Common spot for residue or do I have a problem?

[necchi]

Thank you Zonie, that's the best explanation of that circumstance I've read. :hatsoff:

It is kind of a flawed system but that type of breech/bolster set-up has proven itself reliable for decades now.

 

[Morse]

I've decided not to dig into it. If residue in this area is common then I'm not going to worry about it.

Thanks again for everyone's support.

 

[Tom Compton]

As already pointed out, get a flash cup. They're good to make cleanup easier and will also let you determine if there is a pressure leak at the threads of the drum.

Off square hammer/nipple contact should be corrected either by use of a taller/shorter nipple or by heating the neck and bending.

 

[Morse]

Off square hammer/nipple contact should be corrected either by use of a taller/shorter nipple or by heating the neck and bending.

I seem to be confused if the drum is threaded in or pressed. Would direct heat ruin my bluing at all? Also, if there any kind of sealant in the threads of the barrel to the breech plug that would get messed up with direct heat?

The original cap had obvious wear on the top, where the hammer would smash it, but I've never had any fail to fires because of it.

Just a thought.. would this nipple alignment cause excessive back blast due to the hammer not sitting directly over the nipple's cap upon detonation?

 

[relicshunter]

Its a good chance the marks on the barrel are from repeated removal of the barrel for cleaning if you look at the lock where the bolster rest's you will see a part of the lock that looks seemed together and the barrel likely rubs on it coming in and out.

 

[Morse]

Its a good chance the marks on the barrel are from repeated removal of the barrel for cleaning if you look at the lock where the bolster rest's you will see a part of the lock that looks seemed together and the barrel likely rubs on it coming in and out.

Holy manure you're completely right! I had to pull her out of hibernation and sure enough, the scratches line up perfect with the lock plate. Nobody molested this gun, its just common wear and tear from disassembly.

I can't remember where I've read this, but I do recall somebody else having a misaligned nipple too. Maybe it's one of those "low quality" traditions problems, but she works just fine in my hands.

 

[Devodud]

I have two Traditions rifles, a St. Louis Hawken and a .32 Crockett. Both of them have nipple/hammer alignment issues. With real GOEX black powder ignition is not an issue, but with substitute powders I cannot get solid ignition without perfect alignment on my cap guns.

 

[Morse]

I have two Traditions rifles, a St. Louis Hawken and a .32 Crockett. Both of them have nipple/hammer alignment issues. With real GOEX black powder ignition is not an issue, but with substitute powders I cannot get solid ignition without perfect alignment on my cap guns.

I've gone through almost my first pound of Schuetzen with 3 FTFs. The cap hits, but nothing happens. I'd recap and still no go. I've had to add a few grains into the nipple itself, put on a new cap and then it would hit. Today I bought some triple 7, so we'll see how it shoots sooner or later. CNY is catching the tail end of that recent east coast storm lately so it'll be a swamp at my local spot for a while.

I am new to BP, but do you think this alignment issue has caused these FTF, or maybe I'm leaving to much powder residue trapped at the base of the barrel?

 

[Zonie]

If the cap is "Popping" when the hammer hits it but the main powder charge in the barrel isn't going off, it indicates the hole that connects the bottom of the nipple with the bore is partially plugged up with something.

Usually, the plugging material is powder fouling but it can also be from oil left in the hole from the last time the barrel was cleaned.

Oil in this connecting hole (flame channel) will contaminate the black powder that gets into it.

The oil fouled powder will not burn so it becomes an obstruction to the flame from the cap.

Try to find some old fashioned pipe cleaners. The kind smokers use to clean their pipe stems.

Run the pipe cleaner down thru the flame channel hole into the breech and give the hole a good scrubbing.

Sometimes adding a pinch of powder under the nipple will create enough blast to blow past the fouled powder. Sometimes not.

As for Triple 7, if you were having difficulties with shooting Schuetzen black powder you will have worse trouble shooting the synthetic powder.

All of the synthetic powders like Triple 7, Pyrodex and the rest, have a higher ignition temperature before they will fire.
Try to stick with real black powder for the best results.

 

[Morse]

After cleaning I keep a thick coat of bore butter (not for seasoning, just to keep it lubed while in storage) until I go shooting. Upon getting ready to shoot I patch the barrel until its try, then hit it with a cap. I think the problem may be, after every shot I'd run a patch down the barrel without ever tipping it upside down, or hitting it with another cap. A lot of crud comes out with the patch, but I can only assume a lot more just gets shoved further down to the bottom.

Am I getting warm, or just paranoid?

 

[Grenadier1758]

Well you are getting warm. All that Bore Butter you are using to preserve your bore is first being jammed into the sub bore chamber when you wipe with a dry patch before shooting. Second, the cap firing will only blow a small bit of the bore butter out and distribute the oils along the bore to create the asphalt like fouling that is giving you problems.

To get around all the oils you have in your barrel you need to use a smaller caliber jag or a cleaning jag with a loop in it to hold a patch that goes into the Tradition's sub caliber chamber. Use a patch with isopropyl alcohol to get that grease out. Finally remove the nipple (and replace it with a new one) to use a pipe cleaner to clear the flash channel from the nipple to the powder chamber. Then you should be getting reliable ignition.

 

[necchi]

All that Bore Butter you are using to preserve your bore is first being jammed into the sub bore chamber when you wipe with a dry patch before shooting. Second, the cap firing will only blow a small bit of the bore butter out and distribute the oils along the bore to create the asphalt like fouling that is giving you problems.

That hit's the nail on the head,, ditch the Bore Butter.
What method do you use to clean the rifle after shooting?

 

[Morse]

I'll pick up a bottle of DryGas for my next outing and throw a cleaning loop into the bag.

I haven't found a steady routine yet, but my field cleaning consists of 2-3 dry patches once I hit the field just clear out that bore butter, and then fire a cap to clear the nipple.

Generally, I run a dry patch after each shot and continue shooting. If the residue gets real heavy, maybe after 10 shots or so, I'll patch with bore butter followed by dry patches and a cap, and continue shooting.

I bought bore butter under the assumption that it would have less firing affect of BP, like a liquid base would. This barrel seasoning theory was NOT the case.

Would you saturate the patch in iso alc or just dampen it like a spit patch?

 

[coloradoclyde]

Cleaning is the most important thing a new shooter needs to learn in my opinion....

Having an efficient, well thought out routine will remove most of the effort.

There are oodles of cleaning threads on here, I would go through and read them all. you will find many similarities between them.


To answer you alcohol question: post shooting the wetter the better........pre-shooting just dampen. but beware....alcohol on the stock can cause issues with the finish on some guns.

 

[necchi]

I haven't found a steady routine yet, but my field cleaning consists of 2-3 dry patches once I hit the field just clear out that bore butter, and then fire a cap to clear the nipple

Well you've explained a big part of your ignition problem, you pushing crud down into the flash channel with your dry patch wiping technique.

My question really was about "cleaning" the gun. What do you do when your done shooting for the day?

 

[Morse]

Soapy water and a bronze brush in the sink until the water coming through the drum is clear(nipple removed). Then I go into the garage and run compressed air through the muzzle which sends any heavy crud through the drum. I then dry patch until dry. Then a cotton brush to hit the low areas of the rifling. Then I remove the drum screw and hit that and the nipple with q-tips and pipe cleaners.

The hammer and furniture are also cleaned up.

My firearms are clean when I put them away. I go heavy on the lube when stored, but I clean it out prior to shooting.

 

[necchi]

That sounds good.
Another great method is to fill a small bucket with the soapy water, submerge the breech end with the nipple removed, then use a cloth patch on a jag down the muzzle and do a pumping action forcing water in and out the drum.
As you can see right angles with that type of breech are tuff to get clean,

That bore butter or any other oils trapped in the area marked as "D" will collect and hold hard fouling. Ya gotta get all that butter manure out of there before you shoot it.
Again, ditch the smells pretty major market "make a lot of money" paraffin wax bore butter goo.

 

[Morse]

The pic really helps, thanks. I do like the smell of bore butter haha, but what would you recommend using to store this? Can I give it the same dry treatment as I do my other firearms?

I can switch to an iso alc while in the field, but should the bore be lubed for storage? I think I'm in the field of paranoia again as far as how to handle a bp firearm.

My guns storage is by no means dehumidified.

 

[necchi]

There are hundreds of topics here about storage and rust protection.
I use "Gun Oil" like I do all my CF guns,, the only key is to remove the oil before you shoot,, this is where the iso alc as you call it comes in handy. I use a few patches sloppy wet with Denatured Alcohol every time before I shoot to get the oil out.
I wipe the bore after every shot with a spit patch, I always have some and it easy to carry in the field.

 

[Zonie]

...

Generally, I run a dry patch after each shot and continue shooting. If the residue gets real heavy, maybe after 10 shots or so, I'll patch with bore butter followed by dry patches and a cap, and continue shooting.

Probably the worst thing that can be done between shots is running a dry patch down a fouled bore. The only thing that is worse is to pump it up and down after you've got the patch into the barrel.

Doing that (assuming the dry patch doesn't get stuck) is almost guaranteed to knock fouling off of the bore and then blow it down into the flame channel between the bore and the nipple.
It almost guarantees a misfire.
The next time you go shooting, when you decide to wipe the bore, try this method:

1. Wet a clean patch and pinch out any excess water. You want the patch to be very damp but not dripping wet.

2. Place the damp patch on the muzzle and using the cleaning jag on a ramrod or range rod run the patch at a medium speed down the bore until it hits the breech plug.

3. Let it sit there for the count of 10 and then slowly, pull the ramrod/range rod/jag/patch back up out of the bore.

4. Run a clean patch down to the breech in one stroke and then remove it.

Your gun should now be ready to be loaded for the next shot.

The reason for all of this is you don't want a dripping wet patch. That will leave too much water in the bore.

The one downward stroke with the damp patch is intended to moisten the fouling that is on the walls of the bore.

Letting the damp patch sit at the bottom of the bore allows the fouling on the barrel walls to soften.

Pulling the damp patch back up the bore will wipe off almost all of the soften fouling in one stroke.

Running the dry patch removes any wetness that may remain behind because you just pulled a damp patch up thru the bore.