18 and 19th centurys way of making knives?

[jrbaker90]

How would people of the 18th and 19th centuries marked knives like how would they cut the edge? I know today we use angle grinder and belt grind to do it but I been wondering how they would've done it back then. I'm sorry if I posted in the wrong forum

 

[crockett]

I know a fair amount- what exactly do you want to know? Most blades were forged.

 

[omarick1948]

First off! I'm no knife expert, but I think that most of the blades were forged and some made by metal removal. The Blacksmith would heat and forge the blades to the desired shape and then used a grinding wheel, stones and just plain elbow grease and do the finishing work for the metal. Files go back a long way and I'm sure they were a valuable tool to have and expensive. __ Now if your talking about Damascus blades. Your are talking about another highly specialized process.

Rick

 

[jrbaker90]

Mostly how would they have shaped the blade and shaped the cutting edge thanks

 

[omarick1948]

By what I said. Heat forged or to put it simpler. Heat the metal red hot and pound the metal on the edge to draw out and thin with an anvil and hammer.

 

[LRB]

If factory made, they would be forged to shape with water powered hammers, then finished on large diameter stone wheels. These wheels were often 6' or more in diameter and often turned in a water bath on the under side. It was dangerous work as these wheels sometimes broke killing or maiming the worker. Those made by a local smith would be hand forged with much of the finishing filed and then more or less polished on a peddle powered wheel much smaller than the factories used, or by hand polishing with stones. Going by surviving records, black smiths did not make a lot of knives. The imports were too cheap to compete with.

 

[crockett]

Yes, what I was thinking is how knives were made in Sheffield, England. The great majority of knives used in North America prior to say 1840 were imported from Sheffield. There are museums there you can visit and learn about the trade. If I recall the first factory was built around the 1820's. By "factory" I mean one establishment that did the entire process, made the blade, the fittings, and assembled the knife. Prior to that time the work was divided among specialists. Some made the steel (Iron was often from Sweden from which steel was made in Sheffield). Blades were forged. Massive tilt hammers were used for this forging- a drop or two and the blade was done. Then off to the shops with the big stone grinding wheels, then if a better grade blade- polished on the leather covered wheels coated with a crocus (sic?) polishing type compound. The handles were made else where. The "cutlers" were the craftsman that assembled all the parts.
A large order was often obtained and the work farmed out to various shops. The man that got the order had his stamp mark put on the blade, so...you might have a blade stamped Furnis that was forged in a Nowill shop. Nowill had a Furnis stamp and stamped the blade Furnis. This explains in part why knives often have stamp marks that look slightly different as to lettering or spelling (Furniss, Furnis, Furnes, Etc.)
Please realize I am giving you a very brief outline, exceptions always exist. It is a pretty complex topic all in all- but I've found it fascinating.
Knife Expert Bernard Levine has also translated the "Art of the Cutler" from French to English. This massive three volume work published in 1776 gave a complete description on how to set up the shop and every detail of the manufacturing process. I have read bits of this work but reading the whole thing is on my "to do" list.
We also have the "homespun" knives made here in North America. They are important to be sure but as has been said, the great majority of knives came from Sheffield. Sheffield was the knife making capital of the world and if I recall correctly I think Bernard Levine said over half the Sheffield production by around 1860 was going to North America. A good portion of that was pocket/folding knives.

 

[BillinOregon]

I'd love to read a good history of the Sheffield blade makers.

 

[crockett]

This book has a lot of post 1840 information but also pre-1840. I'd only buy a copy if I could get a good deal on the book. (Like $15-20) http://www.amazon.com/The-Sheffield-Knife-Book-Collectors/dp/1874718113
Most of the information I have is a "little bit from here and a little bit from there".
Hanson's "Fur Trade Cutlery Sketchbook" is very good. With all due respect to the author he is slightly wrong on a few stamp marks but generally it is an excellent source.

 

[satx78247]

"Sheffield was the knifemaking capitol of the world." = That's undoubtedly true IF you are talking only about QUANITY rather than QUALITY.
(Toledo was justly famous for FINE blades & your assertion disregards many places that made BEAUTIFUL blades in Asia.)

yours, satx