Bullet vs. Barrel Twist

[deanscamaro]

I am a new memeber and just getting into the muzzle loading sport. I am considering a percussion rifle with a 1:34 twist rate in the barrel. I would like to be able to use ball, swaged mini/maxi-ball/bullet and sabot, as the situation dictates. I realize this is a fast rate and the 1:48 is more suited to what I am looking for, but I would like to know how much would I be taking away from the performance of the ball with this twist rate? I would appreciate any advice I can get. :grin:

 

[bingo1952]

To get a fast twist barrel to shoot RB well you have to use a tight fighting patch. It will start hard but once started will ram fairly easily. I shoot a Dixie Jaeger that has a 1-24" twist and I get 1-1/2" and sometimes-smaller groups at 50 yards and 3" or so at 100 yards. I shoot 75 grains of 2F at 100 yards and drop back to 55 grains at 50 yards with a .018 patch and .53 ball and maintain the same sight picture for target work. For game I just hold under at the closer ranges and use the heavier charge.

 

[deanscamaro]

Thanks for the input. It doesn't sound like I would have much deteroriation when using RB as long as I used your guidelines.

By the way, did you use the .018 patch in both cases?

 

[bingo1952]

Yes I do but probably could be able to get away with a thinner patch with the lighter load. I may give that a go and see how it does. :thumbsup:

 

[Little Wattsy]

I am a new memeber and just getting into the muzzle loading sport. I am considering a percussion rifle with a 1:34 twist rate in the barrel. I would like to be able to use ball, swaged mini/maxi-ball/bullet and sabot, as the situation dictates. I realize this is a fast rate and the 1:48 is more suited to what I am looking for, but I would like to know how much would I be taking away from the performance of the ball with this twist rate? I would appreciate any advice I can get. :grin:

I too was new 3 to 4 months ago, OK so still VERY new-ish :grin: Anyway I too started looking for the ONE gun that would do it all, be versatil, etc. Made the MISTAKE of getting involved with the group on this forum (I would be VERY suspicious of RunnBall & Mountian Man as well as several others!) ANYWAY....I bought the versatil gun (1 in 28 twist), got bit by the BP bug and now have 3 more for a total of FOUR realizing that A) One IS NOT enough. B) you NEED to specialize C) you must accessorize and D) they are so dam cheap compared to "high demand" guns that you can buy three for the price of one. I got a T/C hawken, T/C Renegade/and T/c New Englander for a total of $675.00-ish plus shipping. I paid that for my last .270 BEFORE the scope! Now all I need is the T/C white Mt Crbine and then I can start in on the Lyman Collection ( I pray that I dont ever get started on the PC reinactment stuff, Ill go broke :wink: )

Bottom line it sounds like a great gun. Buy it. Shoot it. Get ready to NEED more.

 

[Walks with fire]

Yep; use as close to bore size ball as possible and a tight fitting patch. My 1/28 twist shallow rifled barrel shoots a .495/.018 combo great.

 

[Brik847]

I shoot a 1:21 White Mt Carbine in a .50. I can get a 1 1/2 inch group at 50 yds. with 60 gr. 3f and a .490 ball with a 18th patch. I use moose juice pre-lubed patches and between each shot I use TC bore solvent on one cleaning patch followed by a dry patch, fire a cap to dry it out, and load up again. I have a lot of confidence in this load. Next time I go out I'm going to try .495 balls and add some powder - like 65 grs.

 

[Jerry Coffee]

Minie Balls:.577 or .58 cal.

Since you are new to muzzle loading rifles like me, you probably do not cast your own minies or round balls.

I have never shot a round ball in my rifle musket, and probably won't. I am relatively new to BP rifle muskets.I have been shooting my P53 Enfield 3-band, .577 cal. rifle musket with 1-72" twist rifling about ten times last September through November. The slow twist rifling in my Enfield shoots a short and light Moyers "58 cal." best. I use Moyers Lyman 575213-OS, .900", 460 gr. minie ball or DGW BU0901 Lyman 575213, new style, .950", 470 gr. minie ball. The difference in those two is the length, weight and depth of the grease grooves. The DGW new style minie grease grooves are not as deep and are less likely to blow off a skirt ring when it leaves the muzzle, destroying the trajectory.

A musket with a fast twist such as yours, would shoot a longer and heavier Track-of-The-Wolf Lyman 575213-PH, 1.06", 566 gr. minie ball or a Lyman 577611 (actually .575" OD)Confederate Gardner style (two grease rings), 1.00", 540 gr. minie ball using 50 gr. 3Fg GOEX or 60 gr. 2Fg GOEX.

All those minies size at .575" OD.

Faster twist rifling shoots heavier minie balls best and make those minies more stable in flight.

 

[bart_anastasi]

Remember to that words like optimum and such should be taken with a grain of salt.

Yes the statement is true (from a labratory point of view) but the assumption is wrong.

For every day shooters a 1-44 twist or 1-30 or 1-60 should be all we need for most shooting.

Try a load in your rifle first and work up a load and see if it works for you before you start buying lots of hardware.

I used to shoot a 1-30 twist barrel in 54 and shot conicals and Rb no problem. replaced the 1-30 with a longer 1-66 and shoot conicals and RB no problem.

 

[faw3]

I called Dixie about how a ball works in that gun,I was thinking of buying a flint one (back when they came out and they came near to beating all the "in - l :cursing: s in the company shoot-out at the NMLRA summer shoot back in 2001 or 02, the old man ( I guess,or one of his kids that sounds old at Dixie) said it was one of those things that shouldnt work (useing over 60 grs or so - I think they use 90 or so) but the size bullet 54 worked, kind of funny because my Mowrey shouldn't shoot slugs very well with its 1X66 twist but it really did, just one kind of bullet it sent others all over the place with any kind of power load. PRB and and a 1 X 34 best get a big bore like the 54 we know takes the ball and bullets. Just my 2 cents, I've tryed shooting PRB's out of my 451 VOL with 1X20 twist and it works fine with 2f under 40grs. Fred :hatsoff:

 

[bingo1952]

I know it goes against common logic but it's hard to argue with success. i tried .015 patches in mine an the results were just so-so. It would get your deer at 75 yards but at 100 it was 50/50 as to whether it would be a killing shot. It is amazing what .003 thousandths (the thickness of a human hair) differance makes in the way it shoots. Another thing that I think make it work is the odd number of lands and grooves which has a tendency for a land to be pushing the patch into the opposing groove.

 

[deanscamaro]

I have finally got around to all the replies regarding my question of barrel twist. I really appreciate all the input, as it is very useful. I only hope (and I'm sure I will) get to the point of throwing all these sizes/weights/etc. around like it is second nature.

Thank! :thumbsup:
Dean