1766 Charleville

[rickystl]

Hello All.

Does anyone remember if the EARLY Navy Arms model made in Japan was a one or two piece stock ?
Something in the back of my memory says it was a two-piece (?)
Thanks for any help.

Rick

 

[Artificer]

Rick,

I don't know if this helps or not, because I no longer have the musket. Some of us bought Charleville Kits in 1978 directly from Navy Arms and they had one piece stocks. Since we indirectly worked for Navy Arms, we got the locks without lock plate markings, so we could make as close of copies to the M 1808 Springfield as possible at that time.

Gus

 

[rickystl]

Hi Gus

YES !! That helps. I now recall those kits having a one piece stock. I remember seeing it in their catalog.
I do remember back then seeing one offered with a two-piece stock, also made in Japan. Maybe it was Centenial Arms (?)
Anyway, I'm looking at a Navy Arms model that appears unused, factory finished, with a VERY low serial number. I'll try to get it. :haha:
Thanks again.

Rick

 

[Artificer]

Hi Rick,

I don't remember much about Centennial Arms, other than they imported really cheap/low quality UnCivil War period revolvers. We would not work on them, as even their repair parts were junk. So I can't be of much help there.

I am not entirely sure, but I don't think Navy Arms got into selling Japanese/Miroku Arms until the 1980's? However, don't take that as "chiseled in stone," because I was into UnCivil War in that period and did not "keep up" on NA Charlevilles, then.

I do remember the NA kits we purchased in 1978 turned out to be some very good Muskets that sparked and worked like a champ.

Glad to be of some help and good luck with your proposed purchase.

Gus

 

[hawkeye2]

Navy Arms was selling the Japanese/Miroku Bess and Charleville in '76.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I had one of the "Centennial arms" aka "Ultra-hi" muskets in caplock, which were back action locks, and I owned it back in the late 1970's. They were two piece stocks with the stock joint hidden by one of the barrel bands. They were good examples of some of the junk that the South had to use in the ACW, imported from Europe. Mine was smoothbore, it worked fine when I swapped out the small nipple for a proper musket nipple, and it worked very well showing some of the inadequate arms the CSA had privates had to carry.

They also made a "flint" version, which simply had a different breech plug in the barrel and a plate with the frizzen was mounted on the stock forward of the back-action lock, and they swapped the hammer for a cock....POS in every way... :barf: except they looked good over a mantel in a restored old house, or on the wall at a local Cracker Barrel restaurant.

Now the Navy Arms Miroku Bess..., I scored an unfired one this year, made in 1984..., nice piece of gear in every way. :wink: :grin:

LD

 

[Artificer]

Navy Arms was selling the Japanese/Miroku Bess and Charleville in '76.

Thank you.

That would explain why I didn't see them when they came out, then. I was stationed in Indiana from then until 1980, so I missed the Spring and Fall Nationals of the NSSA - where I would have seen them, even though they were flintlocks.

I did go to the Spring and Fall Nationals at Friendship during those years, but wasn't looking for a Charleville there, as I competed with a NA Brown Bess Carbine.

Happy to get that chronology! Thanks again.

Gus

 

[simonbeans]

I have two Charleville muskets from Navy Arms. One was purchased in 1976 and the was a kit from Navy Arms, purchased a couple of years later. Both have 2 piece stocks with the joint hidden under the lower band. Both are excellent shooters. Locks are superb.

 

[hawkeye2]

The only decent Charlevilles that I'm aware of with a 2 piece stock were the ones by Harpers Ferry Arms and those had a 2 piece American walnut stock spliced more or less permanently under the rear band. They had very light engraving on the lock, not stamped and had a .729" bore.

 

[simonbeans]

Both of these 1970s Navy Arms muskets have a .690 bore and shoot a Lyman .678 ball very well.

 

[Fire-Steel]

I have an older Chaleville musket made my Mikoru. It has the two piece stock. Owned it a long time. Found out when I dissasem led it to refinish the peeling varnish and smooth out a few rough places.

 

[Rockvillerich]

I have two of these with the same joining under the rear band. One has a walnut stock, is marked "Dixie Gun Works", S.N. 3590, the other is some hardwood I couldn't identify, and is marked Navy Arms. Both work well and, after a little cosmetic reworking, look good too.

Both of these 1970s Navy Arms muskets have a .690 bore and shoot a Lyman .678 ball very well.

Both of these 1970s Navy Arms muskets have a .690 bore and shoot a Lyman .678 ball very well.

 

[toot]

I don't have a CHARLIVILE but I have 4 BROWN BESS MUSKETS made by MOROKU and they all have one piece stocks.

 

[FlinterNick]

Hello All.

Does anyone remember if the EARLY Navy Arms model made in Japan was a one or two piece stock ?
Something in the back of my memory says it was a two-piece (?)
Thanks for any help.

Rick

Those were made by Miruko of Japan; very nice design too.

The stock was two pieces; with the forestock pegged and epoxied to the forearm at the rear band.

Pedersoli’s 1766 is actually a 1763 pattern; much heavier and larger all around.

 

[Fire-Steel]

Does anyone know the size of the threaded end of a Mikoru Charleville musket?
I knew at one time. However that was a long time ago.
Time is not your friend.

 

[FlinterNick]

Does anyone know the size of the threaded end of a Mikoru Charleville musket?
I knew at one time. However that was a long time ago.
Time is not your friend.

What do you mean by end ? End of what ? The rammer I believe is standard 10-32.

 

[Fire-Steel]

Of course the threaded end. I tried a 10x32 and it would not seat against the bottom. I am thinking it might be Metric.
I did replace the Philips screws in the buttplate. Looked tacky.

 

[Fire-Steel]

I had a friend text me the answer . 5.8mm.
Guess that Track and Log Cabin have adapters to 10x32
Thanks.

 

[FlinterNick]

I had a friend text me the answer . 5.8mm.
Guess that Track and Log Cabin have adapters to 10x32
Thanks.

Yea I was gona say that that TROW might have them.

Also check Nurmich Arms, SS Firearms and Quarter Master General and Townsend and Sons, they sometimes have older Japanese made products.

 

[Fire-Steel]

Thanks for the info. Nurmich is a good place but hit and miss.
I Am not familiar with S&S or Quarter Master. Will definitely look at those.
Totally forgot about Track. They do have the odd accessory from time to time.
Appreciate the effort from all who tried to help an old shooter and collector.