1860 Pietta Army Too Tight?

[PhilRich]

I just bought a 1860 Pietta "Yank" Army (steel frame) on sale at Cabelas for $209. It is nicely finished, however the cylinder is very tight, not having any play fore and aft nor radially on the notches. When raised in front of my bright computer screen there is no discernible light showing through whatever gap there is between the barrel and the cylinder. I've not attempted to disassembly the revolver yet.

There is a slight drag when turning the cylinder when on half cock indicating there is a high spot on the cylinder face.

Is this too tight for shooting blackpowder, or is it a good thing? This is my first percussion revolver.

Thanks,
Phil

 

[bubba.50]

loosen the wedge just a gnat's hair & see if that helps.

 

[MSW]

I think Bubba50 is on the right track, and i'd try his fix first.

there should be some gap between the front of the cylinder and the back of the barrel ... i cannot remember the correct gap ... someone help me here ... between .003 and .005 inches (a piece of copy paper is about .003) maybe a bit more? if you find out, you can check it with a feeler gauge - these can be had for a modest amount at any auto parts store, and they do come in handy.

there might be something in the instruction manual ... (i know: real men do not read manuals ... this is easy to fix: put your man card in a safe place, lock yourself in the bathroom, read the manual and TELL NO ONE - nobody. ever.)

if you shoot it and the cylinder is too tight, after one cylinder's (five or six shots) you will have enough fouling built up to hinder the little pawl which advances the cylinder each time you cock the revolver. if you force it, you will damage the mechanism and this will bring your revolver out of time.

therefore, this is a situation which should be addressed before you shoot the gun

good luck with your problem

 

[Larry Akers]

This is an indication that the spindle (the shaft the cylinder rotates on) is too short. It should bottom out in its recess under the barrel. At the correct length it should leave about .004" gap between the barrel and the cylinder and that gap will be very repeatable when the wedge is driven in. With careful measurement a shim can be made to extend the spindle to the correct length.

 

[MSW]

by the way, that's a great find ... if loosening the wedge doesn't get it done, here's a link i just now discovered ... kind long, but well written...
https://www.thehighroad.org/index....ylinder-gap-on-a-colt-type-bp-revolver.588340/

 

[MSW]

oops! ...

a better link:
https://www.thehighroad.org/index....ylinder-gap-on-a-colt-type-bp-revolver.588340/

 

[denster]

It sounds like you have a properly fit revolver. To check the B/C gap with these you need to ,with the hammer down, pull the cylinder towards the recoil shield and look for the gap. This is necessary because the percussion revolvers do not have a gas ring like later cartridge versions. This is also the reason why on half cock you feel a slight resistance when turning the cylinder because the tension from the hand pushes the cylinder forward.
Another point regarding B/C gap fouling on the face of the cylinder is never the problem. What can be a problem is to much gap allowing an excess of fouling to accumulate on the arbor and bind the cylinder.

 

[MSW]

still a bad link ... my apologies ... try "WWW." followed by "thehighroad" followed by ".org/index." followed by "php?threads/adjusting-cylinder-gap-on-a-colt-type-bp-revolver.588340/"

also, you should put some lube in front of the ball after you load it. i use lithium grease, but there are probably as many lubes as there are shooters. i'm sure that many folks get good use out of Crisco, but i'd avoid it in warmer weather... i have also seen packing grease used, as well as some commercially available greases and some 'magic concoctions' by which their makers swear fervently ... tinkering with such things is, to my mind, half the fun.

At any rate, good luck!

 

[PhilRich]

It sounds like you have a properly fit revolver. To check the B/C gap with these you need to ,with the hammer down, pull the cylinder towards the recoil shield and look for the gap. This is necessary because the percussion revolvers do not have a gas ring like later cartridge versions. This is also the reason why on half cock you feel a slight resistance when turning the cylinder because the tension from the hand pushes the cylinder forward.
Another point regarding B/C gap fouling on the face of the cylinder is never the problem. What can be a problem is to much gap allowing an excess of fouling to accumulate on the arbor and bind the cylinder.

First I removed the barrel and swabbed out the liberal amount of oil in the cylinder and barrel and then put it back together taking care not to drive the wedge in too tight. There is now a very slight barrel gap visible using the method above. This gun is very tight. I'm going to go ahead and shoot it and see what the fouling buildup is like. I use real black powder.

Thanks for the replies!

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Am of in agreement with

45 Dragoon (I forget his real name) at Goon's Gun Works sets his cylinder gaps very tight on Colt percussion guns.

He did up an Uberti Navy for me and it worked very nicely.

OP, get out and shoot the dang thing and report back. You might be just fine.

 

[Flintlock_bob]

I too keep a very tight gap on my Uberti 1860 Colt, never have problems with fowling binding the cylinder.

 

[Wes/Tex]

Old Colt specs called for a gap of .006 to .008 on percussion revolvers but this was their specific recommendations. As long as it doesn't exceed .010 there shouldn't be a problem.

 

[PhilRich]

I don't have the feeler gage to check, but I'd say if anything the gap is not more than .003. I will shoot it and report back.

 

[Zonie]

If you need a reference, a sheet of "20 pound" printer paper is very close to .003 thick.

 

[M. De Land]

How well do the chambers line up with the bore?
A goose neck LED auto lamp down the muzzle will reveal alignment like nothing else.
With a clean unloaded revolver check each chamber from the muzzle in cock position. You should be able to see the tiny-est chamber mouth misalignment.

 

[PhilRich]

I took the "Army" to the range today - there were no problems with cylinder rotation due to fouling. However it was only reloaded twice. Groups weren't all that great. It shoots 8 in high at 25 yds, looks like groups will be around 3 inch or so. More work on that is needed.

I noticed that it absolutely shreds the caps - is this to be expected?

Now- off to clean up the blackpowder residue.

 

[Flintlock]

I think the majority of cap and ball revolvers shoot real high like that. If I remember right, military thinking at the time said that they (the revolvers) should be sighted in for 100yards. Playing with the loads might tighten up your group. I always aim at the bottom edge of what I'm shooting at with my Colt replica's.
Great price by the way.

 

[azmntman]

I took the "Army" to the range today - there were no problems with cylinder rotation due to fouling. However it was only reloaded twice. Groups weren't all that great. It shoots 8 in high at 25 yds, looks like groups will be around 3 inch or so. More work on that is needed.

I noticed that it absolutely shreds the caps - is this to be expected?

Now- off to clean up the blackpowder residue.

3 inches is not bad at all...you just started tweaking it!

 

[Wes/Tex]

I took the "Army" to the range today - there were no problems with cylinder rotation due to fouling. However it was only reloaded twice. Groups weren't all that great. It shoots 8 in high at 25 yds, looks like groups will be around 3 inch or so. More work on that is needed.

I noticed that it absolutely shreds the caps - is this to be expected?

Now- off to clean up the blackpowder residue.

Some whiz-bang in ordnance decided troopers sidearms needed to be sighted in for 75 yards and copies follow suit. In a cavalry melee it was just point where he's biggest and rip one off! :wink: