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Ballistics?
- Thread starter Puff
- Start date
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Someone else may be able to answer about that specific rifle, but as one generality, TC's ballistic charts shows 90grns FFg and a 230RB = 1761 mv (Goex and Pyrodex)
Their max load listed with 120grns FFg = 1983 mv
(Goex and Pyrodex)
Their max load listed with 120grns FFg = 1983 mv
(Goex and Pyrodex)
Guest
I think roundballs statistics from TC are close but there's only one way to really know and that is to run your load thru your rifle across a pair of chronograph screens. That eliminates all doubt. I use my chronograph extensively during load development for all my firearms. It's often very enlightening.
Vic
Vic
sharps4590 is right...it all has to do with pressure and barrel length. The only way you can know for sure is to go over some chronograph screens.
You know there is an old rule of thumb, and I have to say it's worked for me a time or two, with blackpowder a 'bleeding barrel' is the correct load for your firearm.
Voyageur
You know there is an old rule of thumb, and I have to say it's worked for me a time or two, with blackpowder a 'bleeding barrel' is the correct load for your firearm.
Voyageur
quote:Originally posted by Voyageur:
You know there is an old rule of thumb, and I have to say it's worked for me a time or two, with blackpowder a 'bleeding barrel' is the correct load for your firearm.How do you know if your barrel is bleeding?
What do you mean by the term "BLEEDING"?
Is it so much recoil that the barrel jumps and smacks you in the face and causes your nose to bleed all over your muzzleloader?
You know there is an old rule of thumb, and I have to say it's worked for me a time or two, with blackpowder a 'bleeding barrel' is the correct load for your firearm.How do you know if your barrel is bleeding?
What do you mean by the term "BLEEDING"?
Is it so much recoil that the barrel jumps and smacks you in the face and causes your nose to bleed all over your muzzleloader?
Oooops...sorry musketman & roundball. I should have had an explanation with that remark.
After you shoot, examime the bore of the barrel as much as you can without necessarily shining in a light. If you see small red deposits along the bore...that is a 'bleeding barrel'. Apparently it has to do with the pressure developed with that particular load. If the pressure is too low you will see small green deposits. While working up loads for various muzzle loaders I've made for myself and customers over the years, I've seen this occur.
Pressure, a result of gas expansion and ball inertia, is what we are all really speaking about. Pressure controls the burning rate of powder. The size and shape of the powder granules affects the burning rate as well. If the granules are too large and the pressure too low in black powder, you get large deposits left behind. This is why we're advised to match the powder to the bore size, ball weight and ball/patch fit. When the granules size is too fine the flame can streak through the granules and produce what is close to instant detonation. Powder manufacturers (especially smokeless) solve this problem by making single or double base powders, making the granules of different shapes and sizes and mixing in retardants to control burn rate. I believe that the original Pyrodex was simply black powder with a retardant that made it unreliable for flintlocks.
If you can see a flame out the muzzle of your firearm, you are seeing powder burning in midair.
After you shoot, examime the bore of the barrel as much as you can without necessarily shining in a light. If you see small red deposits along the bore...that is a 'bleeding barrel'. Apparently it has to do with the pressure developed with that particular load. If the pressure is too low you will see small green deposits. While working up loads for various muzzle loaders I've made for myself and customers over the years, I've seen this occur.
Pressure, a result of gas expansion and ball inertia, is what we are all really speaking about. Pressure controls the burning rate of powder. The size and shape of the powder granules affects the burning rate as well. If the granules are too large and the pressure too low in black powder, you get large deposits left behind. This is why we're advised to match the powder to the bore size, ball weight and ball/patch fit. When the granules size is too fine the flame can streak through the granules and produce what is close to instant detonation. Powder manufacturers (especially smokeless) solve this problem by making single or double base powders, making the granules of different shapes and sizes and mixing in retardants to control burn rate. I believe that the original Pyrodex was simply black powder with a retardant that made it unreliable for flintlocks.
If you can see a flame out the muzzle of your firearm, you are seeing powder burning in midair.
Guest
I'll be darned......I've been seeing that "reddish" stuff for years and never knew that's what it was called......thanks!!
Vic
Vic
The red is associated with the burning of the sulpher in the powder, burned sulpher will produce red deposits, I have not heard that pressure and such attribute to it showing in the bore of a ML gun, I have heard the term good burn associated with the forming of this red stuff maybe the same thing was meant.
OK...this came up in the old Buckskin Report many years ago and it was discussed at length.
Apparently it has to do with the way blackpowder burns. Blackpowder, as you know, is made from a very simple formula. The mix is really mechanical and anyone can do it. I believe that it has been described many times but the first time I read about it was in the old Foxfire books. (Good reading)
When the load is optimum for the bore and the weather conditions are nominal, the pressure leaves red deposits in the barrel. When it is too low, the deposits are green. I have seen both colors in my barrels and it seems that the red color corresponds with the optimum load.
You know, it feels like I'm trying to describe 'witching' water. I can 'witch' water and have done so many times. I've even located dry wells that needed to be worked on. I don't know why some can't do it but it works for me! This business about a 'bleeding barrel' seems to work as well but I'm not enough of a chemist to explain how the pressure causes the deposits to be certain colors.
I'm willing to listen to anyone who can give me a detailed explanation.
Voyageur
Apparently it has to do with the way blackpowder burns. Blackpowder, as you know, is made from a very simple formula. The mix is really mechanical and anyone can do it. I believe that it has been described many times but the first time I read about it was in the old Foxfire books. (Good reading)
When the load is optimum for the bore and the weather conditions are nominal, the pressure leaves red deposits in the barrel. When it is too low, the deposits are green. I have seen both colors in my barrels and it seems that the red color corresponds with the optimum load.
You know, it feels like I'm trying to describe 'witching' water. I can 'witch' water and have done so many times. I've even located dry wells that needed to be worked on. I don't know why some can't do it but it works for me! This business about a 'bleeding barrel' seems to work as well but I'm not enough of a chemist to explain how the pressure causes the deposits to be certain colors.
I'm willing to listen to anyone who can give me a detailed explanation.
Voyageur
This a new one to me also. I recently asked a technical question on another forum about pressure testing for maximum loads. Nobody could give me the answer I was looking for, including Mr. Getz of Getz barrels. These were all people who have been building guns for years. Nobody mentioned the bleeding barrel thing.
I myself have never noticed it and if I did I didn't pay it any attention. Maybe I should look closer.
I myself have never noticed it and if I did I didn't pay it any attention. Maybe I should look closer.
Guest
you know.....thinking back about this "bleeding barrel" thing, I never notice it when I'm shooting a match and my load is 60 grs. in my 54's but when I check my sights for my hunting load of 100 grs. I always see it. Common sense tells me it is pressure related. I'm trying to remember if I ever saw it in my BPC rifles and I honestly don't recall.....but then I'm loading from the breech so maybe I wouldn't. I will make a point to look next time because obviuosly a 400-480 grain projectile would increase pressure.....but then I'm not shooting a patched round ball either.....hmmmmmm.....better make some notes to take notes!!!
Vic
Vic
