Afghan Flintlock

[cherryjf]

Hello,
I'm in need of some assistance. I'm a Marine and I brought back an interesting flintlock rifle from Afghanistan. It is 63" long with a stock set with over 1000 pieces of mother of pearl and lots of brass work. It has a 49" octagonal rifled barrel of Damascus steel with a large two holed rear sight aperture. The lock is British with the crown "GR" stamp and "TOWER" which actually looks more like "LOWER". I am not trying to sell it, I just want to learn more about it. Can anyone give me any hints or resources where I could get help.
Thanks

 

Take lots of high quality photographs of your Flintlock and contact the guys at Track of the Wolf here's a link to their web site. They buy, sell, trade and sell on commission for others, all kinds of antiques and modern reproductions, they also do appraisals for individuals.

(click me)

 

[cherryjf]

Thanks for the help, I'll try them out.

 

[Stumpkiller]

It's called a Jezail. The lock appears to be a third pattern Bess. Other than that ?????

 

[Stumpkiller]

The following is from http://www.collectiblefirearms.com/RiflesAntiqueFlintlock.html

DESCRIPTION: Very good quality 19th century Afghan Jezail rifle. Typical Afghan style stock curving sharply downwards and terminating in the wide flat butt. Beautiful Damascus barrel. Some bone and brass inlays on the buttstock. English style flintlock, most likely supplied by English traders. Lockplate displays a "Crown over GR" (very nicely engraved) and a word, "Tower". Four brass barrel bands. Brass trigger guard. There is a well made steel sling swivel in front of the lock. The front sling swivel, between the second and third barrel band, is missing. Complete with original, crudely made steel ramrod. Overall length: 59 inch. Barrel length: 45 inch. CONDITION: Overall, the musket is in fine condition. The stock is nice and solid, with no cracks. The wood shows some typical wear near the barrel. The barrel is covered by some scattered light patina. Very nice Damascus pattern is clearly visible on the barrel. Some scattered patina is also visible on the lock and the steel parts of the buttstock. English style flintlock is in working order. A very good example of the seldom encountered musket for a collector of Islamic firearms! (Ref. "A Glossary of the Construction, Decoration and Use of Arms and Armor", by George Cameron Stone , p. 322 figure 406/2). (Oversize shipping and insurance rate is $40 for this item only).

Asking $1,495.00

 

[cherryjf]

Thanks for the link, I'll try them out as well. I was not sure what style brown bess lock it is. I've looked at lots of pictures and it does not seem to match up 100% with any of them. Most dealers don't want to talk over the net, they want to see the weapon in person.

 

[Stumpkiller]

There are some replacement parts going on there. Frizzen spring, screws . . . I'm not sure how the flint is tightened in as there appear to be no threads on the top jaw screw???? Does the lock function? The vent is WAY forward of where it should be for that lock plate and the frizzen foot only half covers the pan. Could be just a wall-hanger ornamental piece.

 

[Redcoat]

Looks like ya got yer hands on one of them thar Camel guns! You hold the stock under your armpit while on a horse or camel and you can shoot it one-handed. Awesome find!

Also, just for an odd little reference, if anyone's happened to see the movie Hildalgo, the flintlock that was used to start the race is of this type.

 

[cherryjf]

Yes the lock does function, and with force. There are threads on the jaw screw, they just have crud in them and need to be cleaned. The vent hole is out of alignment, and the hammer rubs on the stock a little. It probably had another lock originally, but something very similar because the plate fits perfectly into the stock.

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

I'm really surprised they let you keep it. I was in the Army and served in Desert Storm. Any finds were considered 'war trophies' and would immediately be confiscated. Allowing soldiers to keep war trophies was considered politically incorrect and not allowed at all. But some officers got away with it.

I remember how they had such a fit when some soldiers tried to take one of those tiny tabasco bottles from an MRE and use it to take home a tiny bit of desert sand as a souvenir. They carried on about possible contamination of American soil by foreign microbes that would wreak havoc on agriculture and all kinds of possible scenarios out of a cheesy science fiction novel. But then pictures of Schwarzkopf made the front page when he was presented with a large bottle of sand to take home by one of the Saudi royalty.

 

[cherryjf]

CENTCOM still frowns on war trophies. But if you pruchased the weapon and it was older than 1898 and considered an antique there is a waiver from the CG. Then all you have to do is get some paperwork done and ship it home registered mail. They hold a bazaar each week at Bagrum airfield and the local vendors sell all sorts of interesting things, including lots of old weapons. I could bring this back but could not bring something like an AK mag or bayonet. They still customs inspect us very hard and make sure nothing bad comes back. They will let you bring back rocks and sand, but it has to be soaked in a bleach solution for about an hour there at customs.

 

[cherryjf]

I have not seen Hildago, but if you've ever seen the movie "The Beast", about a soviet tank crew, there is a weapons like this in that movie.

 

With the closeup of that action, it does appear to be a non-funtioning 'replica-type' gun.
; The alarm bells are certainly ringing now. Along with the lack of threads on the screw, improper fit & shape of parts, mislocation of touch-hole, the plate appears too small and has 'odd' marks/engraving on it. I've never before seen bridle screws that are rectangular in shape. The top-jaw screw has filed flats instead of being round with threads.
; Like I said- alarm-bells. With all it's intricate work, it still appears to be a phony firearm. The work alone must have some value, though. Perhaps someone collects these???
Daryl

 

[Gary]

I'm hesitant to call this a phony. The lock has either a lot of replaced parts or is hand made. Look at that frizzen spring. Clearly not British quality.

However, remember these artisans weren't making for export to the discerning English gentleman. He was making for the Afghan market. So what's wrong with a few imperfections? It has character and should be judged for what it is and not as if it were a Nock, Grice or Manton (pick your choice of Manton).

 

[Zonie]

I agree with Gary.
It looks like the frizzen spring, the cock screw, the frizzen and most likely the cock have all been replaced with fairly crude pieces.
This is to be expected. I mean, after spending perhaps over 200 years over in the Afghan area, and being worked on by the local "gunsmiths", I'm suprised it has all the pieces, let alone has the pieces in the general area of where they should be located.

I have handled a few pistols which were made in the Middle East, and must admit they put an incredable amount of work into the stock decorations. Of course most of you think I'm a inlay nut and perhaps your right, but as far as I'm concerned, that just gives me a better feel for what it must take to produce works of art like this rifle is.
Many Middle Eastern pistols and rifles stocks are truly amazing!

 

[robinghewitt]

I think we are looking at a pattern 1777 land service pistol lock complete with ordnance acceptance mark so it is British army issued rather than a trade/ransom piece. The comb has been bashed about, the frizzen looks a bit odd where it meets the rather icky spring, but I don't have a problem with the flint clamp bolt. The threads are there, if a bit tired, it is wound all the way down.

Just my .02p ::

Edit: Sherlock Holmes assistant Dr Watson had an old Jezail wound. (Jezail trivia #38)