Cant figure out who made this revolver

[Cabofdoom]

So Im looking over my latest aquisition looking for a maker mark and cant seem to find one. After doing some searching on this site, I have come to the conclusion that it was proofed in 1960. Now the same search produced a link to an article on Makers Marks and this has none of the marks mentioned.

I'm leaning towards Uberti but my research indicated that Uberti used a "U" inside an octagon barrel cross section since 1959., and I copuld not find it on the revolver.

I've included pics:


The top barrel markings are a little hard to make out but read: Navy Arms Co. Inc. Bogota NJ. USA

And one of the gun

Thanks for the help

COD

 

[hawkeye2]

You won't find Uberti's trademark on their pistols. Since it was imported by Navy Arms there is a strong chance it's a Pieta but it could have been made by someone else too.

 

[Cabofdoom]

Just checked Pietta's web site and according to them, they didn't enter the Colt/Remington repro market until 1964, which post dates the proof mark on the revolver

And why wouldn't I find an Uberti mark ont the gun? Just because it was imported by Navy Arms?

COD

 

[hawkeye2]

No. Uberti does not regurarly put that mark on their pistols.

 

[Cabofdoom]

Okay, so Uberti dosn't commonly mark firearms w/ their mark.

That dosn't reconcile what I learned off Piettas web site and your belief that it's a Pietta. If it was proffed in 1960 and Pietta claims to have entered the CB revolver market in 1964

COD

 

[mykeal]

You won't find Uberti's trademark on their pistols.

Uberti does not regurarly put that mark on their pistols.

Huh?

Then who made my pistols with the U inside the octagon?

Navy Arms bought revolvers (and long guns) from several different Italian manufacturers, but Pietta was the primary provider in terms of total numbers. Armi San Paolo wasn't in business until 1971, and although Armi San Marco existed in 1960, their 1964 catalog doesn't have an 1858 Remington replica, so it's unlikely they were the maker. I don't have a favorite guess.

 

[hawkeye2]

Actually I didn't say that I believed it was a Pieta, just said that there was a strong chance that they made it based on the observation that an extremely high %age of NA revolvers I have looked at or friends have owned and the only NA revolver I own were Pietas. I don't know anything about when various companies got in or out of the business. NA also contracted with other makers and it is possible it is a Uberti. I have 2 NA flint pistols which I believe were made by Palmeto. The 3 Uberti cartridge revolvers I have which were made for Major importers (Taylor & Caimaron) are marked Uberti in block letters and my wife's Uberti Remmie has no brand or trademark on it at all. Might make it hard to identify yours if it was made by Uberti.

 

[Cabofdoom]

Heres a link to a REALLY BIG pic of the underside of the barrel

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/3933/underbarrelmarkings.jpg

Right before "Made In Italy", could that be a cursive/ script A.U. ?

COD

 

[Zonie]

My 1960 proofed Navy Arms Remington Navy is marked with "-NAVY ARMS CO. INC. BOGOTA NJ. USA-" on the top of the barrel and under the loading lever on the bottom flat of the barrel is marked a script, "G. U.-MADE IN ITALY-" along with two proof marks.
Marked on the frames right side are the two proof marks and the date code (XVI).

I've always took the script G.U. to be Uberti even though the "Blue Book of Modern Black Powder Values" says that Aldo Uberti, Srl has used the capital U in the octagon barrel sense 1959.

My 1862 Colt Police was imported by EMF from Uberti and is stamped "A. UBERTI & C. GARDONE V.T.ITALY" on the left side of the barrel. The proof codes and test date [AC] (1977) plus the Uberti Octagon barrel + capital "U" are stamped on the right side of the frame.

That would indicate to me that Uberti did occasionally mark his guns with his company logo.

 

[hawkeye2]

ALL,
We had a fairly extensive discussion of the Uberti logo about 6 weeks ago. Go here:
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/233102/

 

[Cabofdoom]

My 1960 proofed Navy Arms Remington Navy is marked with "-NAVY ARMS CO. INC. BOGOTA NJ. USA-" on the top of the barrel and under the loading lever on the bottom flat of the barrel is marked a script, "G. U.-MADE IN ITALY-" along with two proof marks.
Marked on the frames right side are the two proof marks and the date code (XVI).

Zonie,

Damn... sound like you got the same damn gun.
So how does your NA Remmy shoot? Mine seems to be unfired and still fresh out of the box stiff. Not quite ready to take its cherry ya know?
Dont get me wrong, I'll shoot it...never been one to own a gun I wasn't willing to shoot, it's just going to take a bit

COD

 

[Zonie]

It along with most of my other Cap & Ball pistols shoots high. (I only have two, a Uberti 1860 Colt Army and a CVA Italian made Walker that actually shoot to the point of aim).

I can't say I shoot it very much but as I recall it functioned just fine every time I've used it.
My reason for not shooting it a lot is basically I like the bigger BOOM of the .44's.

 

[Long Johns Wolf]

This Remmie was made by the company predecessing Uberti: "G. U." stands for Vittorio Gregorelli and Aldo Uberti. They teamed up before Uberti started his own replica company during the late 1950s to make replicas of the 1851 Navy (Colt incl. brass frame) and 1858 Army (Remington)for the US market before the centennial of the Civil War. Back then Gregorelli was a subcontractor of Beretta. He had the machinery to make the replicas, and Uberti was the genius & driving force.
Long Johns Wolf

 

[Cabofdoom]

Long Johns Wolf,

Very intresting stuff. So what Zonie and I seem to have are very early Uberti/ Pre-Uberti Remingtons reproductions. Not sure how many were made by G.U. but my serial # is below 1100

COD

 

[Long Johns Wolf]

Dr. Jim of RPRCA might be able help you with the exact S/Ns. He is regularly visiting this forum.
Long Johns Wolf

 

[Dphar]

You won't find Uberti's trademark on their pistols. Since it was imported by Navy Arms there is a strong chance it's a Pieta but it could have been made by someone else too.

Its not consistent but they are sometimes marked with the octagon and U. Like all such Italian revolvers the quality varies with who ordered them and how much they wanted them to sell for. Buying direct from Uberti does not warrant getting a good one. Cimarron is usually very good and uniform in quality
I would not worry too much, if it shoots good why worry?
Most reproduction percussion revolvers are "battle sighted" for about 75 yards and shoot high at "normal" ranges as a result.

Dan

 

[R.M.]

Most reproduction percussion revolvers are "battle sighted" for about 75 yards and shoot high at "normal" ranges as a result.

Dan

You have to wonder about the manufacturers thinking there. Why not sell a gun that's regulated for the distance that average consumer will shoot it at instead of what was.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Most of them originally just copied an original revolver. And the first generation of repro shooters knew to compensate for different ranges just like the oldtimers did. Many new C&B revolver shooters don't care so much about the history and traditions surrounding these guns and want them to shoot like a modern Glock. Their best solution may be to put a new set of sights on them on or buy one of the so-called "target" models that are available. Then there is the Ruger Old Army too.

 

[Cabofdoom]

Dr. Jim of RPRCA might be able help you with the exact S/Ns. He is regularly visiting this forum.
Long Johns Wolf

So here's an open request for Dr. Jim's help on the matter. What exactly do I have? All markings as described/pictured in my first post and a serial # of 1051

Thanks in advance for your help

COD

 

[Zonie]

This Remmie was made by the company predecessing Uberti: "G. U." stands for Vittorio Gregorelli and Aldo Uberti. They teamed up before Uberti started his own replica company during the late 1950s to make replicas of the 1851 Navy (Colt incl. brass frame) and 1858 Army (Remington)for the US market before the centennial of the Civil War. Back then Gregorelli was a subcontractor of Beretta. He had the machinery to make the replicas, and Uberti was the genius & driving force.
Long Johns Wolf

Thanks for the information.

Appearently my Remington .36 Navy was made during the transition from G.U. to Uberti and the proof mark of XVI (1960) would fit into that time frame.

My gun is without a serial number unless the "18" stamped on the bottom of the grip strap could be considered one. I've always thought of it as a assembly number because it is only two characters long.
There is also the number "88" on the cylinder pin flat.

I never gave much thought to the lack of a serial number because I've owned several guns that were made prior to the 1968 GCA that lacked them.

Anyway, thanks again.