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Barrel Length
- Thread starter gunbug
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longcruise
70 Cal.
Guess I'd be looking at handling and weight issues. If you go with a 1" barrel in .54 at 42" long, it's going to be fairly heavy.
Depends a lot on what you plan to use it for.
Depends a lot on what you plan to use it for.
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I'm assuming you're talking about a St Louis Hawken? I have a 1" x 38" 54cal half stock that tips the scale at 9.9 lbs. Gettin kinda heavy. I would stick with the 36" bbl., I think anything over 38" or so would have yo be swamped. Just an opinion.. :v
longcruise
70 Cal.
If you plan to hunt and want the 42" barrel, then I'd go with a 15/16th barrel. Course it's up to you since you will carry it! 
I hunt the Colorado rockies and would not feel a 42" to be hard to use in the mtns unless the whole package was over about 8.5 to 9 lbs, but that's just me.
Just for comparison, here are the barrel weights of some GM barrels:
.54, 15/16th, 36" = 4.93
.54, 15/16th, 42" = 5.75
.54, 1", 36" = 5.95
Could not find a weight for a 1" .54 42" long.
Also, make sure Track has the barrel in stock and allocates it to your order. Otherwise you may be on back-order for a long time!
I hunt the Colorado rockies and would not feel a 42" to be hard to use in the mtns unless the whole package was over about 8.5 to 9 lbs, but that's just me.
Just for comparison, here are the barrel weights of some GM barrels:
.54, 15/16th, 36" = 4.93
.54, 15/16th, 42" = 5.75
.54, 1", 36" = 5.95
Could not find a weight for a 1" .54 42" long.
Also, make sure Track has the barrel in stock and allocates it to your order. Otherwise you may be on back-order for a long time!
Gunbug,
If you can afford it, spend a little more $$ for the Don Stith kit with the tapered barrel:
http://www.donstith.com/j_s_full_stock.html
His kits are more correct with hardware castings taken off original J&S Hawken rifles. This gun would probably date from the late 1830's through the mid 1840's. The hardware on the TOW kit is actually later than Don's. That flat to the wrist guard is likely mid-1840s and later. The tapered barrel on Don's kit will balance a heck of a lot better and be a lot lighter than the 1" straight which is Track's only option. The barrel Don uses is tapered from 1" at the breech to 7/8" at the muzzle and is 36" long. It will weigh the same as a 15/16" straight barrel, but will feel lighter in the hands because of better balance. Hawkens of this period generally had barrels ranging from about 36-44" with an average of probably 38-39".
On second thought, if you can't afford Don's kit I would wait and save my $$ until I could afford it.
One note of caution though, neither the TOW kit or Don's kit are the easiest guns to put together. Hooked breeches, long tangs, and keys make things a bit more difficult than your standard PA/KY rifle. Its not undoable, though. Also, the devil is in the details on Hawkens. Study originals in books and on-line to try to get the stock shaping right. The Buffalo Bill Cody site has some guns on-line and there are several books out there.
Good luck with your project.
Sean
If you can afford it, spend a little more $$ for the Don Stith kit with the tapered barrel:
http://www.donstith.com/j_s_full_stock.html
His kits are more correct with hardware castings taken off original J&S Hawken rifles. This gun would probably date from the late 1830's through the mid 1840's. The hardware on the TOW kit is actually later than Don's. That flat to the wrist guard is likely mid-1840s and later. The tapered barrel on Don's kit will balance a heck of a lot better and be a lot lighter than the 1" straight which is Track's only option. The barrel Don uses is tapered from 1" at the breech to 7/8" at the muzzle and is 36" long. It will weigh the same as a 15/16" straight barrel, but will feel lighter in the hands because of better balance. Hawkens of this period generally had barrels ranging from about 36-44" with an average of probably 38-39".
On second thought, if you can't afford Don's kit I would wait and save my $$ until I could afford it.
One note of caution though, neither the TOW kit or Don's kit are the easiest guns to put together. Hooked breeches, long tangs, and keys make things a bit more difficult than your standard PA/KY rifle. Its not undoable, though. Also, the devil is in the details on Hawkens. Study originals in books and on-line to try to get the stock shaping right. The Buffalo Bill Cody site has some guns on-line and there are several books out there.
Good luck with your project.
Sean
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Thank's for the link. Not to worry though this will be my second kit and will not be my last. If i get good at wood working etc i hope to eventually build my rifles from scratch like my dad did. I have some of his home made tools.My wife want's to get involved she will be the woodworker. Dan
zimmerstutzen
70 Cal.
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Aside from period correcctness, barrel length is also based on a factor of sight radius and the length of bore necessary to optimumly burn the intended powder charges.
For instance in a 21 inch barrel 50 cal, thee optimum powder charge is around 80 grains, above that the excess is largely burned in muzzle flash and wasted. Now in a 54, there is the factorr that there is more diameter bore for the powder to burn in and there fore less waste of powder for the same length barrel.
You can also reach the point where a barrel is too long and the ball actually starts losing muzzle velocity. You can figure this out by checking ballistics tables, for instance the Lyman Black Powder Handbook, 1st ed. Frankly, 100 grains and perhaps a bit more will be consumed pretty well in a 36 inch barrel. In a 42 inch barrel the ball may start slowing down.
From the Lyman book I found the following for 54 round balls.
28 inch barrel 3fg Goex
50 grains 1125 ft/s
70 grains 1375 Ft/s
100 grains 1605 ft/s
140 grains 1895
34 inch barrel
50 grains 1247 ft/s
70 grains 1439 ft/s
100 grains 1662 ft/s
140 grains 1973 ft/s
43 inch barrel
50 grains 1295 ft/s
70 grains 1527 ft/s
100 grains 1740 ft/s
140 grains 2113 ft/s
a 40 grain load has nearly the same velocity when fired out of a 28, a 34 or 43 inch barrel
going from the 28 to the 34 to the 43 inch barrels for a 100 grain charge gives a 57 ft/s increase to a 80 ft per sec increase from 34 to 43
you have to decide whether the extra barrel weight is worth the extra 5 to 7% velocity. Keep in mind, that once you get over the speed of sound, the ball also slows down faster than a slower moving ball., so at higher velocities, the extra few ft/s of muzzle velocity is partially lost by the time the ball reaches 125 yds.
Here in the east, we don't have the wide open shots and for deer, we don't need that extra oomph, However, we often end up walking through brush and trees where a longer barrel can be a real disadvantage, especially if it is heavy.
If you are doing less walking through brush, or just plain less walking, the longer heavier barrel may not matter.
For instance in a 21 inch barrel 50 cal, thee optimum powder charge is around 80 grains, above that the excess is largely burned in muzzle flash and wasted. Now in a 54, there is the factorr that there is more diameter bore for the powder to burn in and there fore less waste of powder for the same length barrel.
You can also reach the point where a barrel is too long and the ball actually starts losing muzzle velocity. You can figure this out by checking ballistics tables, for instance the Lyman Black Powder Handbook, 1st ed. Frankly, 100 grains and perhaps a bit more will be consumed pretty well in a 36 inch barrel. In a 42 inch barrel the ball may start slowing down.
From the Lyman book I found the following for 54 round balls.
28 inch barrel 3fg Goex
50 grains 1125 ft/s
70 grains 1375 Ft/s
100 grains 1605 ft/s
140 grains 1895
34 inch barrel
50 grains 1247 ft/s
70 grains 1439 ft/s
100 grains 1662 ft/s
140 grains 1973 ft/s
43 inch barrel
50 grains 1295 ft/s
70 grains 1527 ft/s
100 grains 1740 ft/s
140 grains 2113 ft/s
a 40 grain load has nearly the same velocity when fired out of a 28, a 34 or 43 inch barrel
going from the 28 to the 34 to the 43 inch barrels for a 100 grain charge gives a 57 ft/s increase to a 80 ft per sec increase from 34 to 43
you have to decide whether the extra barrel weight is worth the extra 5 to 7% velocity. Keep in mind, that once you get over the speed of sound, the ball also slows down faster than a slower moving ball., so at higher velocities, the extra few ft/s of muzzle velocity is partially lost by the time the ball reaches 125 yds.
Here in the east, we don't have the wide open shots and for deer, we don't need that extra oomph, However, we often end up walking through brush and trees where a longer barrel can be a real disadvantage, especially if it is heavy.
If you are doing less walking through brush, or just plain less walking, the longer heavier barrel may not matter.
Looks like you already made your decision, but just to give you an idea I have a Virginia in .58 with a straight 36" 1 inch barrel and the rifle comes in just shy of 9 lbs. It balances just fine, but adding any length to the barrel would justify getting a swamped barrel.
ohio ramrod
75 Cal.
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It really is a matter of which would fit you better. I personally believe if you can balance it the longer the barrel the better. Why? Because it will give you a longer sighting radius which is important as you get older and start moving the rear sight further up the barrel so you can see it.Two years ago a long time friend died and left me a gun I had sold him about thirty years ago. When I sold it to him I could put three balls in the same enlarged hole at 35 yrds, now I cann't even focus on the sights enough to try shooting it.My target rifle has had the rear sight moved three times as the years went by, and if I was still trying to be a competive shooter it would need to be moved again
Gunbug, I have a TOW fullstock Hawken 39"bbl 1" thick 54. It is a bit hvy @12.5 lbs. but once you settle it in and fire it shoots exceptionally well. It liked @55gr 3f hated 2f and does not like ball with a big sprue. I had a wild hair one day and stepped the charge up to 90 gr 3f and the recoil barely nudged me. Interestingly the group off hand shrank to @2 1/2 " at 25yds, guess I was holding a lot tighter expecting to be thumped. Start upper body weight lifting now, if you hold it out there for more'n 5 seconds I start to quiver!
I have a fullstock Southern mountain rifle with a 1" - 42" long barrel in 54 caliber. Weighs about 9-1/2 lbs. The weight is way forward of my front hand. I practiced bringing it up and holding to my shoulder. I once had a buck come into my sight 100 yards away. It was angling towards me and didn't see me. I brought the gun up to my shoulder so it wouldn't see my movement when it got closer. It was a long wait and before it got closer to me I was tiring. If you want to get something that heavy out front you may want to have a rest handy. I was able to get a doe with it later, but it was pretty much a snap shot.
