ASM 1851 Navy revolver

[Eutycus]

Any idea what size they originally were? And did you do anything to the forcing cone? Oh you seem knowledgeable. Is cream of wheat measured out in grains or just eyeballed? Like do you just pour "some" in the chamber or is there a set amount. I am aware too much would hamper the cylinder turning.

 

[arcticap]

No, I don't know the ball size the seller loaded it with.
And the gun wasn't altered at all by me nor by him AFAIK.
It would be better to measure the filler or Cream of Wheat for consistency, but whatever works the best for you should be okay.

Congratulations on firing your ASM.
You must have been tickled pink!

 

[Grenadier1758]

The filler should be measured in grains (volume). Use the difference between your load and a max load for the filler. You can use Cream of Wheat, Cream of Rice or corn meal. You don't have to use name brands.

 

[arcticap]

You could make a dipper out of a small cartridge case, and file it down to size if needed to use as a measure for the filler.
Some folks attach a piece of wire to it to use as a handle.

 

[8 BORE]

I use corn meal. Its more dense.
I use a 9 mm case souldered to a 40 sw case. The 9 holds 20 gr. 3f and the 40 holds 30 gr 3f.
I load the 9 with powder then load the 40 with corn meal then seat a .451 ball on top. The ball seats just below the mouth of the chambers.
Or you can switch to get a little stouter load. The volume will always be the same. Works great in my ASM 44.

 

[Eutycus]

 

[Bad Karma]

View attachment 3758

Nice! And safe mode too! Well played sir.

 

[Kansas Jake]

Eutycus, did you kill the wheel barrow?

 

[Eutycus]

Nope but I gave it a good scare.

 

[PonyXpress]

My grandpa passed away and left me a ASM .36 cal 1851 Navy black powder pistol. Unfortunately it did not come with the manual. Would anyone out there have a copy of the original manual?

I purchased a BP starter kit, but it says I still need to buy the powder and caps. The powder is sold locally, but how do I know which caps to buy?

I'm also searching for a good video that shows the proper way to load this pistol

 

[Grenadier1758]

When I bought my pistol, it didn't come with a manual. Back then there was no internet, only suppliers such as Dixie Gun Works and a few books on the subject. Do read the various postings on the subject here on the Forum.

This manual from Pietta will provide information that is pertinent for your revolver. Other than size of some of the parts it is applicable for handling, safety procedures and cleaning for your revolver. They do seem to recommend some very light powder charges for the revolvers. There are threads on the forum discussing powder charges, ball sizes and basic equipment needed.

http://www.pietta.us/pdf/Manuale_Avancarica_ENG.pdf
You will want to become familiar with the online catalogs from companies such as Track of the Wolf, Dixie Gun Works, Jedediah Starr and a few other suppliers for supplies such as a proper nipple wrench to remove nipples for cleaning, a set of gunsmith hollow ground screwdrivers (the screws are soft on these revolvers so a proper fitting screwdriver is needed, proper sized balls (0.380" diameter in my opinion), possible replacement nipples, and cleaning hardware. The best cleaning solution is tap water with a squirt of dishwashing soap You will want a rust inhibiting lubricant to protect the pistol after cleaning and before storage. The fouling from all powders suitable for shooting in your pistol is very corrosive, so cleaning after shooting is very important.

Did any accessories come with the pistol?

Caps for your pistol could be #10 or #11. I would suggest #10 Remington caps. GOEX 3fg black powder is what I would recommend and 18 grains measured by volume would be a reasonable starter charge. If real black powder is not available due to regulatory issues, then Triple Seven or Pyrodex P can be substituted.

Find a local traditional muzzle loading gun club in your area for the best information you can find to enjoy this hobby.

 

[Zonie]

My grandpa passed away and left me a ASM .36 cal 1851 Navy black powder pistol. Unfortunately it did not come with the manual. Would anyone out there have a copy of the original manual?

I purchased a BP starter kit, but it says I still need to buy the powder and caps. The powder is sold locally, but how do I know which caps to buy?

I'm also searching for a good video that shows the proper way to load this pistol

Make sure the lead roundballs are .375 in diameter. It should be marked on the container.
You can use either real black powder or one of the synthetic black powders like Pyrodex, Triple Se7en or similar powders. Make sure a synthetic mentions 'muzzleloading".
You cannot overfill the chamber. If it is filled to about 3/8" below the face of the cylinder to allow room for the ball, the gun will be safe to fire. Some people use less than that but the important thing to know is, the gun cannot be overloaded. There simply is not enough room in the chamber to create a dangerous condition.
I should modify that. Under NO circumstance should you EVER use a smokeless powder of any kind in your pistol. If you do, expect the pistol to blow up.

As for loading the gun, also remember: Do NOT pour the powder directly from the powder can, flask or horn into the chambers. First, pour the powder into a measure. Then pour the measured powder into the chamber. There is a very remote possibility that a smoldering ember could be in the chamber and if it is there, it can ignite the new powder that's being poured into the chamber.

To load, bring the hammer back to the "half cock" position. The cylinder should rotate freely in one direction but not in the other.
Pour the measured powder into the chamber.
Place the lead ball on the mouth of the chamber.
Rotate the cylinder so the ball is under the loading ram.
Release the loading lever and press down on it to force the ball into the chamber mouth.
Repeat this for the other chambers. (Most people only load 5 chambers so the hammer will be able to rest on the 6th, unloaded chamber for safety purposes. Others use the little pins on the rear of the cylinder by lowering the hammer so the nose of it straddles a pin. Remington shooters use the notches that are cut into the rear of the cylinder for the same purpose.)
Many people including me, like to put a layer of grease over the end of the loaded chambers. This serves to lubricate the bore of the gun when it fires.

Rotate the cylinder and place a percussion cap on the nipple of each loaded chamber. The cap should be a "snug fit" on the nipple when it is fully pushed into place.

Your pistol is ready to shoot.

Some poeple think black powder and percussion fired revolvers are "weak" and cannot be very dangerous. Nothing could be further from the truth.
There were tens of thousands of people killed with guns just like yours so, be careful.

 

[PonyXpress]

When I bought my pistol, it didn't come with a manual. Back then there was no internet, only suppliers such as Dixie Gun Works and a few books on the subject. Do read the various postings on the subject here on the Forum.

This manual from Pietta will provide information that is pertinent for your revolver. Other than size of some of the parts it is applicable for handling, safety procedures and cleaning for your revolver. They do seem to recommend some very light powder charges for the revolvers. There are threads on the forum discussing powder charges, ball sizes and basic equipment needed.

http://www.pietta.us/pdf/Manuale_Avancarica_ENG.pdf
You will want to become familiar with the online catalogs from companies such as Track of the Wolf, Dixie Gun Works, Jedediah Starr and a few other suppliers for supplies such as a proper nipple wrench to remove nipples for cleaning, a set of gunsmith hollow ground screwdrivers (the screws are soft on these revolvers so a proper fitting screwdriver is needed, proper sized balls (0.380" diameter in my opinion), possible replacement nipples, and cleaning hardware. The best cleaning solution is tap water with a squirt of dishwashing soap You will want a rust inhibiting lubricant to protect the pistol after cleaning and before storage. The fouling from all powders suitable for shooting in your pistol is very corrosive, so cleaning after shooting is very important.

Did any accessories come with the pistol?

Caps for your pistol could be #10 or #11. I would suggest #10 Remington caps. GOEX 3fg black powder is what I would recommend and 18 grains measured by volume would be a reasonable starter charge. If real black powder is not available due to regulatory issues, then Triple Seven or Pyrodex P can be substituted.

Find a local traditional muzzle loading gun club in your area for the best information you can find to enjoy this hobby.

Thank you so much! This is extremely helpful!

No accessories were found or they were just missed when they collected this gun to give to me. What would the ASM model normally come with?

 

[PonyXpress]

Thank you Zonie! Great info!

 

[Grenadier1758]

Nothing would have come with the pistol. Your Grandfather might have bought some accessories similar to what you have in your starter kit along with caps, balls and black powder.

 

[toot]

they are nice pistols.

 

[sawyer04]

I recently purchased a black powder revolver second hand from a pawn shop. It's a 44 caliber, brass framed ASM 1851Navy.

I have an Armo San Marco (ASM) dated 1983 that is a McCullough colt replica. I load up to 30 grains of triple f . It handles 454 round balls very well. However it has a steel frame.
I suggest investing in a good bench loader... In the past the cylinder arbor pulled loose from the frame. on the brass frame models. I always suspected that the loading lever had a good deal to do with the problem.
As far as parts I have found modern parts can be adopted with a little patience and hand tools.
Without getting in a bickering match, I would try that pistol with a 451 ball and 25 grains of triple f. Every weapon is different and no one charge or grains of lead will produce the same satisfactory results, or close enough, for every weapon. And hey, don't be afraid to try double f powder.
The nipples are of the metric, same as uberti and pietta. The length of the nipple may have to be adjusted with a little filing.
A lot of us have fiddled with these old replicas for a long time and by word of mouth, and trial and error have kept them firing with satisfactory results.

 

[springfield art]

I recently purchased a black powder revolver second hand from a pawn shop. It's a 44 caliber, brass framed ASM 1851Navy. I think I got fair deal on it as it only cost me $100.00 with the holster. I'm hoping it was taken good care of and not loaded with too hot of charges.It does appear that it was cleaned . I've yet to shoot it but that day is comming. I plan on keeping the loads under 20 grs.(brass!) Do you think round balls from wheel weight lead would be OK? Being second hand I didnt get the manual with it. Any suggestions on the bore size , chamber size and what size nipples. The nipples on the pistol seem to be the factory ones that originally came with the revolver. I also made a press so as not to "stretch" the frame when loading.

A writer for Muzzle Blasts magazine did a nice article on shooting brass framers. I'll see if I can find the details, name, etc., and forward to you. I have a nice steel frame 1851 ASM, along with an 1860 Army ASM, in the box from like over 20 years ago. Recently got a ctg. conversion for the 1860, it's the same specs as Uberti, per Guns of the Old West magazine.

 

[springfield art]

Now to another ASM question . I have read how this model is not up to par with the Pietta or the Uberti as far as metal hardness is concerned. But I've also heard how that is not really true.Does the ASM have a softer
metal than the other Italian repros?. I personally think it takes a back seat to no model in the looks department.

My ASM 1851 & 1860 Steel frame pistols are beautifully finished! I'm told Uberti bought out ASM some time back. Cheeze, I paid like $135 each over 25 years ago, now they're 300 at least!! You can't find hardly any 1860's for sale; hot demand!

 

[TFoley]

I buy balls for my pistols. Cheaper than investing in a mold and a pot, and ket's face it, it takes a lot of shooting for me to invest in a mold, handles, a dipper, and a pot.

You really DON'T shoot much, do you? On an average guest day I'd get through around 95 - 102 of 'em. There are twelve such occasion a year in our gun club, many others are the same....44cal swaged ball by Pedersoli are around $32/C. On an average guest day I'd get through around 95 - 102 of 'em.

I cast my own ball, using lead roofing off a local church - legally acquired, I hasten to add. Much of it is around 150 - 200 years old, and is soooooooo soft it's almost untrue.

Again, here in Europe as a whole wheel weights are not made of lead, and haven't been for many years, and way back when they were, the bullets made from them were great in modern unmentionable firearms, and totally unsuitable for a revolver that requires to be loaded unpatched into a close-fitting chamber.