Are all Double wedge Hawken's huge?

[Bobby James]

Today I drove by Cabela's to see what was in the bargain cave. Two weeks ago I bought a nice Pedersoli Hawken in .54 cal from the bargain cave because it had a small chip on the stock so now I check back regularly to see what they have.

Today I walk in and I first see another Pedersoli Hawken but in .50 cal. I look it over and it is just on clearance from them having it for too long so I put it back on the rack. As I was doing so I noticed a giant of a rifle that I thought must have been made for dinosaur hunting so I checked it out.
I picked it up and instantly strained my arm. I look it over and say "nice". I look at the markings on the barrel and it said Pedersoli .54 cal Maple. It was a giant double wedge rifle with maple wood. I did not realize anybody made a rifle so huge. It was like two time the size of my Pedersoli .54 cal Hawken.

I dug a little deeper and found out it is a Pedersoli Rocky Mountain Hawken in .54cal. They are asking $899. It has never been fired but it was a return. Someone bought it and returned it unfired.

The striping in the maple was very little but it is still a nice rifle. The only problem I seen with it is that in the corner of the butt the wood is soon going to split out. It already has a crack about an inch from the corner. It is hard to tell because of the over coating but me and the guy behind the counter took note of it since we were both drooling over it.

I know it will not sale soon do to this crack. In a few weeks after it has not sold I am going to offer the manager $600 for it.

Is there a good stock repair guy that can fix this crack? Maybe somebody who can break it and pin and re-glue to where it is strong and not noticed.

Are all double wedge Hawken type rifles this big? Why is it so big? Is this how they were really made?

 

[Zonie]

That's just the way they were and the reproduction guns are too.

The Mountain Men wanted a strong rifle that wouldn't break if it was dropped or otherwise mistreated.
They wanted fairly large calibers and the .54 was quite popular. They often brought down buffalo and black bears not to mention more than a few Indians.

The weight wasn't a problem for them because they rode horseback almost every place they went unless they were running their trap lines.

The typical Plains Rifle weighted 10-13 pounds and for what it's worth, I doubt the rifle you were looking at weighed over 9 1/2.

Em wur MEN, Ah says! :grin:

 

[gard72977]

That Pederosli is 9.9 pounds regardless of caliber. The 54 has a 34" bbl the 50 is 32" and in Europe a 45 is available in 30".

I wanted the 54 but it is out of stock until 11/27
I ended up with a Uberti that is 8 lb 13 oz without a ramrod its 53cal with 32" bbl

 

[necchi]

Well so far in the last two weeks your ready to buy 5 different rifles, 6 if you count the Seneca you wanted first.
You got's the fever,, :wink:

 

[BrownBear]

...typical Plains Rifle weighted 10-13 pounds....

Ayup. My GRRW Hawken is supposed to be pretty true to form. Thankfully it's "only" 58 cal, which cuts down on weight a bit from smaller cals with similar external barrel dimensions. With its 36" barrel tapered from 1 1/8" to 1" at the muzzle, it tips the scale a little over 12 pounds.

Points like a dream and accurate as a snakebite, but sad to say it didn't come with a saddlehorse attached.

 

[Rusty_Nail]

Seen a Hawken style he had just finished, over at a Builder's in Carlisle, Pa. Saturday night.

Beautiful rifle, 58 cal. 1-1/8" straight octagon barrel, said it weighed 11 lbs. 3 oz!

Not something I could carry on a short day deer hunting, let alone across the Rockys!

 

[Andyd]

Well so far in the last two weeks your ready to buy 5 different rifles, 6 if you count the Seneca you wanted first..

I started on my project $80.00 CVA Mountain Rifle on my join date.
Made four barrel wedges. Then Glass bed the lock plate. Now I'm at my folks place for deer season. I glass bed the trigger assy. Scrubbed the rusty barrel clean enough to shoot. Witch I would if I'd remembered to bring my powder.
I've got lots work left to do. But it's mechanically sound to shoot.
All with the help of the fine folks of this site.

Bob ! Quit shopping for more rifles and focus on the three you got.

 

[Bobby James]

Well so far in the last two weeks your ready to buy 5 different rifles, 6 if you count the Seneca you wanted first.
You got's the fever,, :wink:

Loll! I have a monkey on my back and its called black powder guns.

I am just going to try and get these few guns and then I am done. ...... right after I built a few kits.

 

[Andyd]

This is my first ML. I dont want to spend $400.00+ on a kit. This $80.00 project gun is challenging me just fine. .

Quote is by me in another thread. I learn my gunsmith skills on cheap guns. It has paid of nicely. I have built some very cool firearms with this practice.

 

[George T.]

This board should have meetings for us to go to.

I have a 7 1/2 pound 58 that is nice and easy to carry. However it loves 110 grains of 2F with the .570 PRB. I can tell you that a few extra pounds would not hurt a darned thing! :wink:


Geo. T.

 

[Wes/Tex]

I have a 7 1/2 pound 58 that is nice and easy to carry. However it loves 110 grains of 2F with the .570 PRB. I can tell you that a few extra pounds would not hurt a darned thing!

No kidding! When you remember that the old timers would double-dip the powder for a long shot, Hawken rifles could rattle your teeth...and I've done it! :wink:

 

[BrownBear]

I'm the proud owner of 4 other 58's to go with my 12# GRRW version, one of which is also a 7 1/2# model that likes stout charges. And Tooth Rattler or just Ole Rattler would be a pretty good name for it. :shocked2:

In contrast the 12# GRRW isn't at all unpleasant to pop of its best charge of 140 grains.

Having sold off all our horses some years ago, I have to admit that the GRRW gets plenty of range time but little hunting. But Ole Rattler gets a whole lot of hunting time and darned little range time. Modern math. :wink:

 

[eaglesnester]

Oh yes my son, talk about rattelen yur teeth. My 54 Great Plains Hunter loaded with a 450 grain cast bullet and 120 gr of holy black will knock yur johnson in the dirt. No fun at all. Even 90 to 100 gr is not so much fun after a few shots.
Cheers & Tighter Groups: Eaglesnester


Ever get lonely? For a woman, I mean? You mean a full time all night woman? Oh don't get me wrong pilgrim I do dearly love the womens.

 

[Billnpatti]

Wow! 120 grains is a HOT load. I have a custom built .54 plains style rifle that weighs in at around 9 pounds. It was built by a fellow by the name of Boltinghouse. I think his first name is Jim. One of its favorite loads is 55 grains of Goex 3f with a patched ball. I use A .530 ball and a .018 patch lubed with spit. I wipe exactly the same way between shots with a patch with plain old water on it. With a sandbag rest, I can put 10 shots into one ragged hole at 50 yards. Next, I want to try Dutch Schoultz' "dry" patches made with a 1:7 dilution of Ballistol in water.

 

[Snakebite]

Bill,
Probably Davy Boultinghouse if he was from Round Rock, TX. I have a Hawken built by him in 1978. It's a .54 cal with a 34" Douglas XX barrel. Davy worked up loads with me and for a 100yd plus, we came up with 110grs of 2F. Fairly stout but not intolerable. This rifle shoots great with 60grs at 25 and 75grs at 50 yards. I know a lot of people will say it's too much powder, but it's very accurate with these loads with a .535RB.
In addition to guns, Davy had some rock cutting machines and cut flints, hence, his shop was called "The Flint Shop". He also made knives and figured out he could make more money on knives and that's what he does now.
Chris

 

[Dphar]

People need to remember that in the 1830s-40s "squirrel rifles" in calibers under 36 often weighed over 10 pounds.
No not all Hawkens were huge compared to the later ones like the Bridger Hawken, some are very slim and trim for what they are. Are they as slim as a John Armstrong or a small Bedford County rifle with a tiny wrist? No. But they are very typical of the era in which they were made.
The modern definition of "huge" is often based on the length and weight on a modern sporting rifle which in most cases are too light.
Pedersoli's website shows the Maple stocked Hawken as weighing less than 9.5 pounds. Towards the lighter end of the scale for any original plains rifle.
So people need to inform themselves as to what they are looking at and understand its a 19th c design not a lightweight "mountain rifle" in 270.
Then understand that the people of 1820-1880 were generally in a lot better physical condition than we are.
My Don King "Hawken" weighs about 10-10.5 pounds I suspect.

Dan

 

[Dphar]

That Pederosli is 9.9 pounds regardless of caliber. The 54 has a 34" bbl the 50 is 32" and in Europe a 45 is available in 30".

I wanted the 54 but it is out of stock until 11/27
I ended up with a Uberti that is 8 lb 13 oz without a ramrod its 53cal with 32" bbl

Actually is close to 9.25 according to Pedersoli.

Dan

 

[Billnpatti]

Yep, I believe that's him. I bought the rifle from a mutual friend at WSB and he told me the maker's name but all I remembered was Boltinghouse. Glad to have it straight. I'd like to meet him someday and tell him what a fine rifle he made. Thanks for the correction. :thumbsup:

 

[Prairieofthedog]

There are 2 Hawken .50 caliber Pedersoli's at my local Cabelas.They are asking $630 apiece.And you are right they are heavy!! I think they weigh way more than 9-10 pounds.

 

[Snakebite]

I sent you a PM with his website. And I put Davy, it's actually Davie.