Breaking Flints

[Problem Child]

So I have a Cabela's Hawken Flinter that's a real tackdriver.I don't really have an ignition problem,I have a breaking flints problem.When the flints srart breaking after four or five shots...then I have an ignition problem.
I usually turn my flints with the long part of the bevel up.This strikes higher on the frizzen.I've tried the flints both ways and I still have broken flints either way.

So today I notice a few gouges in my frizzen and decide that's probably what's breaking flints,so I decide I'll grind it down and heat treat it.
I find an old article on the net on how to do this and it don't sound too tough.
I grind the gouges out with my six inch bench grinder,get my torch,Kasenit,some oil and here I go.
I heat the frizzen to a bright red,stick it off it the Kasenit,heat it back up to red, and then dip it in the oil until it cools.I do this twice.I then degrease,heat the frizzen to a light brown and cool it in oil once more.
Then I sand off the black gunk from the frizzen(might be where I messed up).
I put the lock back together,put in a brand new flint and pulled the trigger a few times.

Now I have deep gouges,no spark and breaking flints worse.
What went wrong and is the frizzen junk now??

BTW...MZLoading season starts next weekend here. :shake:

 

[t-buck]

hey problem
where in ms are you located if not too far i may be able to help either with new or replacement part or with getting the old one back in order
t-buck

 

[Problem Child]

hey problem
where in ms are you located if not too far i may be able to help either with new or replacement part or with getting the old one back in order
t-buck

I'm in Central MS about 30 miles from Meridian.
I can travel. :grin:

 

[t-buck]

not too far from me i am just outside laurel
let me look in the shop tomorrow and see if i have a spare for you
i have a lot spare parts from junkers that i pick up from people
may have what you need /// may even have the whole lock just have to check
does yours have the original lock
t-buck

 

[Stony]

Didn't you anneal the frizzen when you heated it to a brown?

 

[Problem Child]

not too far from me i am just outside laurel
let me look in the shop tomorrow and see if i have a spare for you
i have a lot spare parts from junkers that i pick up from people
may have what you need /// may even have the whole lock just have to check
does yours have the original lock
t-buck

Yep

 

[Problem Child]

Didn't you anneal the frizzen when you heated it to a brown?

Not 100% sure what the definition of annealing is but I did cool it in oil after heating it to light brown.

 

[Stony]

If I remember correctly, annealing "softens" metal like steel and brass. I could be wrong. (My wife says I often am :rotf: .)

 

[gl1200a]

If tbuck don't get you going pm me.

 

[mr.flintlock]

To harden a frizin with kasenit heat the part to cherry red and stick it into the kasenit and let cool. When cool reheat to cherry red and drop into water. Do not reheat after this.

 

[ericb]

You'll get thru this. This is the sort of thing that will make you a grumpy grizzled Vet like the rest of us. Frizzen Hardening is a bit of a Black Art, part Science - part Sorcery, and I'm sure you will not want for advice from our resident Wizards before this thread winds down.

Eric

 

[ohio ramrod]

It is my opinion (completely free and worth what you pay for it ) that you annealed (softened) the frizzen on the last heat.Ttry rehardening as your first time then simply heating the frizzen in an oven (when swmbo is not around ) to 450 degrees and allow to slowly air cool. This will temper the frizzen with out annealing it . :idunno: :idunno:

 

[t-buck]

Hey problem child
looked in the spare parts bin and sorry to tell you but no frizzen to be found
best bet is to try the advice the others have given on hardening the frizzen
sorry about getting your hopes up then letting you down on this
T-BUCK

 

[jerrywh]

Use water for a quench and when you temper it do not heat back up to a brown color. That is too soft. Just put it in the kitchen oven at 375° for an hour or an hour and a half.

 

[Problem Child]

Hey problem child
looked in the spare parts bin and sorry to tell you but no frizzen to be found
best bet is to try the advice the others have given on hardening the frizzen
sorry about getting your hopes up then letting you down on this
T-BUCK

Thanks for looking TBuck.After searching the net for hours and about 10 phone calls,I finally found another frizzen at Dixon's Muzzleloading.

The guy asked me why the heck I even tried to reharden the frizzen :nono: .He told me he had used the Investarms frizzen on several Thompson Center flintlocks because they were harder and worked better.It's just the Geometry on the Investarm's locks that seem a little off.

I'm going to install the new frizzen and use it, and later on I'm going to attempt rehardening the old one with some of the above suggestions.

Thanks guys.

 

[t-buck]

glad you got it worked out
sorry i wasn't able to help
t-buck

 

[inthex]

I'm no expert by no means but after heat treating my frizzen and drawing back only the area around the screw hole I'm makeing smoke again.

 

[Problem Child]

Update...I'm sparking again. :grin:
I reheattreated the frizzen and kept the heat on the Kasenit for about 10 minutes each time.I did this twice and quenched it in oil each time.

After the frizzen cooled,I polished the gunk off with a wire brush and placed it in the oven @ 425 degrees for 1 1/2 hours.Seems to work great.

Thanks guys. :thumbsup:

 

[ebiggs1]

If you are using, or if your frizzen requires Kasenit, you are not hardening the frizzen. You are case hardening it. There is a big difference.
Kasenit leaces only a micro layer of hardening on the surface of the frizzen and can quickly wear off.