cowboy guns

[Supercracker]

So did all those people who got killed say "oh sh**" when their guns failed to fire and hesitated?

Because modern instructors teach those with revolvers to simply shoot again since the cylinder revolves to another shot.

I would imagine that guns were being drawn simultaneously. If Gun A went click and gun B didn't, I imagine that Gun A never had a chance to see what the next cylinder would do and if the functioning pistol was the first drawn then it didn't really matter all that much I suppose.

 

[1sgtscot]

Just a side note here. I do civil war reenactments with a remmington and spare cylinders. I usually clean my pistols after a reenactment, but sometimes I forget the spare cylinders leave them until I prepare for the next event. On a couple of occaisions I have discovered this several months after the last event and then clear the cylinder by firing that remaining round (blanks, but the only thing missing is the ball). I've never had one fail to go off and the longest wait was about 6 months. It kinda makes me wonder why it didn't go off during the event. Sometimes the cap doesn't fit right and falls off or vibrates off, and sometimes it has been fired, but the powder didn't ignite (maybe a blockage, oil in the cone or something that has cleared by now) but a new cap usually causes everything to go boom. I also find that sometimes when this doesn't work, I need to scrape the cylinder out and discover that there never was any powder in there. So now I know why Hickock would clean his pistols by fireing them every day or two. I also know the black powder rounds will last in the cylinder for at least 6 months. I'm sure the old timers new this as well.

Sgt Scott

 

[guad42]

Wild Bill Hickok was known to discharge his brace of 51 Navies each morning, clean, and reload them.

So in the course of a year he would load and fire at least 4368 charges? While I too have read of this I believe it is more a product of the Buntline press.

Thats how its come down and was written by people who knew him. So we do the math and think its not possible? What of the documentation?
I used to shoot my single 1860 carry gun about 3 times a week and did this for a couple of years. This was if I did not shoot it for fun. Where I might shoot more than one cylinder full.
Figure 104 weeks, 2.5 times a week, it was a full flute Army and could be carried with 6. So 6 times 260 comes to 780 rounds a year, if I had carried a pair I would likely have shot them both for the same reason. Fresh loads. I could easily have shot a 1000 rounds a year from this revolver and I had less motivation than Wild Bill.
I was also pretty damned proficient with it since I shot it a lot. Enough I had to make a new wedge for it at one time since it became loose with the original.
To me having carried a C&B a lot it makes perfect sense. In keeping my loads fresh I never remember having a miss-fire. I carried it in a shoulder holster under a jacket or coat so dampness was a concern especially in hot weather. Now if it were in a house in a drawer it would probably remain reliable for years. But carrying it every day? Can't trust to luck.

There is a book called "Blood Meridian", its fiction. However, there is a Journal that it is based on. I cannot at the moment recall the title having seen it at a friend's house last month. But in it the Journal keeper mentions that in real life Glanton killed a Texas Ranger with a knife when the Ranger's Navy went click while held against Glanton's forehead across a card table. It was a life changing event for the Ranger.

You are looking at it from economics or time/trouble. Hickok was looking at life and death. He had been in numerous shooting scrapes by this time, his last days in Deadwood, and knew that the guns HAD TO WORK. Misfires were common and got people killed as I am sure Wild Bill knew and not just with cap & ball guns.
The 1898 fight in which Soapy Smith and Reid were killed in Skagway comes to mind. Reid's cartridge revolver failed to fire and he died in agony 12 days later as a result. Soapy was luckier, he died on the spot but not by Reid. Maybe Reid had old ammo. Oil could kill the primer in CF cartridges or the powder in any of them. So even today changing ammo in a carry gun is a good idea. Remington in the 20th century used to advertise that their handgun ammo was "oil proof" in large letters on the front of the box.
So Bill's shooting did 2 things, it kept his hand in and kept his loads fresh.
Hickok was not killed because his firearms let him down. He could not afford to have a "click".

I once read an account of an outlaw who had taken some time off and was living in a cabin. He had brought along food, a case of ammo for his sixshooter, which he practiced with daily along with riding his horse a few miles aday so the horse was in shape.
Of course he might have been lying but it makes PERFECT sense. Flabby gun handling or a flabby horse could easily cost him his life. So he took "measures" to assure this would not be a factor. He didn't HAVE to do this. But he knew it was a very good idea perhaps learned the hard way at some time.

When you read things like this you must ask yourself "what would I do if MY life was at stake"?

Dan

The "Journal" you reference in your post is actually a book, published under two or three different titles; though commonly as "My Confession" by Samuel Chamberlain. Chamberlain was a Mexican War era volunteer who later joined the Dragoons and served throughout the Mexican War. His book is heavily illustrated with his own sketches, though most historians dismiss the notion that Chamberlain was present for all of the events depicted.

He later goes on to describe falling in with the "gang" of Scalphunters led by John Joel Glanton and including one "Judge" Holden. Glanton was in fact a real person, who as legend has it organized his bunch after the Mexican war and contracted out to the various Mexican states to kill Apaches and other Indians; being paid a bounty for each scalp brought in with an ear. However, Glanton would and his men would it seems kill anyone who could pass for an Apache and was eventually outlawed.

Glanton, now out of the scalp business took over the ferry run by Yumas near the present day Arizona-California border, where he and many of his men were killed by their native neighbors. This happened in 1850, long before any 1851 Navy Colts were on the scene. It is possible that Glanton carried a revolver, though more likely an earlier model.

Interesting gun related side note - Chamberlain at one point claimed to the use the breech of his Hall Carbine as a sort of close range pistol.

"Blood Meridian" was written by Cormac McCarthy, author of such uplifting novels as "No Country for Old Men" and "The Road".

As to Hickok, I too wonder that he actually discharged his pistols daily. I think that may have been embellished. And while he's famous for his Navies, some authors believe he was packing cartridge guns at the end of his life. It has also been discussed that he used a Dragoon to kill Dave Tutt.

 

[oldwolf]

"Blood Meridian" was a difficult book to get through, very bloody. But it did give me reason to buy a Whitneyville Dragoon.

The Scalp Hunters

 

[StrawHat]

Interesting comments Dan. I too have worn out wedges in 1860s. A couple of times. I believe Hickock was proficient, just don't believe that particular daily routine. I will pick up that book mentioned if I can find a copy, any idea if it is available online? Always looking too add to my knowledge and try to do as much as I read. Sometimes I can duplicate what I read, sometimes I can't but I always learn.

I no longer carry an 1860, I now carry a cartridge revolver.

Thanks for the info and discussion.

 

[The German]

used a navy 1851 for a while as a "backwoods" gun for a long time. Always cleaned the oiled cylinder to "perfection" with priority on the nipples ( but did not use alcohol) only patches and pipe cleaners. When dry, I loaded real Black Powder dry felt wad and ball. Sealed the cylinder with beeswax and then also "sealed the caps( RWS) with nailpolish. Gun is sometimes loaded for more then 6 month - so far never a problem with misfires - however I had twice a ball move partly out of the cylinder and jaming the gun ( would not rotate cylinder ( was lucky to find you before firing). I assume it was because of horseback riding .....