cva/Douglas barrels on mountain rifle

[Wv_mingo327]

looking for some opinions if anyone could help, and to share an observation/opinion of my own. I know this topic has been covered several times in one way or another and that most of the documents if any were lost over the years. I currently have several cva mountain rifles 4 of which are the “made in USA”. what i’m interested in and want to discuss is the barrels and the noticeable differences between what i believe the be some of the very first barrels to be produced the alleged “douglas” barrels. This is all speculation on my behalf but i have noticed that i have 3 barrel marked made in “USA” that have larger barrel under lugs , they have flats machined on the powder drums , they also have well defined crowns to them, and what appears to be a somewhat wider surface area to the rifling it’s self. I have another barrel also “USA” version but it has the smaller 3/8 i believe underlugs , less defined crown , the rifle appears to be a little more narrow in this particular barrel. The powder drum on this one has no machined flats on it just typical cva type drum. also one of the rifles i currently have show no markings what so ever of a Spanish stamp on inside of lock assembly as is so typical to see.the tang, lock, and nose cap all have numbers stamped in them 839 i do believe. so what do you guys think? has anyone else noticed the difference mentioned above in the early cva mnt rifle barrels and if so could these noted barrels be the rumored douglas barrels that were supposedly on the first generation guns? i will add that other than potential value for i don’t see a difference in accuracy between my USA barrels and my Spanish barrels as long as i do my part. i know this was a lengthy post i do apologize. i’m still fairly a youngster in the smoke pole world but i must say it’s definitely an addiction and adventure as i wish i would have gotten into this side of shooting and hunting many years ago as it is much more enjoyable and challenging and the people i meet as well as you guys here are extremely helpful with us younger guys finding our way in the traditional world of shooting/hunting. my nest goal is to be a flintlock (probably another mnt rifle ) as iv only shot them and don’t currently own one. thank you for any insight or opinions anyone may be able to share on these barrels as i know there are some really knowledgeable guys out there.

 

[Frontier's]

It's not speculation. When I was prostaff for cva I had this conversation with the people and he confirmed, the very first models were Douglas until the factory in Spain tooled up to build them there.

 

[Frontier's]

Also if the drums have flats, it was either modified or replaced.

 

[Wv_mingo327]

Also if the drums have flats, it was either modified or replaced.

thank you for the quick response the barrels with the flats are brand new old stock kits i have purchased never had powder or a ball down them in there original packaging there the same barrels with the larger underlugs and well defined crowns and stamped made in USA these barrels are the ones i feel would be douglas.

 

[Frontier's]

I guarantee you, those drums are not factory. Unscrew it and it will not be the proper patent drum that cva used.

 

[Wv_mingo327]

I guarantee you, those drums are not factory. Unscrew it and it will not be the proper patent drum that cva used.
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these barrels were new old stock usa kits one of which was still sealed in plastic wrap with all paper work i fully agree there not typical run of the mill cva drums as i 6 mnt rifles and a hawken but be that as it may how can one explain a completely sealed kit i dont want to damage an in the white new unfired barrel but the one that i bought from a member here a while back was not new an needed some minor alignment issues for nipple to hammer it to had the flats i took that drum completely out it ran the entire length to the other side of breech plug i cleaned the threads applied HD thread lock n reassembled but if need be i will pull that one as i 100% know it is the proper cva drum design internally i was only curious if these barrel could be proven to be douglas as i have another USA barrel with the typical round cva drum but less defined crown n smaller underlugs

 

[Frontier's]

Post some pics

 

[Wv_mingo327]

Post some pics

this is one of the recent kits i acquired note the flat slots on drum in last pic i’m currently browning this barrel i will haft to take pics of the others as well as heat and pull the drum on the one i will also get a side by side comparison of the crowns on these barrels vs the newer? USA barrel i have as well as the larger underlugs

 

[Wv_mingo327]

Post some pics

i would also like to add that i’m not trying to discount anything from anyone with more knowledge than me as there are several members here including you frontier that before i even became a member i used guidance from reading some well respected members reply’s to people to make the plunge into BP world and become a member i’m just trying to figure out what i have as there is definitely a difference in the usa barrels i have and iv only seen one or maybe two more that fit my description on the somewhat larger/wider rifling, more prominent crown, 1” barrel lugs and the flats on the drums.

 

[Frontier's]

1" tenon was on pretty much all mr's.

 

[Wv_mingo327]

1" tenon was on pretty much all mr's.

two of mine have the smaller 3/8 tenons on them all this is the reason for my question/concern. thank you tho for info provided i’m still fairly new and just searching and studying these ol rifles as they fit me really well and suit me

 

[Frontier's]

Later models, much Later we're smaller

 

[Trot]

I may be wrong but weren't all the made in USA barrels made by Douglas?

 

[Frontier's]

I may be wrong but weren't all the made in USA barrels made by Douglas?

Yes

 

[Wv_mingo327]

I may be wrong but weren't all the made in USA barrels made by Douglas?

yes it is my understanding that they were/are my post was to try to find some clarity on two on my barrels in general. I have two USA barrels that show some noticeable differences from one of my other USA barrels. underlugs of different size , slightly different crown , what seems to me to be wider lands and groves , and machined flats on powder drums. could be as simple as using what was on hand or the one usa barrel could be during the transition period iv read about where it was changed over i dunno. i do know that @Frontier's is very knowledgeable and has been a great help not only on this post but just from reading his replies to other members on their post as well, thank you sir.

 

[Frontier's]

No one knows, not even cva, how many USA made Mountain rifles were made. Just enjoy them when you get one in good shape! Restoring an 80s model right now. Still has the maple stock too.