Cartridge/wad

[Lippy984]

I don’t know if this has been brought up before. I’m just curious because I’m just getting into revolvers...
If it’s common practice to use a wad over the powder, I understand that helps make a seal. Now, it seems like most paper cartridges don’t use a wad. Is that because the paper forms a bit of a seal around the ball?

 

[sawyer04]

The wads perform a sealing action and wiping action. The cartridge uses the paper for the seal. For years, before I made and lubed my own wads I just loaded and crammed crisco in the front of the ball. One chain fire due to an ill fitting nipple. I see no reason why a wad can't be loaded into the cartridge with powder and ball.

 

[kje54]

The wads perform a sealing action and wiping action. The cartridge uses the paper for the seal. For years, before I made and lubed my own wads I just loaded and crammed crisco in the front of the ball. One chain fire due to an ill fitting nipple. I see no reason why a wad can't be loaded into the cartridge with powder and ball.

What he was asking was do we put the powder, wad then ball or powder, ball then wad. I know people use wads in their BP revolvers but like you I never have, always used crisco also but I'm thinking the wad goes on top of the powder.

 

[kje54]

I don’t know if this has been brought up before. I’m just curious because I’m just getting into revolvers...
If it’s common practice to use a wad over the powder, I understand that helps make a seal. Now, it seems like most paper cartridges don’t use a wad. Is that because the paper forms a bit of a seal around the ball?

Never used wads on revolvers, always used Crisco which I'm sure will make some here cringe........ I would assume you load the powder, wad then ball but never having done that I'm not 100% certain. I'm sure members who are much more knowledgeable with that then myself will jump in with the correct information.

 

[sawyer04]

What he was asking was do we put the powder, wad then ball or powder, ball then wad. I know people use wads in their BP revolvers but like you I never have, always used crisco also but I'm thinking the wad goes on top of the powder.

Powder, wad, ball in that order is my method, however, I have for, some strange reason seen the wad on top of the ball. Nothing like confusion. I take the wad is more for wiping and lubrication than sealing.
Some are so scared of a chain fire, not realizing the culprit is mostly due to the cap side. I grease over the ball because I carry around the ranch daily and may fire a round as high as six months down the road.

 

[Kansas Jake]

I’ve done both powder wad ball and a few times the wad on top of the ball. One issue for me is I use homemade lubricated wadS and I suspect if loaded between the ball and powder the wad may contaminate The powder if left loaded for an extended period.

 

[nightwolf1974]

I've carried a C&B revolver before all through Muzzleloading and regular deer seasons(from Oct. to end of Nov.) before, and had NO issues with the wads messing up the powder charges.

 

[Lippy984]

What he was asking was do we put the powder, wad then ball or powder, ball then wad. I know people use wads in their BP revolvers but like you I never have, always used crisco also but I'm thinking the wad goes on top of the powder.

It’s not really the placement of the wad I was after. I just haven’t seen anyone use wads in paper cartridges. I’m assuming the paper acts as a seal to some degree

 

[Kansas Jake]

I put together some cartridges with a lubed wad between the powder and the ball. I also punched out a cardboard wad made from a cereal box to place between the powder and lubed wad. I haven’t had a chance to try them due to the closure of our local range for renovations. I’m anxious to see how well or poorly they work.

 

[Lippy984]

I put together some cartridges with a lubed wad between the powder and the ball. I also punched out a cardboard wad made from a cereal box to place between the powder and lubed wad. I haven’t had a chance to try them due to the closure of our local range for renovations. I’m anxious to see how well or poorly they work.

Interesting, keep me posted.

 

[kje54]

It’s not really the placement of the wad I was after. I just haven’t seen anyone use wads in paper cartridges. I’m assuming the paper acts as a seal to some degree

Paper cartidges in revolvers? That I've never seen, then add a wad to that? That would be serious overkill and I've never seen it.
If I remember correctly the reason they originally made the ball slightly larger than the cylinder chamber was that when the ball was rammed into the chamber a small ring of lead was sliced off so in theory the ball became the seal, no need for wadding or grease.

 

[Eutycus]

Okay if adding the wad would be overkill, what would adding a filler like cream of wheat under the wad be?

 

[kje54]

Okay if adding the wad would be overkill, what would adding a filler like cream of wheat under the wad be?

Are you talking about prepared cream-o-wheat??!! Not no, heck no!! Dry, why?

 

[Zonie]

Okay if adding the wad would be overkill, what would adding a filler like cream of wheat under the wad be?

A filler.
Most C & B shooters think having the ball close to the mouth of the chamber will make the shots more accurate. Many target shooters also think that a medium to light powder load helps with accuracy.

If someone uses a small powder load, let's say 15 grains in a .44 caliber revolver, that leaves a lot of space between the top of the powder and the face of the cylinder. Faced with this, the shooter can use just a wad under the ball and cram the ball way down the chamber so the wad rests snuggly on the powder or, they can load the ball and wad just until the top of the ball is below the face of the cylinder. Of course, if they do this, there will be a big air space between the powder and the bottom of the wad.
While this air space won't cause a dangerous condition, it will cause inconsistencies in the way the powder burns. Inconsistencies leads to poor accuracy.

The other option the shooter has is to fill the space between the light powder load and the bottom of the wad or ball with some filler like Cream of Wheat or corn meal or something similar.

 

[Lippy984]

Good info, but my question still stands....and I could probably answer myself, but I don’t have a gun yet.
Although the paper gets burned up, when the cartridge is loaded and rammed, does the bit of paper act as a small seal? Similar to the sealing effect as a wad, but obviously not to the same degree? That’s if one were to assume a wad is a good preventative for chain fires

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Good wads will help cut down on barrel fouling immensely.

That is their main purpose. They keep the fouling soft in the barrel so it doesn’t cake up basically clogging up the rifling grooves, which can dramatically reduce accuracy. Theoretically, they CAN help to prevent chain fires but with tight fitting balls that shave a complete ring of lead when loading should be all that’s needed, as long as the chamber is not out of spec or damaged.

Some prefer to put grease on top of the wads and that works well but in my experience it’s pretty messy and depending on the grease recipe it can melt and blow all over on the first shot and really doesn’t do much.

The wads are highly recommended because they’re simple, quick to use, not too messy, and they sort of “scrub” the fouling out with each shot as they are compressed by the powder upon ignition. But, skip the store bought wads and make your own. They will work FAR better and will be also much cheaper than the store bought wads. Here’s a way to make great ones and the lube recipe is tops:

 

[Gun Tramp]

Now, it seems like most paper cartridges don’t use a wad. Is that because the paper forms a bit of a seal around the ball?

when the cartridge is loaded and rammed, does the bit of paper act as a small seal?

If using a round ball in the cartridge, the answer is no. A small ring of paper (and lead) is sheared from the ball as the cartridge is pressed into its chamber, thus, only the new bare circumference of the ball contacts the chamber wall. Those using cartridges with heeled bullets may answer differently.

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

I’ve seen people using wads in their paper cartridges by inserting a thin cardboard space between the wad and powder. It is possible, but most just dunk the bullet (or ball) end of the cartridge into melted lube. Others smear grease on top of the loaded cartridge.

 

[Lippy984]

Thank you all, I have a better understanding. I can’t wait to play around with it

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

Thank you all, I have a better understanding. I can’t wait to play around with it

No the paper doesn’t act as a seal. Whatever ball you use for the cartridges make sure it shaves a ring of lead when you seat it normally and it’ll work fine. The paper kind of just slides off and doesn’t really do nothing, it’s the ring of lead that will prevent chain fires. You can lube the cartridges or grease over them to help fouling and increase accuracy.