CVA Hawken (Spain) Help

[MSK]

I just got a CVA Hawken on Gunbroker for my son. Two things I notice:
First, when the trigger is set and the front trigger is pulled, the hammer falls only to half-cock. Knowing very little about this, I wonder if I am missing the tumbler fly (photo below). If so, any idea where I can get a replacement part?

Second, I want make sure the drum/nipple/clean-out screw setup is safe. but the screw, while tight, doesn't look like a clean-out screw and the nipple isn't seated to the bottom (is it supposed to be?). Is there a way to test short of firing? Below is also a photo of the drum as well.

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[Shifty]

Can't tell for sure in the pic but it don't look like you have a Lock with a Fly, no that is not a proper clean out screw,and no the Nipple looks crossed threaded or some thing.Remove the clean out screw get one at hardware or Deer Creek I think thats right and also order a couple of new nipples from them and you may have to change out the trigger to a single trigger,I put one in mine.These are pretty good guns I like mine a lot it's usually the one I take hunting 54cal.

 

[Col. Batguano]

Yup. The nipple should bottom out, but more importantly, you need to have enough bearing surface between the threads to withstand the pressure. For most high pressure situations, 8 full and unbroken bearing threads are required (assuming proper engineering of the situation) for parts to pass inspection.

 

[necchi]

The Fly is indeed missing, ask Deer Creek Products for a fly for a CVA "Bridled" lock.

A nipple on a drum never does look bottomed out, a flat surface doesn't fit completely flat on a round surface,,
But shifty is right,, that thing is cross threaded in there.
It may be the wrong nipple, someone may have tried to cram a 1/4x28 nipple in there.
The proper thread is 6mm x 1mm, the common nipple thread for Spanish guns.

 

[swathdiver]

Looks like someone cobbled some parts together and sold it off.

Yours looks like a good candidate for a flintlock conversion!

Saw off the bolster, tap for a touch hole liner and get a CVA or L&R flint lock.

But before you do all that, how is the bore and tang?

 

[Lock Nut]

Yup, clean out screw incorrect. It's my guess that its also probably too long and the nipple is bottoming out on it. Then it was cranked in there too hard and screwed up the threads.
I've had a few cvas that didn't have a fly. Had to do alittle work on the tumbler to make it work right.

 

[MSK]

Thanks all. Very helpful. I'll get a new fly, nipple and cleanout screw.
Don't know what I'd do without this forum.

Smollett

 

[mooman76]

Can't tell for sure from the picture but it doesn't look like the original drum either.

 

[MSK]

What makes you think it might not be?
Thanks, Smollett

 

[Crewdawg445]

+ 1, you'll end up rock locking eventually... :grin: Good candidate for an L&R and new vent liner! Will require a little work, but certainly worth it IMO.

 

[MSK]

I have flintlocks; this is for my son who wants a percussion gun.

Thanks

 

[Katahdin]

Nipple is cross threaded, the clean out screw is wrong ,,, that could be why the nipple won't go in anyfurther and someone has put a wrench/pliers/vice grips to the drum see the teeth marks ,,I would look that rifle over very close before I fired it,,

 

[Crewdawg445]

Agreed, definitely looks like someone certainly didn't know how to properly care for the rifle. Bad thing about auction site's, it's like a box of chocolates, never know what your really going to get!

 

[mooman76]

What makes you think it might not be?
Thanks, Smollett

The drum usually has two flat spots on it to apply a wrench.

 

[necchi]

The two wrench spots are on aftermarket drums, many of the originals are all round.

 

[MSK]

Thanks Necchi. Yes, Dixie sells the aftermarket ones with the flats. I confirmed with Deer Creek that the OEM bolsters have a round profile.

Smollett

 

[bpd303]

The clean out screw looks like it is larger than the CVA 5mm screw. Probably has been drilled out and taped to a larger size. The nipple does look to be cross threaded too. If that's the case the drum is unsafe. See this thread about blown out nipples. http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/291886/post/1441224/hl//fromsearch/1/

 

[frogwalking]

I would guess this rifle has metric threads. Someone who knows chime in. My bet is that the screw in the clean out hole is SAE and not metric. If this is so, don't stand on the right hand side of this rifle when it is fired. Check drum, nipple and cleanout to see if all the threads are damaged from using the wrong sized screws.

If the triggers are double action, then just use the front trigger. The flys on some of the Spanish locks can cause a dangerous situation. The fly is so long due to the poor lock geometry, one can put the hammer on what appears to be half cock, but the sear is resting on the fly. They can and do slip off, with really bad results. Many owners remove the flys for this reason. (Ask me how I know this.)

 

[bpd303]

All CVA rifles have metric threads. The nipple is 6mm and the clean out screw is 5mm. If the clean out screw has been drilled larger, there isn't enough material left to make the nipple safe. The drum of the CVA guns is not available as a replacement. Before I used a replacement, I would send the barrel to Deer Creek Products to see if it is repairable. Barrels with the breech plug & drum installed are available through them.

 

[don hepler]

From looking at some of the "Bubba'd-up" parts, my next question before spending a dime. What does the inside of the barrel look like? If it is toast, no need to worry about the rest of the problems.