Barrel pins that can't be removed

[Eric Krewson]

I have a mighty fine rifle a friend gave me that was made in the early 70s. I asked my friend if he ever took the barrel out to check for corrosion. He said he tried once but the pins would drive in a little on one side but not move on the other side of the stock indicating they probably bent in the middle. My friend is no stranger to flintlocks having built a number of them, owned plenty of originals and contemporary flintlock rifles, including the rifle in question.

Today I checked to see if what he told me was correct,no pin movement with a moderate tap. My punch will go about 1/2" into the hole below before it hits anything.

Pins are visible on only one side of the stock.

Any secretes to possibly dislodge these stuck pins?

 

[peter hawbaker]

I really do not have any secrets, sorry. It sounds like he is pretty knowledgeable and he was not able to get it done. Any method probably runs a pretty good risk of damaging the stock.

Not your question, but I personally do not think it necessary to remove the barrel to check for corrosion. If a rifle is cared for (ie, not left out in the weather for years) I just dont believe that there would be enough corrosion under the stock to ever be detrimental to the safety or value of the rifle.

Just my opinion, but in my mind, it is not worth the risk of damaging your rifle to check for something that should never be a problem.

 

[necchi]

Maybe others will have a trick but I'm inclined to agree with roklok here, there's a risk involved I wouldn't take.
The olde adadge;
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Would certainly apply in my case.

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

Could very well be a tapered pin, installs and removes from one side only. If this is the case it would probably be from the same side as the lock bolts.

This stock has probably taken on moisture and has closed up a bit around the pins, bad deal.

I am not a believer in the "leave the barrel in the wood camp" , if they were never intended to be removed they would have been installed with blind holes. :hmm:

I know how I would go about resolving this but I am sure there is no reason to ever remove this barrel as there is no possible way that there could be any corrosion present. :idunno:

Good Luck

 

[Eric Krewson]

There is more to the story. I can see a bunch of accuglass around the nose cap, perhaps the pins are glassed in.

I had thought of reshaping the stock somewhere down the road. It doesn't have defined lock panels now, lots of extra wood. I have the skills for an overhaul but need to pull the barrel to do so.

 

[roundball]

Today I checked to see if what he told me was correct,no pin movement with a moderate tap. My punch will go about 1/2" into the hole below before it hits anything.

Not asking this with any implication that I know anything...just curious:
Do all the pins act the same way...ie: do the others push on through and you're just having trouble with this one pin in the photo?

 

Roundball has a good point Eric. Also I would try using a piece of dowel in the RR channel, with a clamp to the barrel to compress the barrel into the stock, then try punching it out. The compression may take off ant resistance. I had a very old original that hat a groove worn into the pin from all the years of shooting, because the tenon was not relieved. I'm a believer in slotting the tenon for recoil as well as variables in humidity.

Bill

 

[LRB]

Geeeez Bill. Did ya havta bring up tennon slotting right after RBs post? :idunno: You gunna get RB all riled up agin, and end up on his iGnore list long sida me. :rotf:

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

You gunna get RB all riled up agin, and end up on his iGnore list long sida me. :rotf:

I am trying to see the negative side of this as I am on his meanie list as well. :grin:

 

I had no intent to rile Roundball, as I said it's my preference, and not a snub of him. Different builders have their quirks, Right or Wrong. Caywood doesn't do touch hole lines, and Matt doesn't slot his tenons. Are they right or wrong only time will tell. I would add that Roundball is our resident expert on TC's, and is a phenom at developing a load, with his precision in documenting what he is doing. He also has thought that I was attacking him, which is far from the truth.

Bill

 

[Bill Hall]

Don't know if this is actually possible, but I wonder if it could be drilled out. I'm thinking drill the same size hole in a piece of steel, as a guide, 1/8" thick or so, clamp the guide directly over the pin hole, and drill very very slowly and carefully. Use the sharpest bit you have, maybe even buy a few extra. Even if the drill drifts a little, it won't harm the exterior hole, and it would eventually cut through the tenon next to the pin, and hopefully loosen the pin's hold (fingers crossed).

Just thinking out loud here, never done it before. What do you guys think, crazy idea? Bill

P.S. The guide may need to be formed to fit the radius of the stock. This is getting more complicated. :surrender:

 

[roundball]

Also I would try using a piece of dowel in the RR channel, with a clamp to the barrel to compress the barrel into the stock, then try punching it out. The compression may take off ant resistance.

Very creative...if you don't mind, I'll file that away for possible future use.
:thumbsup:

In that same vein of changing the various pressure points, I wonder if its possible that removing the tang bolt might also relieve / change pressure somewhere in the barrel/barrel bed relationship.

 

[brownie1934]

Could it be that the barrel is mounted to the stock with "Blind Hooks"?? Meaning that you remove the tang and lock bolts and slide the barrel ahead 1/4 inch and lift it out. If the pin holes are not drilled all the way through they are not meant to be removed.
Thats how this gun it made.. Bob

 

[roundball]

Sure sounds like it, huh

 

[Eric Krewson]

All three pins are stuck and appear only on one side of the stock even though the holes are drilled completely through side to side.

I will try the RR groove/compression suggestion try today and see what happens.

 

[Eric Krewson]

On the same topic, my wife has an old rifle in her family that had the barrel pin holes wallowed out apparently. Some where down the line some yo-yo filled each wallowed out pin hole(dime sized)with a big blob of epoxy, both sides, with the pins encased in the epoxy.

To see this had been done to such a fine family heirloom made me sick.

Here is the rifle, you can see one of the epoxy blobs above the ramrod entry pipe in the last picture. The drum in the barrel is actually a piece of wood made to look like a drum,don't know who added this touch of brilliance, probably the epoxy yo-yo.

 

[roundball]

"...All three pins are stuck and appear only on one side of the stock..."

Strictly a neophyte at this but to me, it seems a stretch that they'd all be so bent that none of them would push through...sure seems like there's something else in this equation somewhere.

Is the tang tail straight so it "could" slide straight forward if the tang and lock bolts were removed as Brownie mentioned?

 

[Eric Krewson]

I think the problem can probably be summed up in one word, "Accuglass".

 

[roundball]

I think the problem can probably be summed up in one word, "Accuglass".

Trying to envision this:

If I put Accuglas in a barrel bed, I assume I'd let it dry before reinstalling the barrel...then redrill the pin holes to open them back up, install the barrel and pins...pins should come back out, etc.

If it is Accuglas causing the problem, seems like that would mean the barrel and pins would have been reinstalled while everything was still wet ???

Do you get a sense that there is "ANY" pin movement at all...that all of them move some but stop at some sort of obstruction?

Or are the pins just plain bound up rock solid?

 

[ApprenticeBuilder]

I think the problem can probably be summed up in one word, "Accuglass".

Trying to envision this:

If I put Accuglas in a barrel bed, I assume I'd let it dry before reinstalling the barrel...then redrill the pin holes to open them back up, install the barrel and pins...pins should come back out, etc

Really ?