-
Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.
We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.
Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103
Ballistol puzzlement
- Thread starter Rifleman1776
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
7
BALLISTOL AND "BIODEGRADABILITY"
The Concept of Biodegradability
The concept of biodegradability must be considered under two entirely different aspects: the scientific aspect and the legal aspect.
Scientifically 'biodegradable' means that a susbstance disintegrates under the influence of the elements and/or of microbes (bacteria) or fungi into components, which are normal constituents of the environment and occur in nature, naturally, so to speak. One must distinguish between aerobic and anaerobic biodegradation, i.e. degradation in the presence of oxygen and in its absence. Since under normal circumstances all degradation of materials happens, more or less, in the presence of oxygen, biodegradation is normally aerobic biodegradation.
Biodegradation must be distinguished from photodegradation. Photodegradation is the decomposition of a substance under the impact of light, mostly ultraviolet light.
Legislators have come up with a multitude of definitions of biodegradability, which have often nothing to do with the scientific concept of biodegradability. Indeed, some legal definitions of biodegradability seem to ignore the most elementary facts about natural decomposition. Typically, legal concepts of biodegradability will bring the factor of time into the definition and rule that something cannot be called or labelled "biodegradable" if it takes it longer to biodegrade than the period of time allowed for in the law. Or they will define extremely narrowly, exactly into what substances a product is allowed to decompose. Some laws combine both criteria. A typical example for this kind of approach is the definition of biodegradability of the State of California. The California Statute defines: "'Biodegradable' means that a material has the proven capability to decompose in the most common environment where the material is disposed within one year through natural biological processes into non toxic carbonaceous soil, water or carbon dioxide."
Obviously, some of nature's own products would not be biodegradable under this definition such as leaves, lawn clippings, feathers, bones, wood or the exoskeletons of insects.
The California definition of biodegradability is the most restrictive one so far. However, it applies only to unspecific claims of biodegradability. Most other State laws concerning biodegradability are either copies of the California Statute or are less restrictive or they do not apply to products but only to packaging material. The only federal regulation about biodegradability currently in effect is that of the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC rules that a substance can be called biodegradable or photodegradable, if it can be "... substantiated by competent and reliable scientific evidence that the entire product or package will completely break down and return to nature, i.e. decompose into elements found in nature within a reasonably short period of time after customary disposal."
The Components of Ballistol
While the FTC demands that the product must "break down and return to nature" it does apparently not consider the possibility that a product might consist of components which are already natural substances or their equivalents. Many of the substances, which are found in nature, are complex chemicals and they are broken down into other chemicals, when they decompose. For example: when an apple decomposes, alcohols form, which decompose into other chemicals or react with other chemicals to form tertiary compounds. It appears to be within the logic of the FTC's definition that there would be no need to prove the break down and
8
return to nature for any substance, which is already a natural substance or its equivalent.
Ballistol contains the following ingredients:
Mineral Oil
Potassium Oleate
Ammonium Oleate
Oleic Acid
Benzyl Alcohol
Amyl Alcohol
Isobutyl Alcohol
Benzyl Acetate
Anethole
Isohexane (aerosol only)
These substances are either natural substances or they are the chemical equivalents of natural substances. For example: an alcohol is a natural substance regardless of whether is was produced in a laboratory, in a destillery or in a rotting apple under an apple tree.
The Decomposition of the Components of Ballistol
While there can hardly be any reasonable doubt that a natural substance can "return to nature", there is only very scarce literature about the biodegradation of natural substances. The reason is obvious: why would anybody bother to prove that natural substances are part of the process of nature? To write a scientific publication proving that apples can rot, would appear like a hoax. The components contained in Ballistol decompose in the following fashion:
Mineral Oil (Liquid Paraffin)
Most paraffin-based lubricants contain a dirty or even chlorinated paraffin, which is toxic and has a tendency to gum up and harden. If it decomposes, it releases chlorine into nature. By contrast, the paraffin used in Ballistol is highly purified and not chlorinated. Indeed, it is so clean that it conforms to the specifications of the United States Pharmacopeia section XX-NP-XV for medicinal grade paraffin, as is used for the production of medicinal ointments and creams or cosmetics. Paraffin of this degree of purity is not considered hazardous for water. It is, in fact, the equivalent of natural vegetal (plant) wax, as it is produced by many plants and found on the leaves of most leaf bearing plants. The biodegradability of this type of paraffin is self-evident, however, it may take up to 24 months for it to completely biodegrade.
Potassium Oleate and Ammonium Oleate
Potassium Oleate is the Potassium salt of Oleic Acid. Ammonium Oleate is its Ammonium salt. When exposed to water for an extended period of time both compounds split into Potassium ions, respectively Ammonium ions, and Oleic Acid. This is what happens, when Ballistol emulsifies with water. Potassium ions are naturally found in ocean water and clear water, whereas Ammonium ions result from the natural (bacterial) decomposition of urine and feces in combination with water. They are naturally transformed into nitrates, which are also known as fertilizers for plants. The process is the equivalent to what happens, when a farmer fertilizes a field with cow dung.
Oleic Acid
Oleic Acid is a fatty acid and a natural component of all oils and fats, e.g. olive oil or butter. In the natural cycle of decomposition these oils and fats are split into fatty acids and glycerine, which are both either transformed by baterial action into CO2 and water or absorbed by the bacteria to support their own growth and reproduction. In fact, this is the basic process of natural fermentation of all organic tissue. The biodegradability of Oleic Acid is self-evident.
9
Benzyl Alcohol, Amyl Alcohol and Isobutyl Alcohol
Alcohols are products of natural fermentation on the basis of protein, starch or sugar. Benzyl Alcohol develops, when Benzyl Acetate breaks down into Benzyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid. Amyl Alcohol and Isobutyl Alcohol are the products of natural fermentation of fruit. They occur in all distilled alcoholic beverages, e.g. brandies. Their biodegradability is self-evident.
Benzyl Acetate
Benzyl Acetate occurs in nature in a number of fragrant substances, especially in Jasmine. It decomposes into Benzyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid, both natural substances. Its biodegradability is self-evident.
Anethole
Anethole is the essential oil from the seeds of Pimpinella anisum L., a shrub which grows around the Mediterranean and in South and Central America. Anethole is a medicinal oil. Its many medicinal uses have been described by the ancient Persian and Greek physicians. As a plant oil of natural origin its biodegradability is self-evident.
Isohexane
Isohexane, a pure hydrocarbon, is used in Ballistol-Lube aerosols to improve the sprayability of the highly viscose Ballistol. Isohexane as used in Ballistol aerosol cans contains less than 3% n-Hexane. It is, therefore, non-toxic for warm-blooded organisms. Isohexane photodegrades in the atmosphere within approximately 20-25 days into water and CO2.
Biodegradability Tests
Some competing products (e.g. CRC 5-56) claim that they are biodegradable as specified by the "Bartha-Pramer Test of Biodegradability". This test is a California special. It is not a closed-bottle test and it does not conform with internationally recognized OECD standards. It is not generally recognized by US regulating agencies.
Ballistol has been tested in OECD approved closed-bottle tests and was found to biodegrade resp. photodegrade within approximately 24 months in aerobic decomposition and at ambient temperatures of 18 C.
BALLISTOL AND "BIODEGRADABILITY"
The Concept of Biodegradability
The concept of biodegradability must be considered under two entirely different aspects: the scientific aspect and the legal aspect.
Scientifically 'biodegradable' means that a susbstance disintegrates under the influence of the elements and/or of microbes (bacteria) or fungi into components, which are normal constituents of the environment and occur in nature, naturally, so to speak. One must distinguish between aerobic and anaerobic biodegradation, i.e. degradation in the presence of oxygen and in its absence. Since under normal circumstances all degradation of materials happens, more or less, in the presence of oxygen, biodegradation is normally aerobic biodegradation.
Biodegradation must be distinguished from photodegradation. Photodegradation is the decomposition of a substance under the impact of light, mostly ultraviolet light.
Legislators have come up with a multitude of definitions of biodegradability, which have often nothing to do with the scientific concept of biodegradability. Indeed, some legal definitions of biodegradability seem to ignore the most elementary facts about natural decomposition. Typically, legal concepts of biodegradability will bring the factor of time into the definition and rule that something cannot be called or labelled "biodegradable" if it takes it longer to biodegrade than the period of time allowed for in the law. Or they will define extremely narrowly, exactly into what substances a product is allowed to decompose. Some laws combine both criteria. A typical example for this kind of approach is the definition of biodegradability of the State of California. The California Statute defines: "'Biodegradable' means that a material has the proven capability to decompose in the most common environment where the material is disposed within one year through natural biological processes into non toxic carbonaceous soil, water or carbon dioxide."
Obviously, some of nature's own products would not be biodegradable under this definition such as leaves, lawn clippings, feathers, bones, wood or the exoskeletons of insects.
The California definition of biodegradability is the most restrictive one so far. However, it applies only to unspecific claims of biodegradability. Most other State laws concerning biodegradability are either copies of the California Statute or are less restrictive or they do not apply to products but only to packaging material. The only federal regulation about biodegradability currently in effect is that of the Federal Trade Commission. The FTC rules that a substance can be called biodegradable or photodegradable, if it can be "... substantiated by competent and reliable scientific evidence that the entire product or package will completely break down and return to nature, i.e. decompose
The Components of Ballistol
While the FTC demands that the product must "break down and return to nature" it does apparently not consider the possibility that a product might consist of components which are already natural substances or their equivalents. Many of the substances, which are found in nature, are complex chemicals and they are broken down into other chemicals, when they decompose. For example: when an apple decomposes, alcohols form, which decompose into other chemicals or react with other chemicals to form tertiary compounds. It appears to be within the logic of the FTC's definition that there would be no need to prove the break down and
8
return to nature for any substance, which is already a natural substance or its equivalent.
Ballistol contains the following ingredients:
Mineral Oil
Potassium Oleate
Ammonium Oleate
Oleic Acid
Benzyl Alcohol
Amyl Alcohol
Isobutyl Alcohol
Benzyl Acetate
Anethole
Isohexane (aerosol only)
These substances are either natural substances or they are the chemical equivalents of natural substances. For example: an alcohol is a natural substance regardless of whether is was produced in a laboratory, in a destillery or in a rotting apple under an apple tree.
The Decomposition of the Components of Ballistol
While there can hardly be any reasonable doubt that a natural substance can "return to nature", there is only very scarce literature about the biodegradation of natural substances. The reason is obvious: why would anybody bother to prove that natural substances are part of the process of nature? To write a scientific publication proving that apples can rot, would appear like a hoax. The components contained in Ballistol decompose in the following fashion:
Mineral Oil (Liquid Paraffin)
Most paraffin-based lubricants contain a dirty or even chlorinated paraffin, which is toxic and has a tendency to gum up and harden. If it decomposes, it releases chlorine into nature. By contrast, the paraffin used in Ballistol is highly purified and not chlorinated. Indeed, it is so clean that it conforms to the specifications of the United States Pharmacopeia section XX-NP-XV for medicinal grade paraffin, as is used for the production of medicinal ointments and creams or cosmetics. Paraffin of this degree of purity is not considered hazardous for water. It is, in fact, the equivalent of natural vegetal (plant) wax, as it is produced by many plants and found on the leaves of most leaf bearing plants. The biodegradability of this type of paraffin is self-evident, however, it may take up to 24 months for it to completely biodegrade.
Potassium Oleate and Ammonium Oleate
Potassium Oleate is the Potassium salt of Oleic Acid. Ammonium Oleate is its Ammonium salt. When exposed to water for an extended period of time both compounds split into Potassium ions, respectively Ammonium ions, and Oleic Acid. This is what happens, when Ballistol emulsifies with water. Potassium ions are naturally found in ocean water and clear water, whereas Ammonium ions result from the natural (bacterial) decomposition of urine and feces in combination with water. They are naturally transformed into nitrates, which are also known as fertilizers for plants. The process is the equivalent to what happens, when a farmer fertilizes a field with cow dung.
Oleic Acid
Oleic Acid is a fatty acid and a natural component of all oils and fats, e.g. olive oil or butter. In the natural cycle of decomposition these oils and fats are split into fatty acids and glycerine, which are both either transformed by baterial action into CO2 and water or absorbed by the bacteria to support their own growth and reproduction. In fact, this is the basic process of natural fermentation of all organic tissue. The biodegradability of Oleic Acid is self-evident.
9
Benzyl Alcohol, Amyl Alcohol and Isobutyl Alcohol
Alcohols are products of natural fermentation on the basis of protein, starch or sugar. Benzyl Alcohol develops, when Benzyl Acetate breaks down into Benzyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid. Amyl Alcohol and Isobutyl Alcohol are the products of natural fermentation of fruit. They occur in all distilled alcoholic beverages, e.g. brandies. Their biodegradability is self-evident.
Benzyl Acetate
Benzyl Acetate occurs in nature in a number of fragrant substances, especially in Jasmine. It decomposes into Benzyl Alcohol and Acetic Acid, both natural substances. Its biodegradability is self-evident.
Anethole
Anethole is the essential oil from the seeds of Pimpinella anisum L., a shrub which grows around the Mediterranean and in South and Central America. Anethole is a medicinal oil. Its many medicinal uses have been described by the ancient Persian and Greek physicians. As a plant oil of natural origin its biodegradability is self-evident.
Isohexane
Isohexane, a pure hydrocarbon, is used in Ballistol-Lube aerosols to improve the sprayability of the highly viscose Ballistol. Isohexane as used in Ballistol aerosol cans contains less than 3% n-Hexane. It is, therefore, non-toxic for warm-blooded organisms. Isohexane photodegrades in the atmosphere within approximately 20-25 days into water and CO2.
Biodegradability Tests
Some competing products (e.g. CRC 5-56) claim that they are biodegradable as specified by the "Bartha-Pramer Test of Biodegradability". This test is a California special. It is not a closed-bottle test and it does not conform with internationally recognized OECD standards. It is not generally recognized by US regulating agencies.
Ballistol has been tested in OECD approved closed-bottle tests and was found to biodegrade resp. photodegrade within approximately 24 months in aerobic decomposition and at ambient temperatures of 18 C.
Va.Manuf.06
58 Cal.
sidelock said:
Ditto. Okay, so for me only 55 or 60 years but.... (We're all getting old, right?) :hatsoff:
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
Previous post is from Ballistol’s MSDS
The reason I posted it was that I thought it was interesting that it decomposes in less than 24 months and some of the ingredients turn into nitrate and acids
The reason I posted it was that I thought it was interesting that it decomposes in less than 24 months and some of the ingredients turn into nitrate and acids
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
Take it with a grain of salt.
ballistol starts out with a relatively high PH
so it is possible that it could be self neutralizing.
ballistol starts out with a relatively high PH
so it is possible that it could be self neutralizing.
"Self neutralizing" and left my lock as dry as a popcorn fart, making it unusable until I put a few drops of 3in1 oil on the moving parts.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
Like they said Biodegradeable within 24 months.
guess they weren't kidding. :rotf:
guess they weren't kidding. :rotf:
Personally, I don't want a biodegradeable rust protectant.
I would much rather have something that doesn't degrade at all doing that important job.
My dealings with it indicates that Birchwood Casey Sheath and Barricade are better than the Energizer Bunny. They just keep on working, for years. :grin:
I would much rather have something that doesn't degrade at all doing that important job.
My dealings with it indicates that Birchwood Casey Sheath and Barricade are better than the Energizer Bunny. They just keep on working, for years. :grin:
Ive tried Ballistol, personally I couldn't get past the smell of it. I've been using the Doutch Shoultz "waterless cleaning method" for a couple of years now and have had GREAT results.. WD-40 is my main lubricant and rust preventative in the barrel.. OK.. I'm ducking now!!!
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
No need to duck!
Ok ballistol, WD-40 fans and the like,
I just may have found the answer to our prayers the product we have been looking for.
http://youtu.be/IPM8OR6W6WE
http://youtu.be/BvTkefJHfC0
Ok ballistol, WD-40 fans and the like,
I just may have found the answer to our prayers the product we have been looking for.
http://youtu.be/IPM8OR6W6WE
http://youtu.be/BvTkefJHfC0
Don Steele
45 Cal.
Interesting video. Especially the sheet of green water.... :shocked2:
Despite the fact that I am one of those "Ballistol Fans" I'd not be using "Ultra-Ever Dry".
Actually, I've never had any problems using Ballistol, sorry to hear of everyone else's issues.
I like it.
Despite the fact that I am one of those "Ballistol Fans" I'd not be using "Ultra-Ever Dry".
Actually, I've never had any problems using Ballistol, sorry to hear of everyone else's issues.
I like it.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2013
- Messages
- 20,091
- Reaction score
- 1,023
Remember the TV show "Kids Say The Darnedest Things" with Bill Cosby.
reminds me of that. :rotf:
reminds me of that. :rotf:
I also remember the show (same name) before Cosby hosted by Art Linkletter... but I'm old. :grin:
bpd303 said:
Yup! Art Linkletter was the one I remember. And yes, I'm old too!
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Rick Boylan
45 Cal.
- Joined
- Mar 24, 2014
- Messages
- 832
- Reaction score
- 8
Heck, I remember Art Linkletter too. He was better in my opinion. For what that's worth. :grin:
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2013
- Messages
- 121
- Reaction score
- 4
Ballistol yes, as per Dutch Schultz's book, for patch lube only. WD 40 for weapon storage.
That having been said, nothing will replace regular inspection/maintenance program.
That having been said, nothing will replace regular inspection/maintenance program.
Ballistol was developed by the Germans in the late 1800's.
It was used for cleaning both inside and out.
As far as storage is concerned the last time I cleaned my rifles was at the range using Moose milk to soften and remove all BP residue and then coat with WD 40.
Manyyears later, both rifles are in excellent shape in Humid st. lous.
Dutch Schoultz
It was used for cleaning both inside and out.
As far as storage is concerned the last time I cleaned my rifles was at the range using Moose milk to soften and remove all BP residue and then coat with WD 40.
Manyyears later, both rifles are in excellent shape in Humid st. lous.
Dutch Schoultz
