American Pioneer Powder

[brewer12345]

Hopefully not a stupid question, but when you say "heavily compressed" do you mean seating the ball hard enough to hear the powder 'crunch' or just short of that? Bill

I thump it down good. Then again, I tend to do similar with real black without thinking about it. In my percussion revolvers I make sure to seat the ball firmly on the charge when loading. I think the real issue is that the kitty litter sized grains really need to be mashed down to perform best.

 

[Okie Hog]

Hopefully not a stupid question, but when you say "heavily compressed" do you mean seating the ball hard enough to hear the powder 'crunch' or just short of that?

It ain't a stupid question.

i put a golf ball on the end of the ramrod and, using both hands, compress as hard as possible. Then i whang it once with the aluminum ramrod.

My patched round balls are a tight fit that require three or four smacks on the short starter to start the ball.

 

[Throwdown58]

I am in south florida also and I keep my alternative powders in a river bag or ammo can when I'm not using them

 

[Newtire]

Hopefully not a stupid question, but when you say "heavily compressed" do you mean seating the ball hard enough to hear the powder 'crunch' or just short of that? Bill

Seems to work the best with heavier weight projectiles than with the lighter ones so that makes sense.

 

[Newtire]

kitty litter sized grains

about the best description of the stuff I've heard yet! All that aside, I really wish that they hadn't stopped making it.

 

[deerstalkert]

about the best description of the stuff I've heard yet! All that aside, I really wish that they hadn't stopped making it.

American Pioneer Powder Company ( Brett ) 1-888-423-2310

 

[11th corps]

Clean Shot is a name I haven't heard in some time. iirc- I had a pound of it.
BP substitutes work, at least in caplocks. I shot nothing but BP subs in my ROA's for years.
But when you can get it, BP is better.

 

[brewer12345]

about the best description of the stuff I've heard yet! All that aside, I really wish that they hadn't stopped making it.

Me too. It will be a while before I burn up my stash, but I will be trying APP when I am done.

 

[Rawhide67]

I've used app and liked it, if used quickly. It may be my storage method but letting an opened container sit for any length of time caused significant accuracy issues. At times you could hear a difference from one shot to the next and feel a difference in recoil.

I've had the same problem wit T7 powder. Never had an issue with real black powder. My remaining can of app, has been opened, is saved for messing around with my golf ball mortar.

 

[BadDaditood]

I think Clean Shot is out of production.
I make 1/2 and smaller cans by bandsawing old Goex cans then driving the two pieces back together.
They are always bright and shiny inside no matter how old the can.
A while back I cut into a Clean Shot can and it was completely rusted inside!
I guess that’s why they say with subs you should clean your barrel a second time a day or two after you clean it the first time.

 

[Newtire]

you should clean your barrel a second time a day or two after you clean it the first time.

I found that to be true of Pyrodex but so far, no signs of that with Black MZ. One bad trait of Black MZ was that it really crudded up those self contained containers of brass that they have come out with for those unmentionable shooting irons that load from the wrong end.

 

[springfield art]

I just saw an advertisement for this powder and have never heard anything about it. Has anybody had any experience with this powder?

BTW, I've not seen anything lately about the "powder shortage" after the news of Goex closing. Anyone have any comments about the looming "powder panic"?

 

[Newtire]

I guarantee American Pioneers didn't use it.

To me, just another unneeded black powder substitute

Only reaso

Heres what I've heard from a cpl friends that are using it now. I'll be getting some for the first time shortly myself. Its not temp or humidity sensitive, it has no sulfur in it, easy to set off, easy clean up with water only & no crud ring like with T7 & you can get a case of it ( 10lbs ) for about the same price of what a 5lb bottle of BH 209 costed when they could be found. Whats not to like huh. I have a TC High PLains Sporter that i'll be gettin a .40 cal fast twist barrel put on it with a .410 barrel too. I have a Pedersoli 12ga & an ROA pistol that I'll use that powder in all of them - gladly.

Don't forget to try it in a 12 ga. M/L. Perfect powder for m/l shotgun if you ask me, (if it's the same stuff as Black MZ) judging by the velocity gains you see with heavier projectiles. Have used black mz in everything from .32 squirrel rifles on up to .61 cal. Scheutzen as well as 10 gauge shotguns. Didn't work for me in flintlocks was only bummer.

 

[brewer12345]

BTW, I've not seen anything lately about the "powder shortage" after the news of Goex closing. Anyone have any comments about the looming "powder panic"?

Powder is still scarce. Not much more to say.

 

[megasupermagnum]

BTW, I've not seen anything lately about the "powder shortage" after the news of Goex closing. Anyone have any comments about the looming "powder panic"?

A day or two after the closing, I purchased a 25 pound case, which was all I should have spent. More actually, but I already forgot about it. I'm glad I did it.

Goex is now gone. I assume here and there still has a pound or 5, but for the most part it is gone either forever, or until it is sold. There has been no announcement of a sale of the brand yet. I'd really hope Vista outdoors would jump right on that one.

 

[BadDaditood]

As soon as the “ship to shore” snafu smoothes out there should be plenty of Scheutzen and Swiss to fill the void. Both are better than Goex was and Scheutzen is the same price.
Swiss while more spendy is high quality, more potent and noticeably cleaner than Goex, although I hear in dry climates it fouls extremely hard in BPCR applications. Works great in muzzleloaders, most likely because every load wipes the barrel.
For my last order they didn’t have enough Olde Eynesford so they threw in some Swiss and Scheutzen… I’m happy they did, I really like those two powders.
It’s sad the only BP available to us is made in Europe.

 

[springfield art]

As soon as the “ship to shore” snafu smoothes out there should be plenty of Scheutzen and Swiss to fill the void. Both are better than Goex was and Scheutzen is the same price.
Swiss while more spendy is high quality, more potent and noticeably cleaner than Goex, although I hear in dry climates it fouls extremely hard in BPCR applications. Works great in muzzleloaders, most likely because every load wipes the barrel.
For my last order they didn’t have enough Olde Eynesford so they threw in some Swiss and Scheutzen… I’m happy they did, I really like those two powders.
It’s sad the only BP available to us is made in Europe.

Alas, the "Olde World" still has strings attached to us and us to them!

 

[springfield art]

I've used app and liked it, if used quickly. It may be my storage method but letting an opened container sit for any length of time caused significant accuracy issues. At times you could hear a difference from one shot to the next and feel a difference in recoil.

I've had the same problem wit T7 powder. Never had an issue with real black powder. My remaining can of app, has been opened, is saved for messing around with my golf ball mortar.

Makes sense, BP is an absorbent for moisture in the air. Hydrostatic, of something like that, which is why you have to clean up right after shooting or suffer rust.

 

[Frontier's]

American pioneer Black MZ, made for Alliant.

This stuff only cost $10 a lb! At that price, it was super great because it was cheap and made a lot of smoke and was fairly accurate enough to hunt out to 60 yards with. I had some really good 100 yard groups, but not consistent enough.

Would I pay $30 a lb for American pioneer? Fudge no!

 

[megasupermagnum]

Yeah, at $10 a pound, it was worth considering. I never saw it for that price, but I did hear it went cheap when it was discontinued. I did not know APP made that, but it makes sense. That's about how mine looked. You could break it up if you wanted, but with better powders, why would anyone in their right mind bother?

P.S. I was completely unaware they still make Jim Shockey sticks. That came out in the big wave of modern muzzleloaders in the early 2000's with a million other substitute powders that proved to be garbage. Unless the formula has changed, those sticks are garbage too. Not even Jim Shockey uses it. I like Jim Shockey, but he really got wrapped up in marketing poor products for some reason. I'm not aware of one thing with his name on it that is actually good.