Capandball shoots a 17thC matchlock for ballistic information!

[TFoley]

 

[kaotikross]

Very cool. I wonder what the first troops that ever faced these guns thought.

 

[TobJohn]

That is fascinating experimental archeology. His attention to detail in finding the variables to determine muzzle velocity is incredible.

 

[TFoley]

Very cool. I wonder what the first troops that ever faced these guns thought.

TBH, it's unlikely that only one side had such arms in use. We have no written records of such an engagement although, as you note, it undoubtedly happened somewhere.

We'll never know what went through the minds of the opposing forces in feudal Japan, but perhaps you might get some idea of what it must have been like can be gotten from watching this excerpt from a 16th battle that changed the face of the battlefield in Japan - Nagashino in 1575..........

 

[TobJohn]

I am away from home and cannot look up specifics, but Medieval Handgonnes: The First Black Powder Infantry Weapons has an account of a battle at the end of the 14th century, in the Low Countries, where one side used handheld gunpowder weapons and were able to deal a notable morale blow to the enemy.

It was not until the early 16th century that shooting would have a decisive role in winning European battles.

By the time the fully developed matchlock musket was in use, matchlock firearms had been in regular use for close to a century and and handgonnes for close to another century before that.

 

[TobJohn]

I am away from home and cannot look up specifics, but Medieval Handgonnes: The First Black Powder Infantry Weapons has an account of a battle at the end of the 14th century, in the Low Countries, where one side used handheld gunpowder weapons and were able to deal a notable morale blow to the enemy.

It was not until the early 16th century that shooting would have a decisive role in winning European battles.

By the time the fully developed matchlock musket was in use, matchlock firearms had been in regular use for close to a century and and handgonnes for close to another century before that.

I had misremembered. It was ribaudiaux, not handgonnes, in the Flemish battle that caused a rout.

 

[Darto]

The 2 season series Marco Polo on Netflix shows a Japanese city defending against hordes of Mongols led by Kublai Khan who of course was aided by Polo. The Japanese defenders had lots of hand cannons. Amazon Prime only has the first season ten episodes, Netflix has both. I don't remember which season had that gunpowder handgun battle in Japan.

Polo was of course on a trade information mission from his merchant father and also the Pope wanted information of the Mongol threat. Polo will join the court of the Khan and face serious enemies at that court for the duration, but is usually protected and befriended by the Great Khan himself who is impressed with Polo.

A bald captured enemy of the Mongols (I think Chinese) priest (perhaps Shaolin) is blind but still teaches the Eastern martial arts to the court of Khan, and in particular to Polo. This reminds of the TV series Kung Fu.

There's quite a bit of time spent in the series in the court of Japanese warlords and emperor. These are the Mongols great enemy in Season 1. Season 2 is a rebellion against Kublai by other Mongols.

 

[tenngun]

Been many a long year since I read Polo but as I remember, in all his discussion of arms he never mentions any thing that could be guns or gunpowder

 

[kaotikross]

TBH, it's unlikely that only one side had such arms in use. We have no written records of such an engagement although, as you note, it undoubtedly happened somewhere.

We'll never know what went through the minds of the opposing forces in feudal Japan, but perhaps you might get some idea of what it must have been like can be gotten from watching this excerpt from a 16th battle that changed the face of the battlefield in Japan - Nagashino in 1575..........

Wow! The devastation the losing commander felt as he realized his entire world has changed. Probably a scene that played out as lot as guns advanced worldwide.

 

[TobJohn]

Wow! The devastation the losing commander felt as he realized his entire world has changed. Probably a scene that played out as lot as guns advanced worldwide.

I recently finished The Italian Wars 1494-1559: War, State and Society In Early Modern Europe, by Christine Shaw and Michael Mallet, and there are many accounts of officers getting struck down by arquebues bullets, which would back that.