"1806" .69 Baker?

[Alden]

So, why WOULDN'T I buy a custom American-made "1806" Baker Rifle in .69 caliber!?

 

[robinghewitt]

I do not know :idunno:

Why would you not buy a custom American-made "1806" Baker Rifle in .69 calibre?

Pray enlighten us.

 

[Alden]

Other than that it is "British" you mean? This isn't a riddle brave Sir Robin.

I dunno... It is an "1806" in .69.

 

[strato50]

...I've been searching, nay, HOPING that a rifled .69 Baker would find it's way here in the under $800 category...

One can dream.

 

[robinghewitt]

...I've been searching, nay, HOPING that a rifled .69 Baker

Is this a standard Baker calibre? According to his book only 20 gauge, 0.625" is worth making, but the first Baker I shot was loaded with a .50" ball and I hit the target at 100 yards so it wasn't loose.

Someone was selling original Baker balls on ebay with the leather wrap still in place. I bought some but they were too big for my Baker so I sent them back. Wonder if they were for this .69" rifle? I kept one, think it is in the patch box, have to measure it, could it be 16g :idunno: :thumbsup:

 

[Alden]

That's why I'm posting this. No Baker expert I, I think they stopped making .69 bores when they launched the (is it third?), patriarchal, "1806" model in the series of .62. So such a .69 is probably a bit of an anachronism. But I didn't want to lead the discussion.

Anyone else!?

Suppose this he-man's rifle will keep my defarbed U.S. Model 1842 .69 Rifled Musket company at the very least...

 

[pargent]

All Baker's were .62 cal. Perhaps the person who asked for the build wanted it to be .69 cal. for his own reasons or it is .62 cal. and has been incorrectly listed .

 

[BrownBear]

All Baker's were .62 cal.

Huh. Could have sworn they were 69's. I know the first one that caught my eye years ago here on the site was a 69.

 

[pargent]

The EIC type 2 Baker rifles (percussion lock) were made with a 2 grove barrel
These are post 1840.

 

[Dphar]

There were 100 Pattern 1810 musket bore infantry rifles made. Dewitt Bailey states its the most mysterious of the Baker series.
According to Baily they are 70 caliber, rectangular rifling, 7 grooves and 1/4 turn in the 30 1/2" barrel.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

See Bailey's "British Military Flintlock Rifles" has a lot of info on Baker rifles and loads etc.

Dan

 

[pargent]

That's one I don't have

 

[Wes/Tex]

Checked through quite a few sources and the most info comes from British sources that say the Whitechapel gunmaker, Ezekiel Baker got the invitation to the competition due to relationship with the Prince Regent, whatever that's worth. His original submission were musket sized and musket bored (.775) and were dropped like a hot rock. He was given a German jaeger rifle and told to make something like this Zeke! The accepted gun was shorter and of 'carbine-bore' of .625" and a 30 inch barrel with 7 grooves, with a twist of 1 turn in 10 feet (which was 1/4 turn in the barrel's length). Once accepted, 800 rifles were ordered in March, 1800, through various gunmakers in London and Birmingham for issue to the 95th, later the Rifle Regiment. Before the Napoleonic Wars were over, the Baker rifle was in use by the 95th, some skirmishers of the Light Regiments, the 60th (Royal Americans), and the light companies of the King's German Legion. In addition, Portuguese rifle companies of the Cazadores which were basically their Light troops. 20 years later the rifles showed up in the hands of Santa Anna's light troops (Cazadors, chasseurs, riflemen...take your pick) and after San Jacinto the records show that among the captured weapons were "jaegers with sabers", the description of baker Rifles and their sword bayonets...and we're back to jaegers!

I'd have to say that a .69 Baker was either a special modern project or an incorrect bore measurement.

 

[pargent]

Made for trials !

 

[strato50]

Ah, for whatever reason I was sure the smoothbore Baker's sold by DG/MilitaryHeritage/Spencer's Mercantile were of .69cal, they are in fact .62

They still advertise that a rifled .62 is available from an American barrel manufacturer, so that might almost alleviate some of the 'oh no not an Indian!" concerns

 

[robinghewitt]

Checked through quite a few sources and the most info comes from British sources that say the Whitechapel gunmaker, Ezekiel Baker got the invitation

Did you try Baker's Remarks on the Rifle?

Zeke is a bit full of himself but comes across as a fanatical tester.

 

[Alden]

Bailey's book is on my coffee (or "tea" Sir Robin) table at this moment. As I had generally understood it heretofore they were .69 caliber through the first two series. I had seen Musket Bore Baker Rifle references but never quite knew what that meant -- I knew they never made a .75 like its contemporary, the Brown Bess.

I also didn't know specifically about the 1810 run of .69 caliber "1806's" just in time for The War of 1812 but that's apparently the provenance here.

:thumbsup:

 

[Wes/Tex]

According to the English source, Baker's first submission was a 'musket-bore' sized gun with a very heavy barrel that was rejected as too cumbersome for military use. The story they told was that ole Zeke was given a German jaeger rifle and told to try making something like that...which, obviously he did. The 800 contracted pieces were contracted out to London & Birmingham gunsmiths for production. I'd always thought Baker was responsible for the production, guess that's not true. Ahywho, the Rifles were issued with the pig skin wrapped balls shown above, lube with an unknown lube that mice like to chew on...giving the impression it's animal fat of some sort, probably mutton.

 

[Dphar]

A rifle that used an issue ball for the Brown Bess would be .030" or .050" smaller in the bore than the musket.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

...I've been searching, nay, HOPING that a rifled .69 Baker would find it's way here in the under $800 category...

One can dream.

Thats about what the parts would cost if the wood was common Black Walnut.

Dan