50 RB? Need some encouragement!

[JerryToth]

Greetings all;

Only 56 days till the opening of the Early Muzzleloader Season for Whitetail Deer here in Pennsylvania!

I need some encouragement. I also need to hear some success stories of Whitetail Deer hunting with 50 caliber Roundball.

You see, here's my situation...

I own three muzzleloaders. The first is a T/C White Mountain Carbine with a 21" barrel rifled 1 in 30-something. This rifle is made for conicals and is my first frontstuffer and is the only muzzleloader I've harvested a deer with. I'm going to give it to my nephew's son in a few weeks. Yes, "give". It's a carbine and will fit the small lad perfectly. I'm hoping the boy will get started into a life of smokepoling and enjoy it even half as much as I do!

Also, I own a T/C New Englander with the typical 1:48 twist barrel. As much trouble as some fellows may have with 1:48 all put aside, I can get just about anything to shoot well through this rifle. Maybe it's just an exceptionally good barrel? I don't know. Anyway, I usually loan it out to someone thinking about getting started in ML. I have a buddy who is going to borrow it for this year all lined up already! (The guy who borrowed it last year bought his own and is now a happy front stuffer!)

All I will have left is my Early Lancaster, 50 caliber, with a Green Mountain 38" long, 1:70 roundball shootin' barrel. (I have my load/patching/lube all worked out and it's a good shooter.)

So I need encouraged. I need to be told that my heart's in the right place even if I'm losin' money on my give-and-loan habits. I need to be encouraged that it's good to get guys started in smokepolin'!

I also need to hear some good success stories, and all the tips you'll share, using a 50 cal roundball for the local 75 to 150 pound Whitetail. Since I've not hunted with Roundball, I'm a bit uncertain what happens at distances, what happens with quartering shots, and what charges have really worked.

I've read plenty of threads about whether a 45 will work, and a few about how devastating 58's and 62's are, but I've not seen as much discussion of the "common 50" using the roundball. I'd certainly appreciate all the experience of you 50RB hunters and I certainly need to learn all the "tricks" you'd be willing to share!

Thanks in advance,

Ironsights Jerry.

 

[bob1961]

main thing is to wait for the right shot and put it where it belongs....the best thing i try to do is think of it as having my bow in my hand....let them get as close as possible....i mean count there eye lashes close....my .50 T/C hawkens is doing 1.5" at 50 yds off of a rest as i will be doing that in the woods also....just wait and put it where it counts and you should not have any troubles....and the extra blood flow in your veins won't hurt the experience of being that close ::.........................bob

 

[roundball]

All I will have left is my Early Lancaster, 50 caliber, with a Green Mountain 38" long, 1:70 roundball shootin' barrel. (I have my load/patching/lube all worked out and it's a good shooter.)

You've got plenty of rifle right there...if you put it in the boiler room he'll go down quickly, usually in sight of the stand...enjoy!

 

[Whitesmoke]

"So I need encouraged. I need to be told that my heart's in the right place even if I'm losin' money on my give-and-loan habits. I need to be encouraged that it's good to get guys started in smokepolin'"


Iron sights: your heart is in the right place even if your losin' money on your give-and-loan habits. It's good to get guys started in smokepolin'

That being said, your a true sportsman and a generous man. I've given lots of stuff away to newbies, and somehow I always feel OK about doing it.

I've killed many deer with smokepole, but only two with RB. Both from my TC Hawken .50cal. Both deer were hit solid behind the shoulder within 50yds. Both deer went down fast, as inside 50yds. My understanding is that a RB has an incredible amount of shock. I have to wait till 10/21/04 for opening day in Md. Good luck too ya.

 

[tg]

I would agree that the .50 is plenty for deer, I like to limit my shots to 75 yds to insure plenty of punch when the ball gets there, if you push your limit to the max. there is always that deer just a bit farther and temptation can be overwhelming and the results unpleasant, Never feel bad about loaning/giving guns or gear to newcommers, I still have a CVA Kentucky and a Hawken by, huh, don't remember! and two bags of gear "out on loan " from 1999, I know the guys and don't need the guns, they will get their own when they can........the only stipulation I made was to use RB only..(VBG)

 

[cayugad]

Will a .50 caliber round ball drop a deer? :hmm: That's easy.. without a doubt!! Through the years, many deer have been taken with just such a projectile. As the others have pointed out, shot placement is most important. Good luck with the upcoming season...

 

[sabotloader]

Ironsights:

Will the 50 work? :imoag gone rights! if it is shot properly... The 50 hits with a ton (well not really but to the animal it feels like a ton) of energy in short ranges and is quite a force when hitting an animal..

There was a time in history when the military changed from shooting a 38 pistol to shooting a 45 for exactly that reason - They would shoot an insurgent with a 38 - he was dead, he was dead on his feet, but he kept on coming - well the 45 changed that when they hit someone with that slow moving bullet the shear force of that bullet would knock them off their feet - shooting a deer within the given range and in the sweet spot will have the same effect. When that round ball flattens out a bit then make its way through the hide into the vitals - gees thats quite a thump.... :relax:

 

[musketman]

I'm going to give it to my nephew's son in a few weeks. Yes, "give".

I did this with my .54 caliber Renagade flintlock, gave it to my nephew-in-law, good kid (then, adult now), I didn't need it once I got my brown Bess... :winking:

He still has it and has bagged many a deer with it...

There is nothing like starting a teen down the proper road of sportsmanship...

 

[Maynerd62411]

My bro-in-law "borrowed" my 12 guage shotgun in '93. He ain't getting his welder back that I "borrowed" until he returns it. :crackup:

 

[Huntinfool]

Hey Ironsights,

I taken 5 deer with a .490 rb in the last 2 years. 4 with my longrifle and 1 with my flint pistol 8" barrel with just 30 grs. of FFFg Swiss behind it. None of them went more than 20 or 25 yards.

That .50 cal will do excellent be sure and keep us informed as you take them with her! :thumbsup:

YMH&OS,
Chuck Goodall
The Original Huntin' Fool
&
Kanawha Ranger Scribe

 

[BrownBear]

I use a 54, but my three hunting partners use 50's- All TC Hawkens with RB barrels. I asked them, and between them they have taken over 50 of our Sitka blacktail deer in the last five years (We have a 5 deer limit). One of them lugs his 50 to Missouri to hunt whitetails each fall, and takes very large ones on the farms he has access to. He says it kills the big ones as well as it kills smaller Sitkas. Each of the three claims all his kills were one-shot, and kind of laugh at me for buying a 54. I'll be going out with them on a boat hunt for a few days in October, and none would consider using anything but their pet 50's. When I told them about your question, they said "Tell him to quit worrying about the size of the hole. Just make sure he pours lots of powder down it between now and hunting season."

 

[JerryToth]

Thanks guys!

I'm feeling a lot more confident about giving up my conicals and being "stuck" with only 50RB's.

Three more questions:

1) There wasn't much mention of what loads you all use. My rifle shoots well with 75 Goex FFg up to 90 grains Goex FFg. It seems to be sweetest a 80 grains. Is this OK by most of your experiences?

2) At what level of charge do you generally get full penetration through? (Better for tracking in the freshly fallen October leaves.) Or should I be asking "at what range" does the RB weaken so that you don't get full penetration through?

3) Everyone seems to mention the broadside shot into the boiler room. What do you do with the full frontal, the quartering toward you, (with the shoulder bone sort of in-the-way), and the quartering away from you presentations. Sometime when the deer have you almost "made" you have to either take these presentations or watch them run away.

What can you do with these shots?

Gosh, I'm enjoying just planning for this season!

As always, thanks in advance,

Ironsights Jerry.

 

[musketman]

If the deer is close enough to get a good head shot, it will drop it in it's tracks...

Head shots work an any angle, spine shots are second best, shuts the whole escape system down...

80 grains will do fine, yeilding roughly 1692 fps and 1143 FT/lbs. of muzzle energy in a 28 inch barrel...

 

While I haven't shot any deer with a .50, my bro has.
: His, 6 or 7 with the 1/2"'er, were with a .50 caliber TC back in the 70's. He used 80gr. 2F, a .015" patch and .495 RB. As the rifle was a flinter, he used 4F for priming as well. The reason for using 2F is that 3F was inaccurate in that rifle. The rifle shot very well with RB, better, in fact, than it did with the maxiballs he also tried.
: Up until that time, he tried the 30-30 and '06 on deer, with 150 to 180gr. bullets. With chest hits, the deer mostly bolted up to 60 yards before falling. The trouble with this was that the 60 yards mostly put them out of reach, if over muskeg, which abounds in the region he hunted, on the Graham Island, West coast of B.C.
: EVERY deer he shot with the .50, lay in the place it was standing when he pulled the trigger. Not one bolted and ran - every one was down on the spot. When the smoke cleaered, the deer was always there. This perfermance is prety close to any of the larger bores. The .50 seems to be a big step up from the .45 in smacking power.

 

[RussB]

Daryl....." EVERY deer he shot with the .50, lay in the place it was standing when he pulled the trigger. Not one bolted and ran - every one was down on the spot. When the smoke cleaered, the deer was always there."

I have found this true with Muzzleloaders, much, much more than shooting a jacketed bullet with smokeless. I often ponder the mechanics of why this may be, without much success. I have learned to just accept it as fact, and move on.
I have been hunting for more that fifty years. I have taken a lot of game in this time, with both smokeless and black powder, and I have yet to "loose" one shooting a muzzleloader.
Unfortunately, I can't say that about smokeless, but I can offer something of an explanation as to why that may be. I believe it has to do with the distance at which they are shot. Then, I have to ask myself WHY I shoot at animals at "longer" range when using smokeless, and I come up empty handed, because if I didn't shoot I would sometimes never get a shot, and I still won't take a shot over 250yds! Is it the "hunter orange" I wear?, or is it just later in the season and the animals are more weary? Or, is it because the muzzleloaders were there before the season opened for modern firearms???As I said, I don't have good answers, but because of this I have limited all my hunting to muzzleloader only. And that .50 cal is right near the top of the list when it comes to deer hunting.
Just my thoughts.
Russ

 

The diameter at impact makes a great deal of difference in the smack the animal feels, as well as the bullet is already larger than a, say, 30 cal jacketed bullet that's expanded. I really noticed a GREAT difference when shooting Moose with the .69. They'd shudder and stagger sideways when hit- every time. It certainly wasn't the so-called, 400 ft.lb. energy, compared to the 30/30's supposed 1,400 ft.lbs. at the same range. Ft.lbs. by the way is relatively menaingless - and this shows it, in spades. IT was expounded upon (advertizing) to show an advantage to high velocity, when in fact it is a non-relative measure of energy. How can a 120 pound animal absorb completely 2,500 pounds of anything, and not even stagger. Ever see a nanny get smacked by a .270 at 50 yards and not even twitch an ear - I have. Yet the .50 RB will seemingly roll a nanny - generally off the ledge.
; The difference is due to the diameter of the ball, and having enough weight to penetrate through the vitals, creating a large wound channel from the shock wave that's at the front of the ball. How else can a .70 cal ball make a 3 to 5" diameter hole through the lungs?
: I've not shot any large game at distances further than about 95 yards, but am prepared for up to 150 yards with the .69 or 250 yards with my .458's. I cannot for-see having to shoot that far, but can if necessary.
: Best long range shot on small game is a 445 yard (lazered) gopher with my CZ Hornet & 40 gr. NoslerBT - but that's another forum.

 

[shmrck1]

ironsights,
i have harvested deer with .50 and .54cal but for the shooting i have to do on deer in s.ohio i like to to use r/b with 65 grs 3fff goex and inside 75yds i have found it to be deadly with proper point of impact!!!!!

snake-eyes :m2c: :thumbsup: :imo:
p.s. that is with a .45cal hawkin

 

[glazer1972]

Posted in the wrong thread! Sorry.

 

[tx50cal]

Well you have to look at it this way. In the 1820-1860 most hunters used RB's for hunting and from what I have been told and read the whitetail population was almost wiped out. Thats proof enough for me that the RB will work. :m2c: