1860 Army

[Stantheman86]

The Colts are Uberti parts assembled by Colt. Or in some cases ASM parts.

Colt hasn't made new "from scratch " percussion revolvers since the 1870s, the Colts are nicely done though. I believe the 1st Gens were raw unfinished parts from Uberti that were totally heat treated and fitted by Colt staff, which is why they're so nice. Others have more info but I think by the 3rd Gen Colt was simply buying complete Uberti and ASM revolvers. Armi San Marco actually got sued trying to sell some "leftover " Colt address guns .

I used to be in the "Pietta is junk " club but I recently bought my first one in over 10 years, a .36 brass frame Navy and it was very , very well fitted with no short arbor issue. Action times perfectly. I may have to get a steel frame Navy from Pietta now.

Selection is limited with Italian factories being on skeleton crews because of COVID plus all the panic buying, so I'd snap up a Pietta 1860 if you can find one. Their "Old Silver" line looks neat.

My only big gripe now with Pietta is the huge, deep laser engraved print on the sides of the barrel.......Uberti makes a better attempt to hide it.

 

[Bad Karma]

1st generation were manufactured by Colt. 2nd gen forgings came from Uberti but were milled finished and assembled here by Colt. 3rd gen were similar but more machine work was done in Italy. Those are the broad strokes but Jim, @sourdough has the details...

and speaking of Jim, thanks so much for posting the Centaure... like I needed to see that...

I regularly shoot the Second Gen 1860’s. They’re very nice.

 

[springfield art]

I am looking for a 1860 Army. I know the 2nd gen colts are the best but a bit pricey if ya ask me what else?

My older ASM (Armi San Marco) is a real quality piece. They were absorbed by Uberti, but if you find one, it's a winner!

 

[springfield art]

The Colts are Uberti parts assembled by Colt. Or in some cases ASM parts.

Colt hasn't made new "from scratch " percussion revolvers since the 1870s, the Colts are nicely done though. I believe the 1st Gens were raw unfinished parts from Uberti that were totally heat treated and fitted by Colt staff, which is why they're so nice. Others have more info but I think by the 3rd Gen Colt was simply buying complete Uberti and ASM revolvers. Armi San Marco actually got sued trying to sell some "leftover " Colt address guns .

I used to be in the "Pietta is junk " club but I recently bought my first one in over 10 years, a .36 brass frame Navy and it was very , very well fitted with no short arbor issue. Action times perfectly. I may have to get a steel frame Navy from Pietta now.

Selection is limited with Italian factories being on skeleton crews because of COVID plus all the panic buying, so I'd snap up a Pietta 1860 if you can find one. Their "Old Silver" line looks neat.

My only big gripe now with Pietta is the huge, deep laser engraved print on the sides of the barrel.......Uberti makes a better attempt to hide it. View attachment 58528

I don't recall the exact title, but there's a site somewhere that details all the info about the Colt 3rd gens. Busts a lot of rumors and misinformation. The guys behind them, etc.

 

[Billy Boy]

Did you REALLY need to show me that?

Am I the only one who hears the voices?

 

[Whitworth]

I got hold of an old ASM 1860 a while back and sold my Pietta Army. The ASM grip fit my hand better than the Pietta whose grip was fatter. The new/used Colt Navy has trimmer grips than either my 2018 Pietta or 1965 Uberti 1851 Navy. The 1965 Uberti comes the closest to the original slim grip. One brand may feel better in your hand as grip frame flare and grip thickness vary from maker to maker. Right now you may not have much choice to choose from sadly.

 

[sourdough]

1st generation were manufactured by Colt. 2nd gen forgings came from Uberti but were milled finished and assembled here by Colt. 3rd gen were similar but more machine work was done in Italy. Those are the broad strokes but Jim, @sourdough has the details...

I don't own a single COLT revolver (1st, 2nd, 3rd, et al Gen) primarily because of the exorbitant prices they command, but Eric Deaton has just released a new book about the 20th Century revolvers with lots of good info. I have a copy so I invite you to check it out. Here is his recent thread:

New Colt Blackpowder Revolver book out by Eric Deaton | Colt Forum

and speaking of Jim, thanks so much for posting the Centaure... like I needed to see that...

I knew you would like that listing. I was toying with the idea of bidding on it but I am working on another unrelated revolver purchase.

Regards,

Jim

 

[sourdough]

My older ASM (Armi San Marco) is a real quality piece. They were absorbed by Uberti, but if you find one, it's a winner!

Sorry, but that is not correct. ASM did, as you state, manufacture some very nice revolvers in many historical versions from the 60's to the mid-90's, but found it could not compete with Uberti (primarily) and Pietta. There was some sort of familial relationship with Aldo Uberti and a supposed niece who was in ASM management (I have no documentation). ASM devolved into trying to sell non-C&B revolvers like 1873 Army, et al, cartridge guns under another name, failed miserably, and closed their doors ~2002 just when Uberti and Pietta went to CNC machining. The remaining C&B revolvers in stock were sold to EMF, while all parts stocks were sold to VTI, Track Of The Wolf, and a couple others. These days ASM parts are nearly non-existent, part stocks having been bought out to repair extant revolvers.

I have an ASM 1860 Army .44 round engraved cylinder (BD/1994) that I bought used over 2 years ago. It functions perfectly, but I wanted a full-fluted cylinder for it, and ASM did indeed manufacture those back in the day. After a few months of investigation about cylinder sizes I settled upon the chance of an Uberti cylinder fitting it (Pietta cylinders were too long). Lo and behold, the Uberti cylinder (new 2018 CNC) fit within .002" in length, diameter, and internal diameters. As an aside, I think new Uberti internal parts (hand/spring, bolt, trigger/bolt spring, trigger, and mainspring) would work as replacement parts with a bit of fitting for an ASM.

At the same time I procured a cased set Pietta 1851 Navy .36 with an awesome maple tiger-stripe shoulder stock and accoutrements. I had to do a bit of repairs to all of the loose internal dividers, which worked out well. The Navy would not fit the stock J-hook/housing correctly so out came the Navy and in went the ASM 1860 Army.

You be the judge:

Regards,

Jim

 

[springfield art]

Sorry, but that is not correct. ASM did, as you state, manufacture some very nice revolvers in many historical versions from the 60's to the mid-90's, but found it could not compete with Uberti (primarily) and Pietta. There was some sort of familial relationship with Aldo Uberti and a supposed niece who was in ASM management (I have no documentation). ASM devolved into trying to sell non-C&B revolvers like 1873 Army, et al, cartridge guns under another name, failed miserably, and closed their doors ~2002 just when Uberti and Pietta went to CNC machining. The remaining C&B revolvers in stock were sold to EMF, while all parts stocks were sold to VTI, Track Of The Wolf, and a couple others. These days ASM parts are nearly non-existent, part stocks having been bought out to repair extant revolvers.

I have an ASM 1860 Army .44 round engraved cylinder (BD/1994) that I bought used over 2 years ago. It functions perfectly, but I wanted a full-fluted cylinder for it, and ASM did indeed manufacture those back in the day. After a few months of investigation about cylinder sizes I settled upon the chance of an Uberti cylinder fitting it (Pietta cylinders were too long). Lo and behold, the Uberti cylinder (new 2018 CNC) fit within .002" in length, diameter, and internal diameters. As an aside, I think new Uberti internal parts (hand/spring, bolt, trigger/bolt spring, trigger, and mainspring) would work as replacement parts with a bit of fitting for an ASM.

At the same time I procured a cased set Pietta 1851 Navy .36 with an awesome maple tiger-stripe shoulder stock and accoutrements. I had to do a bit of repairs to all of the loose internal dividers, which worked out well. The Navy would not fit the stock J-hook/housing correctly so out came the Navy and in went the ASM 1860 Army.

You be the judge:

View attachment 58570

Regards,

Jim

Thank you for the information! I did get my ASM from EMF! But it seems to be a good'un. Nice photo! Very good...

 

[Whitworth]

That stock is beautiful.

 

[sourdough]

I did get my ASM from EMF! But it seems to be a good'un.

I have always had a fancy for ASM revolvers. I am curious about yours: what is the date code?

Later ASM revolvers (70's and onward) concentrated the date code, proof marks, serial number in a small area on the bottom front of the frame near the barrel lug.

This is a photo of an ASM 1849 Pocket, but it is the same as the other ASM revolvers insofar as the nomenclature is concerned. The left arrow points to the ASM logo. The right arrow points to a two letter date code in a rectangle. The other markings are two proof marks and the SN.

This is the Italian date code chart..

Regards,

Jim

 

[Bad Karma]

1st generation were manufactured by Colt. 2nd gen forgings came from Uberti but were milled finished and assembled here by Colt. 3rd gen were similar but more machine work was done in Italy. Those are the broad strokes. Jim

I don't own a single COLT revolver (1st, 2nd, 3rd, et al Gen) primarily because of the exorbitant prices they command, but Eric Deaton has just released a new book about the 20th Century revolvers with lots of good info. I have a copy so I invite you to check it out. Here is his recent thread:

New Colt Blackpowder Revolver book out by Eric Deaton | Colt Forum



I knew you would like that listing. I was toying with the idea of bidding on it but I am working on another unrelated revolver purchase.

Regards,

Jim

I predict it will go for more than I am willing to pay for it but who knows? I may find that I’m willing to pay more than I think I am today... I wouldn’t mind having another Centaure or two. If I can find a keeper.

there are two of the Butterfield commemoratives on GB right now too. The one I have is a shooter and I paid about half what they’re asking for those. One of them is listed for the exact price Colt listed them for back in the 70’s. They don’t all appreciate...

 

[Bad Karma]

I don't own a single COLT revolver (1st, 2nd, 3rd, et al Gen) primarily because of the exorbitant prices they command, but Eric Deaton has just released a new book about the 20th Century revolvers with lots of good info. I have a copy so I invite you to check it out. Here is his recent thread:

New Colt Blackpowder Revolver book out by Eric Deaton | Colt Forum



I knew you would like that listing. I was toying with the idea of bidding on it but I am working on another unrelated revolver purchase.

Regards,

Jim

Sent. Looks like a great book! Thanks for bringing it to our attention!

 

[Bad Karma]

1st generation were manufactured by Colt. 2nd gen forgings came from Uberti but were milled finished and assembled here by Colt. 3rd gen were similar but more machine work was done in Italy. Those ar

Hmmmm.... I don't know about that. I shoot my Second Generation Colt 1860 regularly, and it is holding up very well. I consider the Colt made products to be the top of the heap, with the Belgian made Centaure a possible tie. Uberti is also very good, and the current Piettas are probably equal to the Ubertis.View attachment 58503
View attachment 58504
View attachment 58505

Beautiful!

 

[wb78963]

A brand new gun either Uberti or Pietta is still a fully assembled kit. My gunsmith prefers Pietta because they seem to be a little better assembled but still have c*ap nipples and will take some polishing .
Remember they are not put together by gunsmiths like the old original Colt and Remington, but people who simply put parts together.
Not a slam at them and if you want to pay $100 more that can be arranged. Or do it your self because mostly it is just a couple of hours polishing and replacing the c*ap nipples with Slixshot.
I hate to rain on anyone's parade but knowledgeable sources say those new generation Colt revolvers are mostly made from Uberti parts finished out here in USA.
Hold Center
Bunk.

 

[Whitworth]

From my readings the second gen Colts used 3 Italian parts: rough barrels, grip frames and loading levers finished here by Colt. The 3rd gen were more or less complete guns finished here at the Iver Johnson plant under contract according to Colt's 124 page specifications. There's more info out there.

 

[Stantheman86]

Colt made 1st Gen percussion revolvers on their own tooling and machinery at the Colt plant ?

 

[Bad Karma]

Colt made 1st Gen percussion revolvers on their own tooling and machinery at the Colt plant ?

1st generation would be revolvers manufactured in the percussion/early cartridge era.

 

[Stantheman86]

1st generation would be revolvers manufactured in the percussion/early cartridge era.

For the purposes of the recent Colts they're "2nd Gen"? The Rough parts from Italy fitted and finished by Colt?

 

[Bad Karma]

Yes, that’s correct, second gen were rough castings finished here and the third gen. (Signature series) were more completely finished prior to assembly here. I’m pretty stoked about Eric’s book. I’m sure to learn a lot about the Colts second and third generations!