1862 police/colt style revolvers...how slick?

[Ed C.]

I dragged myself into the cafe one morning, on my way back from the vet’s office and I’d been up most of the night with calving heifers. I sat down at the bar for some coffee and Arturo’s huevos rancheros and the waitress flicked a bit of cow manure off of my jacket with the remark, “Boy, the life of a cowboy sure is romantic…” Here’s to the boys who make it work… I’d rather be a wealthy cattleman myself.

I should have said a TV cowboy. Shooting silver dollars out of the sky, hanging out with Miss Kitty and Doc Holiday.

 

[PastorB]

I just got an 1862 pocket police from uberti yesterday... this is my first colt style revolvers. I slicked it up a little but the cylinder doesn't really free spin on half **** that much. If i have the barrel off and the cylinder isnt touching the hand it spins well but once It is put back together and the hand is engaged it barely spins. It Is not leaving a ring on the cylinder.. I have an 1858, my only other revolver...and that cylinder spins like the wheel of fortune. The cylinder isn't rubbing the barrel, I checked that. Am I expecting too much or is there something in particular I should focus on?

If your Pocket Police is like any other Uberti Pocket Model (1849, Wells Fargo, 1862 Police and Navy) the spinning of the cylinder will be small potatoes compared to the other problems you will encounter. Unless they have gotten better, you will be buying replacement nipples and installing a heavier mainspring to make your revolver function. Cap jams with the stock factory gun are an every shot occurrence. As I said, it can be mitigated with aftermarket parts. But for what they sell for, it should be more than a "gun kit" that you gotta tweak and spend money on to make it function somewhat reliably. Wish I had known how bad they were before I purchased mine. My first was a 1849 Pocket, thought I just got a lemon. My second, a 1862 Police, also came from Midway, and was even worse than the Pocket Model. I was talked into buying a third, a 1862 Pocket Navy, by the guy at my LGS. He assured me his guns were of higher quality than the ones sold by the big distributors. He said those were made cheaply to sell at a certain price, but the ones he sold had better QC. I got took again. I still have all three, and they are somewhat reliable now, but only after spending a lot more money on an already expensive gun. My full size revolvers, of which I have many, I run stock, and am very pleased with them, whether Pietta or Uberti.

 

[Blackpowderart]

Will find out tomorrow... i already an extra set of treso nipples lying around...I purchased a colt Saa main spring to custom fit if need be, but the stock one feels pretty strong and doesn't appear to be any different than the one I purchased other than length being a 1/4 inch longer. What I had thought was a stiff action was actually just the spring as I found out when I was deburring. Fingers crossed but I am prepared to install a cap rake if necessary. Already fixed the short arbor. I am mentally prepared to take actions needed to facilitate a smooth shooter. Time will tell.

 

[Bad Karma]

I should have said a TV cowboy. Shooting silver dollars out of the sky, hanging out with Miss Kitty and Doc Holiday.

Hmmm. I wonder if it’s too late? I could play the cranky, busted up old codger easy!!

 

[Ed C.]

Hmmm. I wonder if it’s too late? I could play the cranky, busted up old codger easy!!

They are the best and the baddest!

 

[Pierre009]

They are the best and the baddest!

And all I got to do is act naturally...

 

[ernbar]

If your Pocket Police is like any other Uberti Pocket Model (1849, Wells Fargo, 1862 Police and Navy) the spinning of the cylinder will be small potatoes compared to the other problems you will encounter. Unless they have gotten better, you will be buying replacement nipples and installing a heavier mainspring to make your revolver function. Cap jams with the stock factory gun are an every shot occurrence. As I said, it can be mitigated with aftermarket parts. But for what they sell for, it should be more than a "gun kit" that you gotta tweak and spend money on to make it function somewhat reliably. Wish I had known how bad they were before I purchased mine. My first was a 1849 Pocket, thought I just got a lemon. My second, a 1862 Police, also came from Midway, and was even worse than the Pocket Model. I was talked into buying a third, a 1862 Pocket Navy, by the guy at my LGS. He assured me his guns were of higher quality than the ones sold by the big distributors. He said those were made cheaply to sell at a certain price, but the ones he sold had better QC. I got took again. I still have all three, and they are somewhat reliable now, but only after spending a lot more money on an already expensive gun. My full size revolvers, of which I have many, I run stock, and am very pleased with them, whether Pietta or Uberti.

Well I guess I got lucky with Midway cause all 5 BP pistols I have have been fine including the Pocket Police. Outside of replacing the stock nipples with Slixshots and adding an action cover on the hammer the pocket police runs just fine, no complaints. I think it’s hit or miss with these pistols out of the box. My 1873 Uberti SA I recently got from Midway came in a Cimarron box and runs like a Rolls Royce, love the 4 click hammer.

 

[PastorB]

Well I guess I got lucky with Midway cause all 5 BP pistols I have have been fine including the Pocket Police. Outside of replacing the stock nipples with Slixshots and adding an action cover on the hammer the pocket police runs just fine, no complaints. I think it’s hit or miss with these pistols out of the box. My 1873 Uberti SA I recently got from Midway came in a Cimarron box and runs like a Rolls Royce, love the 4 click hammer.

You are indeed fortunate. Watch this video, especially the last couple of minutes, and you will see the disgust Mike has for the Pocket Police. His experience mirrors mine, and every other person that I know who owns one of these guns. Yes, mine are mostly reliable now, but miffed that I had to replace all the nipples and mainsprings, plus polish parts just to get a usable gun. I didn't realize I was purchasing a gun kit that required assembly and after market parts to get a brand new revolver to function. We would never put up with that if purchasing a modern firearm, but seem to be ok with it on our cap and ball repros. My full size revolvers, both Uberti's and Pietta's, work just fine out of the box. I have no complaints whatsoever with them and have never replaced any parts to get them to function.

 

[45D]

Filling the safety notch isn't a fix.
A cap post wouldn't have allowed the cap to stay in the hammer slot.
Knowing how and what to fix turns these revolvers into rather nice / reliable shooters . . . I've done many. I personally am not fond of any 31cal revolvers, the "62 Police is as small as I'd ever go.

Mike

 

[Uncle Miltie]

Mike's ability to fire a percussion revolver does not impress me. He loads from a flask, and has no idea how to properly tilt the revolver so the cap can fall free of the action when pulling back the hammer for the next shot.

 

[Blackpowderart]

Why anyone who shoots percussion revolvers doesn't "usually" accompany them with paper cartritges seems to be wasting range time.

 

[Bad Karma]

Mike's ability to fire a percussion revolver does not impress me. He loads from a flask, and has no idea how to properly tilt the revolver so the cap can fall free of the action when pulling back the hammer for the next shot.

I load from a flask most of the time. I don’t flick the revolver or tip it or any other gymnast moves. I have cap posts on two revolvers because the tuners both included them as part of their tuning package. I only use Remington 10’s on properly fitted cones and don’t have troubles with caps falling into the action. Your mileage may vary…

 

[M. De Land]

I just got an 1862 pocket police from uberti yesterday... this is my first colt style revolvers. I slicked it up a little but the cylinder doesn't really free spin on half **** that much. If i have the barrel off and the cylinder isnt touching the hand it spins well but once It is put back together and the hand is engaged it barely spins. It Is not leaving a ring on the cylinder.. I have an 1858, my only other revolver...and that cylinder spins like the wheel of fortune. The cylinder isn't rubbing the barrel, I checked that. Am I expecting too much or is there something in particular I should focus on?

I can't think of a gun (rifle, hand gun or shot gun) I've ever owned in my life that I was satisfied with in the received condition. All of them need a personalizing touch in one way or another to make them fit what I want in a fire arm.
I have both Pietta and Uberti revolvers and feel both deliver arms that with some informed, quality work, can produce match grade guns for target work. I'm more in the accuracy and longevity camp than speed work which require some different areas of attention detailing like barrel lapping and cylinder mouth reaming.
Some work will actually produce improvement in a guns accuracy and longevity and other things make one feel better about dotting and "I" or crossing a "T" in supposed necessities but as long as no safety issues are negated it is all good !
I've always been of the opinion that correcting a short arbor is a good practice if desired but not a necessity for either accuracy or longevity. The reasoning is because of personal experience over many years in my own guns as well as observance of many others .
The simple truth is a majority of open frame guns in use over the last 30-40 years have short arbors and work as well now as when new, many having digested multiple thousands of rounds.
Arbor end fit is a good thing for consistent and easy wedge depth gauging unless a soft wedge deforms over time and use. Some would argue that short arbor end fit is the reason for wedge distortion but I have never been able to see this proven to be true. I've had and seen a number of deformed ,apparently soft wedges over the years which is why I began to make my own. If a wedge deforms then one is right back to a short arbor situation only the deformity will no longer make a reliable depth gauge. This is the reason I like to rely on barrel gap measurement which is the surest way I know of to insure consistency and thus accuracy and longevity .
I do prefer to make my own wedges out of A-2 tool steel properly hardened as they will not change in the least over time and use. I make mine without the keep spring using only the trough and keep screw in the barrel to retain it. A new wedge as described ,properly fit both in thickness and width with the correct angle will not back out in use and work well with arbor depth fit or not.
I believe wedge thickness and fit to be every bit as important as width in holding it's place both in the arbor and barrel slots.
Making a new wedge is a time consuming thing and I would not do it for any but my own guns however any reliable machinest could easily make them if a detailed drawing is presented.

 

[Whitworth]

Why anyone who shoots percussion revolvers doesn't "usually" accompany them with paper cartritges seems to be wasting range time.

When you have your own range like Mike you can take your time I've made cartridges just for fun but the time invested to roll up 6 exceeds the time to charge and ram 6 balls home. And yes, like Mike I load a revolver from a flask too. YMMV

 

[45D]

I can't think of a gun (rifle, hand gun or shot gun) I've ever owned in my life that I was satisfied with in the received condition. All of them need a personalizing touch in one way or another to make them fit what I want in a fire arm.
I have both Pietta and Uberti revolvers and feel both deliver arms that with some informed, quality work, can produce match grade guns for target work. I'm more in accuracy and longevity camp than speed work.
Some work will actually produce improvement in a guns accuracy and longevity and other things make one feel better about dotting and "I" or crossing a "T" in supposed necessities but as long as no safety issues are negated it is all good !
I've always been of the opinion that correcting a short arbor is a good practice if desired but not a necessity for either accuracy or longevity. The reasoning is because of personal experience over many years in my own guns as well as observance of many others .
The simple truth is a majority of open frame guns in use over the last 30-40 years have short arbors and work as well now as when knew, many having digested multiple thousands of rounds.
Arbor end fit is a good thing for consistent and easy wedge depth gauging unless a soft wedge deforms over time and use. Some would argue that short arbor end fit is the reason for wedge distortion but I have never been able to see this proven to be true. I've had and seen a number of deformed ,apparently soft wedges over the years which is why I began to make my own. If a wedge deforms then one is right back to a short arbor situation only the deformity will no longer make a reliable depth gauge. This is the reason I like to rely on barrel gap measurement which is the surest way I know of to insure consistency and thus accuracy and longevity .
I do prefer to make my own wedges out of A-2 tool steel properly hardened as they will not change in the least over time and use. I make mine without the keep spring using only the trough and keep screw in the barrel to retain it. A new wedge as described ,properly fit both in thickness and width with the correct angle will not back out in use and work well with arbor depth fit or not.
I believe wedge thickness and fit to be every bit as important as width in holding it's place both in the arbor and barrel slots.

Well, that's an easy one for those that are willing to learn how a platform works rather than how they "think" or "wish" it works.

A lifetime of mouse fart loads may not destroy a belt pistol or a horse pistol but shooting full house loads definitely will. I know MY personal experience means nothing around here but that's beside the point. Other forums have discussed this for the last 13 yrs and you'd think folks here would know a little something about it . . . but it seems to be in a time warp.
That said, other than my personal shooting experience I would have to include that every original Colts OT I've ever worked on has an arbor that extended to the end of the arbor hole. I couldn't lock the cylinder up because the wedge was in "too far". That doesn't happen with them. It does happen with the fake ones we are accustomed to. Then there's this wedge from my '60 that I just added another 75 rounds to the count. This wedge is perfect and only has some bluing wear.

This is after 675 rounds of 21K PSI ammo including about a fourth of them being 23K PSI.
A Walker with 60gr charges of 3f and a round ball or max charges with a conical won't even get to half that pressure . . . and this is a '60 Army!!!

So, my Walker shooting full house loads ate wedges like candy back in day. Fix the "problem" and that goes away. I've only explained this for the millionth time but some are slow . . . so, I still try to help . . .

I'm sure my customers that shoot full house loads would have said something by now if their revolvers didn't perform perfectly!!

Mike

 

[Blackpowderart]

I fixed my short arbor, I knock it all
The way in, and now every time my gap is.004. The wedge doesn't back out, nor do I have to monitor it and try to gauge the depth. I've realized the colt are a different animal compared to the solid frames. I enjoy shooting it and tuning it if you will. I'm no gun smith, but am a mechanic and understanding things comes naturally, especially after a little direction. The short arbor fix "ONLY" makes sense. If you want the same gun time in and out this is the only repeatable way to aquire it without measuring each time you reassemble. That's why ypu need an alignment on your vehicle when you change parts, or disassemble adjustable parts. A wedge and short arbor is just that, an adjustable part....when you remove the wheels, no alignment is needed, only to torque the wheels to spec. Knocking my wedge all the way in is to torque the barrel in place if you will

 

[Uncle Miltie]

When you have your own range like Mike you can take your time I've made cartridges just for fun but the time invested to roll up 6 exceeds the time to charge and ram 6 balls home. And yes, like Mike I load a revolver from a flask too. YMMV

I know folks wanna be like Mike, but loading directly from a flask is not the safe way to do it: Folks really should know better.

 

[Whitworth]

I know folks wanna be like Mike, but loading directly from a flask is not the safe way to do it: Folks really should know better.

Sorry but I was loading from a flask way before I ever heard of Mike. Just use common sense.

 

[Bobby44]

Sorry but I was loading from a flask way before I ever heard of Mike. Just use common sense.

Agreed. When I got my first revolver I was measuring each load like in my rifles. Then I got a good flask and used it to fill the measure. WOW! Every time it filled the same. So why do that step? I fill and look - every time. For the rifles I premeasure like most folks because I can not see the powder level.

 

[Snydly]

Mike's ability to fire a percussion revolver does not impress me. He loads from a flask, and has no idea how to properly tilt the revolver so the cap can fall free of the action when pulling back the hammer for the next shot.

You need to watch all of his BP videos with BP pistols. He is very knowledgable and has altered his revolvers so as to not need to tilt them. I will take his advice over just about anyone else on revolvers or rifles.