil then work the cone back & forth until they are out.

Nice Find !!
I would take those stocks off and let it soak in that 50-50 mix and forget it for a week. Then try and strip it down. Anyway Good Luck with your great find.

bpalbee said:

Might try a really small acetylene torch too too, if you can get those cones cherry red it should burn off the rust on the threads. I'm not a gunsmith, but that works on old engine parts and other mechanical things. I always try to re use the original hardware on antiques, and I find if I burn off the rust with heat they come apart easy without stripping and rounding off bolt heads. As they cool you can drop a little oil to wick into the warm threads with capillary action too, works really well.

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Be a good excuse to get a tiny torch. My oxy-acetylene rig is for big stuff, and I've used it to good results on car/tractor parts.

Heat will be a last resort though, as I don't want to overheat a cylinder with questionable steel. At least a real Whitney will have better steel than what the confederate clones had available. Sound like a very large percentage of those blew up during proofing.

bpd303 said:

Don't know if you know the trick to holding the cylinder still while trying to take the cones out when it's out of the frame. I use 2 pieces of dowel rod that fit the chambers snug, then clamp the dowels in the vise, keeps the cylinder from turning. A good fitting nipple/cone wrench and try to loosen then tighten and usually the cone will start unscrewing, a little penetrating oil then work the cone back & forth until they are out.

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I've seen some videos of people locking the wrench in a vise. Either way is probably a good option, less things to try and keep straight. Gonna turn down a wrench to fit as close as possible, the current standard size is too big.

Rich44 said:

Nice Find !!
I would take those stocks off and let it soak in that 50-50 mix and forget it for a week. Then try and strip it down. Anyway Good Luck with your great find.

Click to expand...

The frame has been soaking in a bag full of PB blaster for the last few days. Gonna give it several more before trying the trigger and bolt screws. Should get some small stainless containers or something for soaking parts. A mix of 50% acetone would probably eat through a Ziploc, I know 100% acetone does them in in about a half hour.

Once the frame has sat long enough, I'll probably add more oil to the bag, then drop the whole bag into an ultrasonic cleaner full of water. Give that several good cycles, before trying the screws.

KingOfKindling said:

Well, the "broken" key is just a pin. I thought it was the same as the full size guns. Glad I decided to push on the back side of it.

View attachment 363898

That's simple. Don't see threads in the pin holes. May be worn out or something.


I now know all the numbers match, which is cool. They stamped just about everything.

Can also now see the bore much better. Rifling is shallow, but in good shape. Muzzle end is a bit pitted.

Here's the cylinder next to a tiny 1963 Remington. Chamber mouths might be slightly larger, or it's just an optical illusion.

Seems possible they're tapered. Will need tools from home to find out.

View attachment 363899

Click to expand...

The screw (pin as you say) that holds the loading lever/cylinder pin in may have originally been like a Rogers&Spencer. Meaning a two piece screw and nut through a smooth hole. Look at a schematic for the R&S.

KingOfKindling said:

Well, the "broken" key is just a pin. I thought it was the same as the full size guns. Glad I decided to push on the back side of it.

View attachment 363898

That's simple. Don't see threads in the pin holes. May be worn out or something.


I now know all the numbers match, which is cool. They stamped just about everything.

Can also now see the bore much better. Rifling is shallow, but in good shape. Muzzle end is a bit pitted.

Here's the cylinder next to a tiny 1963 Remington. Chamber mouths might be slightly larger, or it's just an optical illusion.

Seems possible they're tapered. Will need tools from home to find out.

View attachment 363899

Click to expand...

Excited for you about this find!

Dickydalton said:

The screw (pin as you say) that holds the loading lever/cylinder pin in may have originally been like a Rogers&Spencer. Meaning a two piece screw and nut through a smooth hole. Look at a schematic for the R&S.

Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking it was going to be at first. However, the pin runs through the center, rather than the bottom like the Whitney, Spiller & Burr, and Rogers and Spencer.

The serial number is quite low, so I think they hadn't yet upgraded the pin system yet. I'd imagine it wasn't originally just a solid pin. Will examine it closer after I take it out of the oil. Think it has been in long enough, I'm gonna try and disassemble it tonight.

Was busy with work this week and didn't get to do much until today. I did get everthing but the hand to hammer screw out, that one was really not budging and had been very badly abused in the past.

Decided to try the Acetone/ATF mix for a few days. Surprisingly, a ziploc bag actually held up, even through a few ultrasonic cycles.



Still no luck on that last screw, it's basically a lost cause without drilling it out. Which is fine, I may do it in the future. For now, it can stay there. It's still possible to thoroughly clean the gun even with the hammer still in place.

After giving up on that screw, I got the gun all reassembled to go shooting, and then it started pouring rain.

So, I modified a nipple wrench. Just had to remove a few thousandths, and add a bit of a chamfer, and now it fits perfectly. Still plan to shoot the gun before actually removing the nipples though.



Since the rain continued, I decided to try and figure out what to do about the arbor pin situation. With the gun cleaned up, I was able to see actual threads in the hole on the left side of the gun. They were in pretty bad shape, but I was able to tell that they were the same size and pitch as the other arbor pin (circled in red).



I didn't know if standard thread sizes were a thing before the war, so I decided to mostly wing it. Thread pitch was really close to 40 threads per inch. Outer diameter of the thread was .1360.

Having some numbers to shoot for, I grabbed a bit of 12L14 steel and went to work. I've not made many threads on the lathe, so I decided to do a practice piece that could double as a thread chaser. It worked out pretty good even though I just eyeballed the thread depth. Stopped at 13 thousandths.



Was a bit tough to screw in by hand, but it did go in. With a little oil and multiple cycles I was able to clean up the threads on the gun.



With a known good fit, I went and made the actual pin.



Cut the slot with a tiny diamond dremel blade. Didn't do the best job of that, but it matches the other screw heads at least. So yeah, if anyone asks, I was doing my best to match the gun.

12L14 fire blues really nice by the way. Took it mostly past all the pretty blue colors to a greyish blue. Still not a perfect match, it's a bit too polished and blue. Maybe I'll leave some black powder fowling on it when I go shooting and see if I can get it to match the rest of the gun.