62. cal fowler,, you hunters,, need suggested load range needed

[BrownBear]

One big adjustment you'll have to make is in hunting methods with shot. "Long range" is a modern concept, and the only way old timers could manage it was with big bores and LOTS of big shot.

For me a 20 gauge is an "upland" gun of closer ranges and lighter shot charges. I read about some scary large shot charges on here, basically guys pushing as much shot out of them as I do from a 10 gauge. Fine for them and they're welcome to it, but I'll grab a 10 for 10 gauge loads.

I use my 20 inside 30 yards for most part, and that's plenty far for upland. Heck, it's a third of a football field and longer than almost any house owned by anyone on here. Stand outside your door and look along the long axis of your house, and if that's not far enough for upland shooting, I'm a monkey's uncle.

Knowing all that, my HEAVY load for a 20 is 1 oz of shot. More often I'm shooting 7/8 oz or as little as 3/4 oz, all with conventional black powder wads unless I'm stretching the range a little with ticking shot cups. And those light loads just knock the snot out of ptarmigan and snowshoe hare.

Ptarmigan are a little bigger than ruffed grouse, except the monster ruffies I've run into in northern Alaska. And at 20-30 yards 7/8 oz of #6 is a sure killer when you point the gun right. Snowshoe hare are the size of a large jackrabbit, and I mostly use 3/4 oz of #4 or #5 for them. The shooting is generally inside 20 yards, and I'm trying to limit the number of body hits rather than stretch the range.

 

[Tajue17]

thanks Brownbear,,, you seem to know a bit about the fowler,,, how about round ball's what works for you or whats your opinion on where I should start with a load where I'm trying to "sweetspot" my fowler for the best load.

I'm planning starting at 45gr and bumping up in 5 grain increments,, bench rested and cleaned before each shot to see if I find the tightest group possible.

 

[BrownBear]

I know next to nothing about RB's in smoothbores, but there are lots of folks on here who use them with great success. I live in more "rifle" country than smoothie country when it comes to balls, so I just haven't put a lot of effort into them.

Anyone else have suggestions?

 

[Roy]

I use 60 grains of 2f with a 1/4" lubed fiber wad and a .600 round ball in .020 patching. I got pass through on a nice size doe at 84 yds. The ball hit a rib on the way in and busted the front leg bone above the joint on the way out. Went back with a metal detector and found the ball.

the white bits are bone fragments in the lead.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Roy, that is an impressive post on several counts. First, 84 yards is 'long range' for a smoothie. You must be well practiced and confident with your gun. Congrats. I am impressed with the deformation of the ball. The interior of that doe must have been a mess. Meaning, quick and humane kill. And, IMHO, it debunks the notion that a hard lead ball is OK for smoothies. I know the size of the recovered ball is not much greater than the unfired. But it did deform and would stop an animal if the shot were not well placed. BTW, not many of us would take the time or trouble to go looking for the fired ball. Good on you for doing that. This is educational.

 

[Keb]

I don't hunt no more but shoot 80 gr FF in my .62 but say it's only a healthy 60 grains because of some silly rule about too much powder in big bores. I can't imagine people not wanting to fix their targets after every hit. :/ I'd say if it breaks clangers it'll Shirley poke a hole in a deer big enough to let the blood run out or somethin'.
Best advice I got is try this stuff out for yourself. Experience is a good teacher.

Ya, I know, and "Don't call me Shirley".

 

[Roy]

I am impressed with the deformation of the ball. The interior of that doe must have been a mess. Meaning, quick and humane kill.

I do not think the ball was that deformed until it hit the offside leg bone... but there is no telling. There was bone and lead fragments where the ball exited. The ball passed above the heart through both lungs and the doe went around 70-80 yards.

 

[Maestro]

Went back with a metal detector and found the ball.

That's some dedication, Roy! I'm curious... about how far away from where the deer was when it was hit did you find the ball? I'm wondering how far the ball would travel after it passed through the deer but I guess if there was a close backstop, it'd be hard to tell.)

 

[Rifleman1776]

I am impressed with the deformation of the ball. The interior of that doe must have been a mess. Meaning, quick and humane kill.

I do not think the ball was that deformed until it hit the offside leg bone... but there is no telling. There was bone and lead fragments where the ball exited. The ball passed above the heart through both lungs and the doe went around 70-80 yards.

OK, now I'm confused. I don't want to sound like I'm bragging. Just reporting on my experiences. The only deer (plural) I have killed with a muzzle loader have been with a .45 cal. and patched round ball from soft lead. None went more than two steps. What I call 'reaction leaps'. Then they went down nose first. I'm not the best shot in the world but have to say, all but one, the balls were properly placed. My wife has killed two, also using .45 and prb. Her experience was identical. BTW, we only use 65 gr. of bp for the charge. With that big punkin' ball of yours going through a doe and she ran 70-80 yards, I'm puzzled. How?
I also recall a small buck I shot with a 30-06 at about 15 yards. Didn't recover the bullet but he dropped in his tracks, literally. Shot was above the heart and severed the aorta. Other internal damage was minimal, I don't believe the bullet (Nosler partition) expanded much more than 2X the .30" original diameter. Not trying to talk modern guns here, just comparing killing effects. Some of these experiences are hard to explain.

 

[rabjr]

Went back with a metal detector and found the ball.

That's some dedication, Roy! I'm curious... about how far away from where the deer was when it was hit did you find the ball? I'm wondering how far the ball would travel after it passed through the deer but I guess if there was a close backstop, it'd be hard to tell.)

I found the ball about 10 yards uphill farther than where the doe was standing when I shot. I have decided that metal detectors are cool..

 

[rabjr]

It's not uncommon to see this at all up here. Seen deer shot with 12ga slugs do amazing things that make you shake your head sometimes. Thats shot through the lungs and heart shots. Some die never taking a step and some make a dash that lasts 200 yards...personally I've had one shot with .20 ball that went 30ish yards after being hit.

 

[Roy]

She was in no shape to answer by the time I found her.. :idunno: :haha:

Only time that I have had deer drop right at the shot were from shots to the spine(or close to). This one made it farther than any other, and first one I broke a leg on. Could be the shock of the ball hitting the bone that inspired her to go that far :idunno:

I found the ball roughly 10 yds from where the deer was. No telling how far it would have gone but it was on a slight hill and I was shooting into it. I do know that it didn't bounce or skid, just barely went into the ground. :v

 

[BrownBear]

In my experience, each deer has its own set of rules after a hit. I've had them drop in their tracks with a lung hit from a 50 RB, run 40 yards with the same hit using a .570 RB on top of 110 grains. Helped a buddy track a deer he shot face-on in the brisket with a TC Maxi 50 cal. Covered 75 yards uphill, and we found the Maxi under the hide at the back of the off ham. Longest I've had to track a deer was one I popped at about 50 yards with a 375 H&H- It covered over 100 yards with no lungs.

Every time you pull the trigger, you start a new adventure.

 

[Maestro]

Went back with a metal detector and found the ball.

That's some dedication, Roy! I'm curious... about how far away from where the deer was when it was hit did you find the ball? I'm wondering how far the ball would travel after it passed through the deer but I guess if there was a close backstop, it'd be hard to tell.)

I found the ball about 10 yards uphill farther than where the doe was standing when I shot. I have decided that metal detectors are cool..

Thanks, Rich... I missed that one! In fact, I still can't find where he said it! :redface: :idunno: :haha:

 

[rabjr]

http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/262955/post/1066103/hl//fromsearch/1/ :thumbsup:

 

[Tajue17]

well I went to the range today and found 45 to 60grains of swiss grouped about 4" at 30 & 45yds and thats the entire group BUT I got several perfect Bullseyes within these volleys,, and even though it was bench rested on an upside down bucket with a blanket over it I did still have some twitching I noticed when the fowler misfired a few times I saw the front sight jerk a tad maybe 2 or 3" at the target.. I thought I got myself used to that but guess not,, also I didn't realize how hard the trigger pull was on this fowler not sure if I can file something to lighten the pull????..

anyway I did take pics with ym blackberry but I'm having trouble posting them, if someone knows how I can forward you the pics I sent to my PC from my phone if you PM an Email.. but they show a few different groups using swiss, shuetzen and I think I got a couple with Goex 60gr of 3/F shots which I think hit right with the 45&50gr swiss... the shuetzen powder was the worse one hitting high @ 10" and one low left at 10" I put that powder away real fast because I may twitch a buit left or right but my high/low hits are usually pretty good.. the swiss was the best and I noticed it wasn't as messy where I cleaned the barrel after each shot the shuetzen and goex seems alot dirtier than the swiss,,

tried a wad over a card once like someone suggested above but only once,, and even though it hit right about 4" @ 45yds I did have a problem with the fowler NOT going off before that shot and had to push 4f into the touch hole to get the load to go! and I just think I lost my focus so I'd like to spend more time with the wads..

And I also forgot my much needed range rod which I could of attached a scraper and not had these fowling problems, plus I would of had a decent jag instead of the shotgun style ramrod to clean with. but the gun loaded easy for me and I think fowling was at a minimum for each shot,, I never hit the target as good as I did today,,, And I missed a doe last year @ about 15-20yds which bothered me because I could not figure out why and Now i know I shot over her back because I sighted the fowler wrong I ignored the front blade sight and put the top edge of the barrel on her shoulder instead when I should of put the top of that blade front sight on her shoulder because of the way I have my head on the stock,, my shooting doesn't show it too much but I know the barrel on this fowler is dead on perfect!

thanks for all the posts.. Ted

 

[Tajue17]

45grains of swiss @ 30yds


45grains of Shuezten @ 30yds ( was very disappointed where I just bought 2 pounds, may shoot better with heavier loads so I'll try it from my T/C's)


55&60grains of swiss @ 45yds (55 is stacked towards the center & the 60 is moving out to the left)


this is a mix,, but the far right is the one I used a wad


50grains of swiss @45yds (my 1st shot was the bull and I almost jumped out of my boots! it was like hitting the lottery)


in closing I want to say I feel swiss is the powder for this fowler and I'm leanign towards 50gr. BUT I want to go back and shoot 50yds and 75yds just to see what my max effective range is. thanks for looking and thanks for all the advice posted,T

 

[Tajue17]

some pictures of my fowler I named Ye Ole Grumpy Girl (or Miss Grumpy for short)

 

[Stumpkiller]

Clean lines. Very nice. :hatsoff:

 

[nessmuk]

My load is 60 gr of 3F with a patched round ball for deer out to about 75 yards. for small game I use the same 60 gr of 3F and 1 1/8th of of shot with 1 over the powder wad and one over the shot wad. I do not use a fiber filler wad, the gun shoots better paterns without the fiber wad.