Back up pistol in same caliber?

[zimmerstutzen]

Wounds heal. Chicks dig scars.

I have empirical knowledge that if you go into a bar busted up and bleeding, you can get free beer. I also have empirical knowledge that when you finally go to the ER after the bar closes, the nurse will not be amused and will energetically debride your wounds after telling you that it is gonna hurt. She may even bonk you in the cracked ribs a few times for good measure.

but hey! Free beer!

Didn't you hear? "Pain don't hurt!"

I once represented a very nice 3rd generation Hispanic immigrant in a workers comp case. He needed shoulder surgery and due to the extent, ended up with a nasty raised scar starting in the front of his shoulder and going over and down almost to the shoulder blade in the back. He healed up well and regained the strength in his arm and shoulder. The next summer he went to the pool with his kids and he took notice that suddenly people were much more polite to him. Suddenly the pool office knew who he was and let him in even when he forgot his pass. They would give his kids free candy. Apparently, a kid asked one of his kids what happened to his Dad's shoulder. His kid said his dad was attacked by a guy with an axe and he was still able to kill his attacker. My client really didn't like having people think he was a badass in the neighborhood.

 

[ravenousfishing]

Picked up a Traditions Trapper this season not so much as a backup but as an added opportunity. A couple of my ladder stands are situated such that a 25yd or less shot behind me and over my right shoulder is quite possible. Being right handed, that shot is quite awkward for me with a rifle, but requires less twisting and movement with a pistol. I don't notice carrying the extra weight in my backpack, and once in the tree it sits in the open bag in easy reach. Haven't gotten a shot with it yet but we still have some opportunities left this season.

 

[jefair1]

I always carried a back up pistol of some type, mainly for hogs of which Texas has an abundance. I did also dispatch a coyote that thought my deer was free lunch.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Short answer: don't bother.
I carried my Ruger Old Army for several hunts and gave up because of the extra weight. I have read articles by hunting guides who report many of their clients come to a hunt the first day with a 'back up' pistol but leave it in camp by the second day for the same reason.

 

[Jim in San Diego]

Do you all think that would work out ok, if one had to get off a finishing shot and didn't have enough time to re-load his/her rifle? I'm contemplating a Traditions Kentucky percussion in .50 to go along with my Lyman Trade Rifle for hunting and wasn't sure if anyone did this or not, or, if it was a good idea. As always appreciate thoughts and recommendations.

I use a 50 cal Pedersoli Bounty Hunter as a backup gun in California. The only problem is that the barrel is much tighter than my Lyman Great Plains and so I use a smaller ball for it.

 

[Nuthatch]

Not sure what the point would be for carrying a backup pistol as a muzzleloading anything unless it's the only thing you can legally carry at the time. I've taken second and even third shots with a ML rifle -- reloads only take 10-20 seconds if you have everything ready & well-practiced. That's plenty of time if the animal is down. And if it's not down, then you still need that rifle ready. If you're going to NEED a pistol, then you're probably going to need the best (modern) tool you have.

Nothing wrong with carrying a ML pistol, mind you. But unless it's meeting some legal requirement, it's really just a costume gag -- amusing but hardly a practical choice.

I don't know why I see ML pistols as distinctly different from ML rifles but I do. Either can be fun at the range. But I have a harder time seeing the pistols as something for any kind of serious work, including hunting. Maybe I'm missing something or just fail to appreciate the aesthetic.

 

[Jim in San Diego]

Not sure what the point would be for carrying a backup pistol as a muzzleloading anything unless it's the only thing you can legally carry at the time. I've taken second and even third shots with a ML rifle -- reloads only take 10-20 seconds if you have everything ready & well-practiced. That's plenty of time if the animal is down. And if it's not down, then you still need that rifle ready. If you're going to NEED a pistol, then you're probably going to need the best (modern) tool you have.

Nothing wrong with carrying a ML pistol, mind you. But unless it's meeting some legal requirement, it's really just a costume gag -- amusing but hardly a practical choice.

I don't know why I see ML pistols as distinctly different from ML rifles but I do. Either can be fun at the range. But I have a harder time seeing the pistols as something for any kind of serious work, including hunting. Maybe I'm missing something or just fail to appreciate the aesthetic.

In California during ML season, only ML weapons are allowed.

If you carry a modern pistol, the game warden will give you a poaching ticket and confiscate every weapon you’re carrying.

I agree the ML pistol is nothing compared to the long gun, but it’s better than relying on your belt knife.

 

[Nuthatch]

In California during ML season, only ML weapons are allowed.

If you carry a modern pistol, the game warden will give you a poaching ticket and confiscate every weapon you’re carrying.

I agree the ML pistol is nothing compared to the long gun, but it’s better than relying on your belt knife.

It's a bit more nuanced than that. CA doesn't have a ML season -- only ML and M/A tags. Under those tags, only ML rifles (not pistols) can be in possession. Technically, this would exclude smoothbores though I doubt anybody would raise a fuss about it. So a ML pistol or revolver is just as illegal as a centerfire pistol as a method of take during a ML only hunt. Neither meet the criteria of a rifle. For handguns, only centerfire pistols can actually be used to take game animals (353 e,f). So ML pistols and caplock revolvers aren't legal methods of take no matter what is being stuffed down the bore.

One of the exceptions is for CCW holders. You can't carry under a CCW permit during the archery deer season or with an AO tag but any other season, animal or tag is fair game for CCW carry. In fact, even without a permit, you can carry any firearm that is simply able to be concealed during any season other than archery only deer (354 h). It need not be concealed -- only capable of being concealed (how's that for clarity?).

All this just allows you to carry for personal protection under a permit but still requires the use of a rifle, bow or other legal method of take for actually taking of game, including any follow up shots. If you happen to take shots in self defense, then this would fall under the discretion of the warden to cite you and on the discretion of a judge should you be cited. I trust my local warden to be fair on things like this but not some of the wardens along the coast. Coastal people are fussy...

Another work-around for non-permit holders is to carry a pistol into the field only when not actually hunting. In other words, let's say I put an animal on the ground & have tagged it. Now I need to haul it back to my truck. At this point, I'm no longer hunting. On more than one occasion, I've gone back to camp, the truck or wherever to ditch some gear, leave my rifle, grab a meat-hauler pack, etc. and then take a pistol with me to retrieve the carcass in case a bear or cat moves in on my deer to claim it as its own & I don't see it in time. When I'm far off trail in the backcountry, I'll sometimes carry a pistol on me on the hike in (bow unstrung) and then simply leave it in the tent when I'm out hunting. Lots of work-arounds. When not actually hunting, you're free to carry whatever is legal to carry when you're just hiking.

But, again, permit holder or not, you're good to carry any concealable handgun anytime other than archery-only deer. But under no circumstances can you ever use a ML pistol to take any big game animal in CA, regardless of the season or tag.

Our ML hunting laws really show just how little the FGC understands about muzzleloaders.

 

[user 56392]

I like the idea but it sounds like a lot of extra weight. I do more spot and stalk hunting and never wanted the weight penalty.

 

[Notchy Bob]

It's a bit more nuanced than that. CA doesn't have a ML season -- only ML and M/A tags. Under those tags, only ML rifles (not pistols) can be in possession. Technically, this would exclude smoothbores though I doubt anybody would raise a fuss about it. So a ML pistol or revolver is just as illegal as a centerfire pistol as a method of take during a ML only hunt. Neither meet the criteria of a rifle. For handguns, only centerfire pistols can actually be used to take game animals (353 e,f). So ML pistols and caplock revolvers aren't legal methods of take no matter what is being stuffed down the bore.

One of the exceptions is for CCW holders. You can't carry under a CCW permit during the archery deer season or with an AO tag but any other season, animal or tag is fair game for CCW carry. In fact, even without a permit, you can carry any firearm that is simply able to be concealed during any season other than archery only deer (354 h). It need not be concealed -- only capable of being concealed (how's that for clarity?).

All this just allows you to carry for personal protection under a permit but still requires the use of a rifle, bow or other legal method of take for actually taking of game, including any follow up shots. If you happen to take shots in self defense, then this would fall under the discretion of the warden to cite you and on the discretion of a judge should you be cited. I trust my local warden to be fair on things like this but not some of the wardens along the coast. Coastal people are fussy...

Another work-around for non-permit holders is to carry a pistol into the field only when not actually hunting. In other words, let's say I put an animal on the ground & have tagged it. Now I need to haul it back to my truck. At this point, I'm no longer hunting. On more than one occasion, I've gone back to camp, the truck or wherever to ditch some gear, leave my rifle, grab a meat-hauler pack, etc. and then take a pistol with me to retrieve the carcass in case a bear or cat moves in on my deer to claim it as its own & I don't see it in time. When I'm far off trail in the backcountry, I'll sometimes carry a pistol on me on the hike in (bow unstrung) and then simply leave it in the tent when I'm out hunting. Lots of work-arounds. When not actually hunting, you're free to carry whatever is legal to carry when you're just hiking.

But, again, permit holder or not, you're good to carry any concealable handgun anytime other than archery-only deer. But under no circumstances can you ever use a ML pistol to take any big game animal in CA, regardless of the season or tag.

Our ML hunting laws really show just how little the FGC understands about muzzleloaders.

I don't anticipate hunting in California, but I found this a very interesting read, nonetheless. The complexities of some of these laws make my head spin.

Thank you for taking the time to post this. I think it's good for all of us to have an understanding of what's going on in other parts of the country than our own.

Notchy Bob

 

[skwerleater]

I took an old CVA pistol and cut the barrel down a bit and reduced the stock dimensions. Its very light and handles well to carry as a second. When I do period hunts or hunt during the Muzz. season where a muzz. is the only firearm allowed, it works well and I have used the second shot in the past.

 

[ORBushman]

I took an old CVA pistol and cut the barrel down a bit and reduced the stock dimensions. Its very light and handles well to carry as a second. When I do period hunts or hunt during the Muzz. season where a muzz. is the only firearm allowed, it works well and I have used the second shot in the past.

Dang, I really like that pistola!

 

[skwerleater]

SamtiamSam,
Thanks. You can still find those old CVA’s pretty reasonable. It doesn’t take much to dress it down and make into something a little different. I am not a gun maker and I pulled it off.

 

[ORBushman]

I ended up buying a Traditions Kentucky pistol kit in percussion. Actually just got the shipping notification today.

 

[skwerleater]

You will enjoy it

 

[longcruise]

I think a lot of the attraction to the pistol "sidekick" arises from the practice of some mountain men who carried one or even a pair for defense in close quarter fights. So maybe one or even two would be a good addition to a re enactors outfit but as so many have noted in this topic it's just baggage for we ml hunters in the 21st century period

I do have an exception in mind though. A light weight smooth bore pistol loaded with shot for small game encountered during the hunt? I have an FIE 45 pistol that I might turn into a 50 smooth bore for that purpose.

 

[Nuthatch]

I don't anticipate hunting in California, but I found this a very interesting read, nonetheless. The complexities of some of these laws make my head spin.

Thank you for taking the time to post this. I think it's good for all of us to have an understanding of what's going on in other parts of the country than our own.

Notchy Bob

Agreed. Hunting out of state makes me a little nervous at times. Different lands, different laws.

In chatting with somebody in AR once, it came up that CA doesn't have a hunter orange requirement.

She replied, "CA must not like hunters very much."
To that I could only say, "Bingo!"

 

[Hood2]

Pedersoli sells the bounty hunter.
Rice sells 13 inch barrels if you want to make one.

I just saw this post, thanks for the information! I knew about the Pedersoli bounty hunter, but not the Rice barrel. I'll have to check it out. Thanks again!

 

[Magungo1066]

View attachment 186014
Never shoot twice!

My uncle in his youth once made the mistake of not bringing enough rounds on a deer hunt. He wounded a deer in the spine and had to give it the knife treatment. He is one of those guys that has shot well over 200 deer in his life, and it had him take a 2-3 year hiatus…moral of the story is bring spare loads and make the first one count

 

[ETipp]

View attachment 186014
Never shoot twice!

I've been down that path a few times now. Very effective but ya gotta be careful with that tactic.