Bore Cleaning Question

[Ontario Hawken]

I was hoping to get some advice.

I took my T/C Hawken .50 cal percussion cap rifle out today and fired off a few conicals and round balls in advance of bear season.

When I got home I cleaned the barrel with a DAC "Wool Mop" in a bucket of hot, soapy water using the rod to act as a piston to bring the water into the bore through the nipple housing (the procedure they list in the Owners Manual).

I then used T/C No. 13 Bore Cleaner and it took about 15 patches before they came out clean. I then dried the barrel with several clean patches and blew moisture out of the nipple housing and port screw using a can of compressed air (what they use to clean keyboards).

I then swabbed the dry barrel with several clean patches (they came out clean) followed by a patch saturated with T/C Bore Butter. At this point it looked like I was getting rust on the patch.

Am I doing something wrong? Does anyone have any pointers or suggestions?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Scott

 

[ohio ramrod]

Actually it seems to me you are "over cleaning". You are getting the bore cleaned and then cleaning again and again. This allows time for a "flash" rust to develope. I Suggest just cleaning, dry and oil! But remember this is free advise and you get what you pay for. :hmm:

 

[Little Wattsy]

Actually it seems to me you are "over cleaning". You are getting the bore cleaned and then cleaning again and again. This allows time for a "flash" rust to develope. I Suggest just cleaning, dry and oil! But remember this is free advise and you get what you pay for. :hmm:

I agree. :thumbsup:

 

[BrownBear]

In my experience, if you use hot water, you have to get a rust preventive oil into that bore ASAP to prevent what folks call "flash" rust, as you appear to be experiencing. Also, bore butter isn't all that great a rust preventer in my experience.

I've given up on hot water altogether, using instead room temp water and only a small dash of soap- certainly not enough to make suds when I plunge the barrel like you are.

My sequence after cleaning with the warm soapy water is to rinse with plain cold water, swab the bore and the breech dry, then hit it again with alcohol to help make sure it's really dry. Then I hit it with a rust preventing oil like Eezox, RemOil or Break Free. In our wet climate WD-40 has proven to be a poor choice compared to any of those others for long term storage at least.

 

[Zonie]

The first time I tried TC #13 bore cleaner it caused "flash rust" which took many patches to remove. I was so surprised that I took a unfired C&B pistol and tried the #13 on it.

This time, I instantly wiped the bore to remove the #13 but I wasn't fast enough. It almost instantly caused flash rust to form.

As this time it was used in a clean, unrusted bore I decided that it works too good at removing ALL of the protection that is in a bore and it seems to react with the steel to rust it.
I have never used it sense that day.

As for Bore Butter, although it works fairly well as a patch lubricant, it is a very poor barrel protectorate.
In the days I used it to prevent rust I found that some flash rust had started forming a few days after I had cleaned and dried the barrel.
I live in Arizona where the humidity seldom is above 30 percent and if it doesn't work well here I doubt that it will work well anywhere else.

I suggest that you buy a bottle of Birchwood Casey Barricade.
This is an excellent rust preventative that lasts for months.
Although it is a petroleum product it does not seem to cause the tar like fouling that common motor oil causes when black powder is fired in it.


Barricade is also a great product to protect the outside of your barrel and lock.

No, I don't work for Birchwood Casey but they do make some excellent products and Barricade is one of them.

 

[Ontario Hawken]

Still good advice. The furnace isn't on yet, so maybe I'll try my wife's industrial-strength hair dryer to dry out the bore.

Any of you tried something called "Fluid Film?" I think this stuff is an aerosol based lanolin. The can claims it can be used on firearms, and as it is not petroleum based, I think it might be okay for the bore?

 

[Ontario Hawken]

Out of curiousity I ran a patch with Fluid Film on it down the barrel and it pulled out some fouling that the soap nad water and T/C No. 13 didn't. I'll see how it works out.

I don't work for Fluid Film either - LOL!

 

[Dave K]

I have never used Fluid Film, but I have talked to guys at Friendship who claim it is the best lube there is for shotgun wads.

 

[Birddog6]

I would ditch the hot water & the T/C 13, use soapy water & a bore brush to clean, then swab good, then rinse & then dry, then rust inhibitor. Works for me & no rust.

Keith Lisle

 

[Billnpatti]

This is what has worked for me for over 40 years and my guns look new. First, I wash the bore with hot soapy water. My water is about as hot as you would use to wash your hands and I use a good dab of dish soap in it. after swabbing out the bore with the soapy water, I rinse with very hot (from the tap) water, drain out the rinse water and immediately spray with WD-40. The only purpose for the WD-40 is that it quickly removes any residual water. I then use several patches to remove the WD-40 and then I use a patch saturated with Birchwood Casey's Barricade. Clean all of the rest of the gun and you're done. Every once in a while, I will put a coat of a good paste wax on my stock and buff it thoroughly. I use Renaissance Wax but Johnson's floor wax is good, too. This has worked for me for many years and I have had no rust or corrosion problems even when I lived on the Gulf Coast. Except for the normal wear from use, my guns all look like new.

 

[vince-m]

ok so you guy's do not like tc natural lube and # 13 cleaner,SO IF I CLEAN WITH HOT SOAPY WATER WILL I REMOVE THE SEASONING OR SHOULD I USE SOMETHING ELSE TO CLEAN WITH.

THANK VINCE

 

[R.M.]

Modern thinking is that the steels used today don't season. Makes sense to me. The old iron barrels were porous, but steel isn't.
I'm starting to think that as far as flash rust goes, it might depend on the steel used. Some guys get it, and others don't. What is the factor that causes this? Could it be the material? Don't know.
I'd try just warm water, and see if it makes a difference. I too use Barricade and like it, but I live in a dry area so it's not a good test.

 

[ebiggs1]

I use Bore Butter almost exclusively”¦”¦”¦..as a patch lube not as a bore cleaner. You don’t need anything but warn water, a 5-gallon bucket and a range rod with the proper jag and cleaning patches. Put the breech in the bucket with the warm water and pump the jag until the barrel is clean. Oil.

TC barrels don't need to "season".

 

[paulvallandigham]

VINCE: PLEASE---THROW AWAY THAT THOMPSON CENTER BOOKLET.

You season CAST IRON frying pans, NOT STEEL barrels! :shocked2: :nono: :rotf:

All those early instructions did was fill up the grooves of those early Thompson rifles, with charred grease, until the barrels don't seem to have any rifling grooves left at all. The owners thought that they had "SHOT OUT " their barrels, and needed to buy a new one, when there was NOTHING WRONG with the barrel they had, that a very good scrubbing( with a bore brush) and soaking with warm water and soap would not fix. :shocked2: :idunno: :surrender: :hmm:

We have men on this forum who have made a lot of money buying up " shot out " T/C rifles from others at ranges, or in pawn shops, cleaning out the grooves, and then reselling the guns for a substantial profit. :shocked2: :grin: :rotf: :blah: :surrender:

Use warm water and dish soap to clean your gun.

Nothing else.

Use a bore brush to get down into the corners of the rifling to dig out the crud caught down in there. Pump the water through the powder chamber, and the flash channel, out the bolster where the nipple mounts, after removing the nipple( which also needs to be cleaned.) The pumping action of soapy water through the small flash channel, and powder chamber USUALLY- but not always-- cleans out all the residue and fowling from these hard to reach places.

Buy some pipe cleaners at the drug store. You will find them where cigarettes are sold. Use these to fish down through the bolster to clean and dry the flash channel after the barrel is cleaned and dried. I recommend putting a cleaning patch in front of/over the bore brush, so that the bristles will hold the patch to the brush, and absorb a lot of the crud the bristles will dig loose from those corners.

You Can't USE TOO MUCH soap and water, and you can't soak that barrel TOO LONG. Soap Emulsifies the carbon and graphite in the powder residue so that it can be flushed out. The most common mistake shooters make( me, too, when I was new to this) is to be impatient when cleaning a barrel(s). Let the Soap do its job. Give it at least 1/2 hour, and an hour is better. Find something else to do while the barrel sits.

I think the prime motive for most shooters to hurry up and clean that barrel too fast is the smell of rotten eggs( sulfur dioxide). If you flush the barrel with just water when you first begin cleaning it, the sulfur crystals dissolve quickly and are then easily poured out and disposed of. That eliminates the awful odor, and lets you then set the barrel aside, full of soap and water, while you put things away, clean up, shower, give your Significant Other a back massage, etc. before finishing the cleaning. :thumbsup:

 

[vince-m]

paul
thanks, you have given me some great info and i will take your advice and clean it without the t/c stuff.i wonder if i should still use the treated maxi balls and patches?

p.s. thank you for taking the time to help me.

vince

 

[paulvallandigham]

You can improve any "cleaning solution" by adding a few drops of dish-washing liquid soap.

I don't know what T/C uses on its various conicals, but they do need to be greased to avoid leading in your barrels. A liquid cleaner( with soap), either water based, or alcohol based, will clean out the residue and bullet grease used.

 

[E Poffinbarger]

As you know everyone has an opinoin and so do I:

Like many I clean with hot soapy water, ramrod and patch. After pushing out the last water, I apply a liberal dose of basic 10W30 motor oil inside and out then allow the barrel to cool.

Then after everything is wiped down I always leave an oily patch down the bore on the range rod.

Finally I always re-swab the bore everyday for a week, then every week for a month and every month until I hunt again

Osage

 

Just use plain ole water,its all you need if your using real BP...plug the nipple or vent whichever may be the case..let it sit about 10-15 mins,pour it out...then use water saturated patches till they come out clean.....dry and use liberal amounts of WD40 to displace moisture...follow up later with Break Free....this works!!

 

[paulvallandigham]

WADR, while water dissolves the offending salts, and flushes them away, it does a fairly poor job of removing carbon from the barrel.

Pour some dish soap into the barrel, before filling it with water. Then let it sit a couple of hours. Use a bore brush and patch to scrub the BP crud( mostly carbon and graphite) Loose so that the soap can emulsify( a process where the molecules of soap surround the molecules and atoms of carbon from the BP residue) so that the carbon is also flushed out the barrel when the water is poured out.

Always rinse the soap out of the barrel using clean water after the BP residue is removed. Then dry the barrel with clean, Dry patches, until the patches come out as White as when the went in the muzzle! Use a good oil to protect the now BARE steel metal in the bore from rusting. I don't care for Petroleum based oils, using vegetable oil and wax to coat the surfaces of the barrel instead.

Either way, whatever you use to prevent rusting has to come out of the barrel before the gun is shot the next time. I recommend using Alcohol, which easily dissolves oils, and congealed oil "grease". You can pour the majority of the dirty alcohol out of the barrel, then dry it with a clean dry patch, and let evaporation remove any remaining alcohol from the hidden corners. I do this before casing my gun to travel to the range, or to the field.

If the trip is going to be long, I put a very thin coat of oil- usually a synthetic, or Jojoba oil, a natural plant oil that is a substitute for Sperm Whale Oil-- to protect the barrel until I get to where I am going to shoot.

Petroleum-based oils require a much higher burn temperature to burn out, compared to synthetics, and vegetable oils. Petroleum oils leave lots of tars, and partially burned oil in the barrel, that act like glue, binding Carbon to the oil residues, and to the barrel. Without alcohol to dissolve these residues, cleaning the bore becomes its own nightmare.

When I arrive at where I am going to shoot or hunt, I run a couple of clean, dry cleaning patches down to soak up the thin coat of "travel oil", before loading my powder charge, then PRB.

I find by picking either Jojoba oil, or one of the synthetics( I have some Teflon impregnated oil), that these oils penetrate the pores of the steel, such as they are, and they make loading that first PRB easier, and make cleaning residue out of the barrel after each charge easier, too. I was not expecting this to happen with either, BTW. I use them when hunting- not target shooting. They cost too much to allow my Ancestral genes to let me use them at the range, without bothering my conscience. :haha: :rotf: :hmm: My father would never approve! :shocked2: :thumbsup:

 

I see no need for the soap,what ever works for ya I guess....most soaps have salt in them...I do not want that in my bore...to each his own I reckon