There is a huge world of difference between those that were cut down in the barrel for whatever reason and those that came over as 36” and the occasional 30” barreled versions. What cut downs did happen it wasn’t a highly common thing. In fact I think I’ve have more images of original English trade muskets with modified butt stocks than chopped barrels.
Often a reason bespoke is because of horse mounted Indians used shorter guns, so as the trade moved west and horseback was more seen with the tribes there was a move to shorter.
Chiefs grades are a whole nother ball game. And where did I mention 1830? And they were seemingly made along the same timeline as the regular trade guns.
Someone mentioned earlier that shorter lengths came out about then? To your knowledge when did the 30" and 36" rade guns come out?
Yes, there were advances in powder continuously going on both here and in Europe, but gun barrels in the east, outside of military rifles, didn’t start shortening until the percussion era. Eastern woodland Indians were largely foot mobile and often enough preferred the longer guns. And whether horse culture Indians influenced the barrel lengths we may never know for certain, it does seem the closer we pushed towards the Mississippi River, the shorter the trade guns became.
IIRC, the English had shorter barrels, at least down to 36” fairly early, it’s just they we usually the minority compared to the 42” and up lengths until about 1800 +/- a decade. I’m thinking 30” started showing up occasionally around about that time as well.
Are you talking about specifically smoothbores or flintlocks in general?
We are discussing trade guns, primarily of the English pattern. Nothing about rifles intended.
So many people are used to short modren guns, and until one gets used to longer it feels unwieldy,
I think usually can find all sort of different styles including short barrels if you look hard enough. It is whether they were common or the exception? I can imagine some one ruining the end of the barrel on their firearm,and cutting it off because rhat is all they could do to make it usable. Then They found out th a t it actually still shot well? Who knows for certain?
Canoe guns are a modern fantasy. No guns were built for canoes in the 18th century. The conversation was about trade guns, not jeagers or post 1800 british military rifles.
I seem to remember Jackie Brown having a hand in that.
I agree, but it seems to me that since none of us were alive 250 years ago etc . I do not understand how some people can be so adamant that there were no "short" barreled trade guns or otherwise? Is it impossible to think that someone experimented with making one shorter for ease of handling, a small statured person etc? Just because we do not have reams of documentation, does not mean to me (IMHO) that it did not happen.
As said ‘canoe guns’ don’t seem to have an historic analog nor do we read about such guns being made.
STOP! There are reams of documentation!I agree, but it seems to me that since none of us were alive 250 years ago etc . I do not understand how some people can be so adamant that there were no "short" barreled trade guns or otherwise? Is it impossible to think that someone experimented with making one shorter for ease of handling, a small statured person etc? Just because we do not have reams of documentation, does not mean to me (IMHO) that it did not happen.
Documentation is our only nail to hang on. I notice that a lot of inventions just seem to show up. I THINK bullet boards and short starters were in use long before documented, and been known to use them, will argue all day by the campfire over their use….. but if in an historic setting I don’t use them as they can’t be provedI agree, but it seems to me that since none of us were alive 250 years ago etc . I do not understand how some people can be so adamant that there were no "short" barreled trade guns or otherwise? Is it impossible to think that someone experimented with making one shorter for ease of handling, a small statured person etc? Just because we do not have reams of documentation, does not mean to me (IMHO) that it did not happen.
