A minor disaster this morning.....broken-off nipple in P-H rifle.

[TFoley]

First shot of the day!!!! Yippeee!

Well, not exactly.

A soft 'pliff' instead of the expected KA-boom from my new-to-me P-H Whitworth rifle.

Two more caps to try again, and again. Same deal, or rather, lack of it.

Out came the trusty nipple wrench, easy on the nipple, and 'snick' and it broke off.

x 100

There are clear signs of a new break and what appears to be an old crack. See -

So, I pulled the bullet - an easy job since it was a close sliding fit, followed by the card wad - and then most of the powder. The rest came out with a flush that backed up the barrel - seems a pint of boiling water is just too much for the .33" long .451cal bore - who knew?

So now to the tricky bit - drilling out the touch hole in the nipple to remove what it effectively a busted tap, using a broken tap extractor. Over here we call them 'easy-outs' - the truth behind the name remains to be seen. So fat I've anointed the remains with Kroil, and letting it soak through.

I'll let you know what happened next, when I've done it.

Wish me luck.

 

[Stony Broke]

Wow...never seen a nipple break like that before. Best of luck with your easyout !

 

[Dude]

Yeah, they've got the same name over here, and work pretty well at (almost) permanently plugging a hole.

The best penetrating fluid I've found, and it's almost magic how well it works, is a 50/50 mix of Power Steering Fluid and Acetone.

Good luck removing that bugger!

 

[ZUG]

Good luck with the removal. Here in the US we also call them "easy-outs" but I have not had much luck with them. I have used the square tang of a file driven into a hole that I drilled into the broken bolt and unscrewed after soaking with a penetrating oil. That nipple must be really stuck if it broke like that.

 

[NorthFork]

@TFoley

An easy-out can work, but sometimes I find removal easier with a left hand drill bit. The bit grabs the offending broken bolt a lot better at times and backs the bolt out. Don't know if they sell left hand drill bits over there.

 

[BS]

If you have to use an EZ-out look into the 'straight flute'. They tend not to expand while removing.

 

[RicM]

Best of luck!!! That does suck, and do keep us posted please. On my M1842 Aston Johnson Musket Pistol I attempted to remove the nipple for a good cleaning and used the proper wrench for it. It aint budging. I soaked the barrel (nipple end) in Break Clean (an industrial rust remover as with other stuff mentioned above for two days. Still not moving I guess after 160 years its in there good. So taking note from your hardship and frustration and from Clint's famous quote, "A man's has to know his limitations" I decided on preventive maintenance by taking the barrel to an antique gun smith. Pay the coin have him remove it and also buy a spare.

 

[Griz44Mag]

First shot of the day!!!! Yippeee!

Well, not exactly.

A soft 'pliff' instead of the expected KA-boom from my new-to-me P-H Whitworth rifle.

Two more caps to try again, and again. Same deal, or rather, lack of it.

Out came the trusty nipple wrench, easy on the nipple, and 'snick' and it broke off.

x 100

There are clear signs of a new break and what appears to be an old crack. See -

View attachment 83098

So, I pulled the bullet - an easy job since it was a close sliding fit, followed by the card wad - and then most of the powder. The rest came out with a flush that backed up the barrel - seems a pint of boiling water is just too much for the .33" long .451cal bore - who knew?

So now to the tricky bit - drilling out the touch hole in the nipple to remove what it effectively a busted tap, using a broken tap extractor. Over here we call them 'easy-outs' - the truth behind the name remains to be seen. So fat I've anointed the remains with Kroil, and letting it soak through.

I'll let you know what happened next, when I've done it.

Wish me luck.

YUP - easy out for this neck of the woods too.
Just be sure and use one with the teeth digging in the opposite of the threads for rotation. They do make both twists.
And the other thing - don't buy a cheap set - they will break off with too much tension. (Yea - I did but don't do that anymore.)

 

[TFoley]

Good luck with the removal. Here in the US we also call them "easy-outs" but I have not had much luck with them. I have used the square tang of a file driven into a hole that I drilled into the broken bolt and unscrewed after soaking with a penetrating oil. That nipple must be really stuck if it broke like that.

Funnily enough, not only has it been in and out at least three times since last Saturday, but it in an out before it broke - AND put back in with a little dab of grease to make it easier. Just that this time it was the same 'easy' just that it came apart...

 

[TFoley]

Best of luck!!! That does suck, and do keep us posted please. On my M1842 Aston Johnson Musket Pistol I attempted to remove the nipple for a good cleaning and used the proper wrench for it. It aint budging. I soaked the barrel (nipple end) in Break Clean (an industrial rust remover as with other stuff mentioned above for two days. Still not moving I guess after 160 years its in there good. So taking note from your hardship and frustration and from Clint's famous quote, "A man's has to know his limitations" I decided on preventive maintenance by taking the barrel to an antique gun smith. Pay the coin have him remove it and also buy a spare.

If there was a handy 'antique gun smith' I'd be knocking on his door right now. Unlike the US of A, where you have thousands of 'em, I wouldn't have the foggiest notion where to look. Rudyard lives, as far as I can tell, pretty much the other end of the country from me.....

 

[Britsmoothy]

Forget the easy out get some left hand drills.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/13pcs-Le...2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0

 

[JamesA]

First shot of the day!!!! Yippeee!

Well, not exactly.

A soft 'pliff' instead of the expected KA-boom from my new-to-me P-H Whitworth rifle.

Two more caps to try again, and again. Same deal, or rather, lack of it.

Out came the trusty nipple wrench, easy on the nipple, and 'snick' and it broke off.

x 100

There are clear signs of a new break and what appears to be an old crack. See -

View attachment 83098

So, I pulled the bullet - an easy job since it was a close sliding fit, followed by the card wad - and then most of the powder. The rest came out with a flush that backed up the barrel - seems a pint of boiling water is just too much for the .33" long .451cal bore - who knew?

So now to the tricky bit - drilling out the touch hole in the nipple to remove what it effectively a busted tap, using a broken tap extractor. Over here we call them 'easy-outs' - the truth behind the name remains to be seen. So fat I've anointed the remains with Kroil, and letting it soak through.

I'll let you know what happened next, when I've done it.

Wish me luck.

Over here we call them easy outs.

Where are you located? In the States that's what they were called while I was growing up.

BTW, good luck with getting it out, it'll take some work but you'll get it.

 

[TFoley]

Over here we call them easy outs.

Where are you located? In the States that's what they were called while I was growing up.

BTW, good luck with getting it out, it'll take some work but you'll get it.

Post #1 - 'Over here we call them 'easy-outs' ' Thanks, I'll be working on it tomorrow.

 

[TFoley]

Good luck with the removal. Here in the US we also call them "easy-outs" but I have not had much luck with them. I have used the square tang of a file driven into a hole that I drilled into the broken bolt and unscrewed after soaking with a penetrating oil. That nipple must be really stuck if it broke like that.

That works, I know - I did it many years back on a broken tang screw on a replica long rifle built from a kit. It was a wall-hanger anyhow, so we had nothing to lose.

If you look carefully at the nipple stub you can see that the only part that sheared was a small section - the rest looked like an old break to me. It had been out already to clean....all history now - I'm just left with this leetle problemo.

 

[Allenby]

Aside from your nipple break; how do you like shooting your Whitworth? Does it give you the accuracy you expected? Stay safe, andy

 

[Tn poor boy]

Tap and die i thank 10/32.re thrid replace new nipple

 

[Artificer]

First shot of the day!!!! Yippeee!

Well, not exactly.

A soft 'pliff' instead of the expected KA-boom from my new-to-me P-H Whitworth rifle.

Two more caps to try again, and again. Same deal, or rather, lack of it.

Out came the trusty nipple wrench, easy on the nipple, and 'snick' and it broke off.

x 100

There are clear signs of a new break and what appears to be an old crack. See -

View attachment 83098

So, I pulled the bullet - an easy job since it was a close sliding fit, followed by the card wad - and then most of the powder. The rest came out with a flush that backed up the barrel - seems a pint of boiling water is just too much for the .33" long .451cal bore - who knew?

So now to the tricky bit - drilling out the touch hole in the nipple to remove what it effectively a busted tap, using a broken tap extractor. Over here we call them 'easy-outs' - the truth behind the name remains to be seen. So fat I've anointed the remains with Kroil, and letting it soak through.

I'll let you know what happened next, when I've done it.

Wish me luck.

OK, after MANY years of removing stuck or broken Cones (nipples) from these and other ML guns, here is my suggestion.

1. Dismount the barrel. Take whatever penetrating oil solution you have or deem best. Cut the top off a soda pop can or use a similar open top container the breech will go down into far enough the Cone will be soaked. Put the Breech end in the container and pour the penetrating oil down the muzzle until the can fills to just above the level of the Cone. Let the barrel sit upright that way for at least 3 days if not a week.

Special Note: I almost NEVER had time to do step 1., because I almost always had to replace a stuck cone right before or during a National or International Match competition.

Step 2. Pour a little penetrating oil down the barrel and let it rest upright for as long as you can, but so the oil that comes out of the nipple doesn't spill onto Milady's Carpet or nice Tile or Hardwood Floors. I usually put some kind of old tray under it and angled the gun so the oil would flow into the pan. Drain Oil and wipe off the surface around the Cone.

3. Get out your Dremel Tool and a tiny Carbide "Bur" or ball shaped cutter. (Dentists often will give you worn ones that will work just fine for this, though I buy my own most of the time.) Run the Dremel at FULL Speed and securely hold the Dremel using both hands. LIGHTLY touch the Carbide Cutter to the CENTER of the Cone and gently allow it to cut down a ways. Then gently begin from the center and bring the cut towards the outside on both sides of the Cone. What you are doing is cutting a "Screwdriver Slot" in the head of the damaged Cone. Use a Screwdriver blade that matches the width and length of the slot as close as possible. First try to turn the Screwdriver blade clockwise, then re-grip and turn it counter clock wise.

It was surprising even how many 125 year old damaged and rusted in Cones I was able to remove this way. The key here is the Vibration of the Cutter causes things to loosen up nicely. What if that doesn't work?

3. I used to drill a hole as close to the center of the damaged Cone and would try each of two larger sizes of Easy Outs after drilling a larger hole for each size Easy Out.

However, again after doing many of them, I modified that a bit. I used a sharp 3/32" Carbide Bur/Ball Cutter and gently cut much of the center out of the nipple by going around the center and down as far as I could. That delivered a LOT more vibration and ensured the Easy Out would work every time with or without having drilled a full depth hole with the correct size drill bit.

Gus

 

[TFoley]

Aside from your nipple break; how do you like shooting your Whitworth? Does it give you the accuracy you expected? Stay safe, andy

Not yet, I was shooting low loads with bullets of a weight that I would not usually shoot. They were just lying around, ready-sized and lubed.

My last P-H Whitworth was a phenomenal shooter with a 535gr bullet and 80gr of 2Fg. This one should be no different.

 

[TFoley]

Many thanks, Gus - for that really informative and useful post. Should this ever happen to me again, I'll try it all as you suggest. I HAVE a Dremel, and I HAVE carbide mounted points, too. What I don't have are tiles or wooden floors - let alone carpets!

Handily, today I actually found a real gunsmith less than forty miles away who has wide experience in old-style guns. The part of England in which I live is chock-full of shooting estates and shooting grounds of all kinds, and there are literally thousands of older hammer guns that use the percussion lock.

I'll keep you posted on progress.

 

[Davey Boy]

If it's one of those $150 guns, you can just give it a go.

But if it is a keeper, I would want good work done on it. I would not experiment.

Articifer has it quite good doing it without machinery.