Chopped Flintlocks. How early?

[Clark Badgett]

My mother who died about 10 years ago at age 87, never ate anything in her life that contained any tomato products as she believed that tomatoes were poison. She was born and raised here in North Carolina.

My step grandmother grew up in NC and ate tomatoes like crazy. She would have been in her early 100s now. You just never know what ideas will burrow themselves into peoples mind.

 

[Billy-by-gosh]

Read it where? Here?

Maybe from George Catlain, the painter and chronicler?

 

[earlwb]

Apparently they did make a few short barrel flintlocks. Maybe more of a European kind of thing.

They have a pic of a flintlock with a 12 inch barrel shown here:
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/18th-century-horseback-hunting-rifle.139354/
There were the various blunderbusses which were usually made with short 24 inch or so barrels on them.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

The conversation is about English trade guns in North America in the 1770s.

 

[54ball]

Tomatoes were poisonous when eaten off a lead pewter plate.

 

[mikesto44]

Just to stir the pot. Their was a trade gun recovered from Traverse Bay in Northern Michigan. That just might throw a wrench into all this debate.
We also have to remember our knowledge is based on surviving examples. Last but not least you can write anything in a book. Doesn't mean it's 100% accurate. It's only the interpretation of the writer or his knowledge at the time...JMHO

 

[Jedidiah]

Just to stir the pot. Their was a trade gun recovered from Traverse Bay in Northern Michigan. That just might throw a wrench into all this debate.
We also have to remember our knowledge is based on surviving examples. Last but not least you can write anything in a book. Doesn't mean it's 100% accurate. It's only the interpretation of the writer or his knowledge at the time...JMHO

"Their was a trade gun recovered from Traverse Bay in Northern Michigan, please explain more what this means or why it is important. thanks??

 

[sportster73hp]

My stack is only about 3/4 a foot tall. I’m so envious. Now add muskets to the mix and my stack grows to at least 3 feet. Drives my wife crazy.

I need a bookshelf ! Stacking is to hard to find stuff

 

[Blitz]

Canoe guns are a modern fantasy. No guns were built for canoes in the 18th century. The conversation was about trade guns, not jeagers or post 1800 british military rifles.

But if others were short ?
is this not relevant to the discusion of shorter barreled fire arms smooth or rifled ?

Blitz

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

But if others were short ?
is this not relevant to the discusion of shorter barreled fire arms smooth or rifled ?

Blitz

No.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Just to stir the pot. Their was a trade gun recovered from Traverse Bay in Northern Michigan. That just might throw a wrench into all this debate.
We also have to remember our knowledge is based on surviving examples. Last but not least you can write anything in a book. Doesn't mean it's 100% accurate. It's only the interpretation of the writer or his knowledge at the time...JMHO

My information comes directly from old period records, not some old relic in the bottom of a lake.

 

[longhunter 1776]

in the gunsmith of Grenvile county he did a introduction on the rifes.He did go into the short rifles and from what he found there were a lot of thease used.Of couse there were the smooth bores and even rifles as well,so there were short guns smooth and rifles,George washinton has fifty bucks county style made for Hands calavary,,there were not real short but all were .50 caliber and 38 inch lonf barrels ,the officers were a bit fancy wood and had pathboxes dont know if all had that ,,but they had them,,all i know!!haha!!

 

[mikesto44]

Obviously you missed the part about people writing articles back then.
But the gun has been determined that the barrel wasn't cut off. The barrel was 29 1/2 inches. Also it was carefully studied by experts with far more knowledge than most of us.
Also I have seen the gun and an exact copy of it is at the Fort in Mackinac City. Last I never have had the thought that just because I haven't seen it. It doesn't exist. But to each their own...

 

[Blitz]

My information comes directly from old period records, not some old relic in the bottom of a lake.

Do records happen to be more real than an actual pirearm ?
Very interesting !

Blitz

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

Do records happen to be more real than an actual pirearm ?
Very interesting !

Blitz

Yep. Do you know anything at all about the subject?

 

[Clark Badgett]

Obviously you missed the part about people writing articles back then.
But the gun has been determined that the barrel wasn't cut off. The barrel was 29 1/2 inches. Also it was carefully studied by experts with far more knowledge than most of us.
Also I have seen the gun and an exact copy of it is at the Fort in Mackinac City. Last I never have had the thought that just because I haven't seen it. It doesn't exist. But to each their own...

There were 30’ guns made. That has already been covered. Let’s see a reference for the article or even who wrote it.

 

[Brokennock]

But if others were short ?
is this not relevant to the discusion of shorter barreled fire arms smooth or rifled ?

Blitz

There were 30’ guns made. That has already been covered. Let’s see a reference for the article or even who wrote it.

Maybe they were made,,,, at a certain later period of time.
But the original question was about "chopping" existing guns of propper length.

 

[George Andrix]

In the 1680 to 1700 period, English trade guns were ordered for the Hudson Bay company with 54 and 60 barrels. They were ordered increasingly shorter for the next 100 years but it was a long process. By 1800 42 to 36 barrels eere becoming more common. By 1830 barrels 36 to 30 were more common.
i have never understood why everyone todsy is so hot to document short trade guns. They were quite rare in the 1700s.
There are some great books out there documenting all of this in detail year by year. You should go buy them.

I would appreciate a recommendation or two regarding such books.
Thanks,
George

 

[Blitz]

Yep. Do you know anything at all about the subject?

Any body for any reason can write something and it becomes more real than the actual object ?
If on can percieve being on the moon and writed about it , the it is real. At least to him.
Are we getting into the third eye realm here ?
I for one am a bit more pragmatic,but will say there are possibilities one way or the other. quantum physics anyone ?

Blitz

 

[Clark Badgett]

Maybe they were made,,,, at a certain later period of time.
But the original question was about "chopping" existing guns of propper length.

That I know. It’s the other guy trying to point out that something that was known to be made was found and as if it’s some kind of news.