Combustable Paper Cartridge Box

[theloneranger]

Ok, this is a question for all to coment on. After I purchased my 1851 Navy, I wanted to purchase some old paper cartridges to display with it. (Easier said than done) So I made my own box of shells, and I must say they looked real good, maybe to good? My friends saw them and wanted me to make them boxes also, so I did, and I started to make them available to other collectors also. I received an email that said I should Stamp "REPRODUCTION" on the boxes so that no one could get one and try to sell it as real antique. I personally think that would detract from the display value of the Box, I don’t see any other CW Repo items stamped that way. I figured I was doing other collectors a service, not perpetrating any type of fraud. I was thinking that I could put a piece of paper inside the box that says REPRODUCTION, (before I sealed it up) ? Any thoughts on this? I sure don’t want anyone to get scammed on one of these down the road. I have posted them on the net also so anyone can go online and see they are truly REPOS. The box label I made up including the cartridge Company name.
Should I stamp REPO on the box? Would you want as a display piece if was stamped that way? Any thoughts on this.

If anyone is interseted in how to make the boxes of their own, I can post the entire process. The boxes are made of balsa wood, common cotton batting inside, new remington caps, and new cast bullets. I can go thru the whole process if anyone is interested.

Thanks
For you help.
Rich

 

[rabjr]

You just need a "mark" thats very slight and not really noticeable to anyone besides those who know what they are looking for. If it were me, I would place a tiny star in one or two of the corners on top of the box label or you could do all four corners if you want. This would distinguish your box from an original without really taking anything away from it. Very nice work btw. :thumbsup:

 

[SgtSchutzen]

Very nice :thumbsup:. I can see how someone not "in the know" could think they are alot older than they are.

 

[ladysmithtrading]

Nicely executed! agree with swampy, maybe mark the underside of the box with your own hallmark and the year of production like we do on horns.

 

[theloneranger]

As for the marking the the box, the entire box is my design, There was never a "Union Star" Cartridge Co. I just made it up, I did not want to use a real company name for this very reason. I was able to find a few photos of old original boxes and incorperated parts of each into my design and label. I guess this whole box is my Hallmark? I found info on the original boxes at:
Civil War Bullets

 

[rabjr]

Well if your not actually coping an original, then don't worry about it. :thumbsup:

 

[necchi]

Well if your not actually coping an original, then don't worry about it. :thumbsup:

+1 Not a copy of an original, So No Foul.
Just don't try to market as an original and your good.
Your idea of a note or paper inside noting it's not a copy of an original is a good one. What folks do with it later is on them.

Looks nice, :thumbsup:

 

[ladysmithtrading]

Well if your not actually coping an original, then don't worry about it. :thumbsup:

Yep! what Swampy said, still a very nice job!

 

[theloneranger]

It was lots of fun making new stuff look old! Black Glitter makes perfect simulated powder, Ageing new lead bullets and caps proved to be a bit harder.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Put the date in small roman numerals.

MMXII

I won't look too out of place and will make it more fraud resistant.

 

[theloneranger]

Not a bad suggestion, I think I will do that, maybe on the last line of the label after the city and state.

 

[necchi]

Put the date in small roman numerals.

MMXII

I won't look too out of place and will make it more fraud resistant.

:thumbsup:
Great idea!

 

[rabjr]

Ohh you gotta make at least one of these up from the "Acme Corporation"! :haha:

Wile E. Coyote often obtains complex and ludicrous devices from a mail-order company, the fictitious Acme Corporation, which he hopes will help him catch the Road Runner.

 

[Reb_Cav2]

First I must say Ecellent job. Looks Awesome!!!!
Second, If it is not to much trouble, I would love to see the process on how to make these for my civil war reenactments. It would really add to my camp to have a couple boxes to of cartridges laying around.
Thank you for sharing your hard work.

 

[theloneranger]

Lesson 1: HOW TO MAKE THE BULLETS

I just searched the net for how to make shootable Combustible Paper cartridges and followed that procedure minus the real black powder and soaking the tissue in salt peter.

You will need:

1. Lead bullets (more on that later)
2. Tissue Paper (and some rit clothing dye to color it)
3. Fake (or real Black powder) I use black glitter
4. Wadding material , I use cotton batting or you can use rock wool insulation
5. Wood dowel rod about 6 inches long, (select the rod size based on the caliber, round one end slightly and taper the other end)
6. Elmer’s glue
7. A high temp heat gun

STEP 1 ”“ cut tissue paper strips about 1 ½ inches wide and 2 feet long. If you can find very light color yellow tissue, then you can use it as is. I have started to by white tissue and dye it. Lay a strip of tissue on a flat surface with cardboard under it, VERY GENTLY, brush some light brown dye on it. (you will have to experiment with the color, you want a yellowish tan color. I mixed 2 color of fabric dye until I got what I wanted). Then blot the excess water with a paper towel, be very careful ot the tissue will turn to dust! Lay the stained tissue out to dry, it takes only a few minutes.


STEP 2 ”“ wrap the tissue around the tapered end of the wood dowel rod (2 ½ turns) Place a small drop of glue on the edge of the paper and seal it down, twist up the tapered end and put a small drop of glue on it.

STEP 3 ”“ take the heat gun and darken up the tissue “cup” while it is still on the dowel rod, you just want to turn it brown in places. (to much heat and you get a small fire!) Beware of getting glue on the dowel rod or you will never get the “cup” free.

Step 4 ”“ load the powder into the tissue paper shell, I use a funnel, but you can also use a powder flask. (you would not want to much or too little fake powder). Place some wadding material on tho pf the powder and use the rounded end of the dowel rod to pack it down.

Step 5 ”“ put a few drops of glue on a lead bullet and slid it in, then smooth down the edge of the tissue. (as for the lead bullets, making new lead bullets look old took a bit of work. If you buy the Buffalo pre lubed bullets, they have a oldish look to them, but they are very sticky and you need to sand off the lube on the part that will extend into the tissue or it will get stuck and destroy it. (this step is a major pain in the but) Now that I am smarter and wiser, (and making lots of the boxes) I have opted to buy cast un-lubed bullets and dip them in my secret sauce for several hours, I think the look quit old.

That’s it! One fake 150 year old bullet

If you have any questions, just send me an email.

when I get more time I will work on the box part next, and a final post about the labels, I will be having some fun with them, here is my next label.

 

[crockett]

The Richmond Arsenal turned out boxes made of cardboard that look sort of like your box but the Colt and Sage boxes are totally different and anyone paying $500 for an original will know the difference- no need to print "REPRO"

 

[Reb_Cav2]

Thank you for your response. I am going to try and make a few.

 

That is too cool, great job! :hatsoff:

 

[Pigman]

How are you printing the labels?

If you are using a computer or a copier it will be obvious to an expert when they look at the print under a magnifying glass.

Thanks,
Foster From Flint

 

[theloneranger]

I am just using my pc printer and Photoshop to create the labels.
The person who had a issue was a well being ebayer who was worried some less knowledgeable collector would buy one at an inflated price if they ran across one at say a "Farm Auction". To tell you the truth, If I found a box like this out at an auction, I probably would have paid to much for it. That would be a bad thing, so much fake stuff out there it is hard to buy anything with confidence these days. That’s why I wanted to get the word out. I also have photos of them up on my web page, sooner or later it will come up in google search. The real boxes are almost impossible to find and cost way to much, I just wanted folks to have a reasonable alternative. Maybe some day my REPO boxes will be worth the big bucks! (ya right)