CVA Pennsylvania cap and ball .50

[mkpatrick]

I have a Connecticut Valley Arms Pennsylvania .50.
Its a very long barrel. Cap and ball.
I need to get the corrosion off of it. I put it away without cleaning when my uncle died. I used to go shooting with him every week with it.
Then he got real sick and died. The rifle got put away dirty. Very shortly after all of that I started moving and ended up across the state. Its been a crazy 2 years with many many problems house and job related.
I'm at a point now that I can start shooting again. Now I'm pretty sure there is alot of fouling. Its been sitting 2 years.
Not sure how to start getting it back into shooting condition.

I could sure use suggestions, I hope its not too far gone.

 

[Whitworth]

First get a good "range rod" before you go sticking any kind of cleaning gizmo attached to the factory ramrod down the bore and cause yourself grief. Remove the nipple (if you can). and then you can go about scrubbing the bore out with a .45 caliber brush wrapped in steel wool. Set the breech end in a bucket of hot (from the tap hot) soapy water and scrub away to get the nasty old crud loosened up and follow with cloth patches until clean. Then wipe the bore dry with dry patches, when dry run an oily patch down the bore.

 

[Grenadier1758]

@mkpatrick, What powder were you shooting in that CVA rifle? If Pyrodex, you do have a real corrosion problem to overcome. Plug the nipple and use a lot of a rust solvent such as EvapoRust. That classic mix of the unsulfered molasses and nine parts of water to fill the bore can do a good job of remoing the rust and is not as hard on the stock finish and barrel blueing. Give the treatments a few days to work on the rust. Do a search on the Forum for molasses to get more info on the use of molasses as a rust remover.

The barrel of the Pedersoli Pennsylvania is pinned to the stock, so removing the barrel for the rust removal treatment is something to think long and hard about before trying to remove those pins.

 

[TrapperPete]

one of the very few times I go other than soap and water

Blue wonder used to be rebranded by CVA as barrel blaster wonder gel https://www.amazon.com/CVA-AC1684-B...er+gel&qid=1613077153&s=sporting-goods&sr=1-1

it has some rust removal properties with out removing bluing

that on a nylon brush

get that nipples out , get it cleaned up with the wonder-gel or one of the options Grenadier suggested , the wonder gel sounds a lot like a gel form of eveporust then clean with soap and water and get some lube on it and see how it feels with a lubed patch , how it looks , you may end up with flitz metal polish on some tight patches scrubbing the barrel.

I bought a cva 45 kentuky from a guy who never had a range rod the last 3 inches of barrel never got cleaned right , it would grab a patch when I first got it.

a couple treatments of the bore blaster gel , some flitz and you would never know running a patch , I can see it isn't perfect in the grooves with the bore camera but it shoots and that is what is important.

there is hope

 

[mkpatrick]

I never fired pyrodex out of it. I fired GOEX FFFg black powder rifle out of it.
OK yeah I have a range rod somewhere, I'm still unpacking crap. Home now and its 3 degrees out so I'll need to do this cleaning inside, LOL.
Thanks for the advice!
M

 

[mkpatrick]

OK so, I brushed the heck out of it, with barrel blaster citrus based cleaner. The patches I run down the barrel come back brown.

That means rust right?

Would a penetrating oil help break up the rust?
Something like aerocroil?

What is a good cleaner to use on what I presume to be rust in the barrel?

A footnote, when I run a jag with a patch down it, if the patch is dry, the patch/jag/rod can barely be removed. I got a little nervous, because I couldn't budge it there for a few moments. I finally had to psych up and just really reef on that rod to get the patch back out. It would move back and forth OK until it bottomed out. I can feel a detent or a ridge in the last couple inches of travel.

 

[deermanok]

Sounds like you have a lot of rust down the barrel. I'd suggest to keep on scrubbing. A bronze bore brush won't hurt to use. Good luck with the project.

 

[TrapperPete]

that might be a candidate for evapo-rust .

penetrating oil doesn't really break up rust it can free parts but you need to get that rust out then you can smooth out the metal with something like a flitz metal polish.

I would flush it with hot water after the cleaning you gave it and get some oil in it while you pick up a rust remover product be careful not to get the rust remover on the bluing bluing is just black oxide.

best not to run dry patches , even if you wet it with rubbing alcohol it is better than dry

 

[LawrenceA]

Be careful if you use a brush.
Make sure it is a muzzleloader one or there is a greatly increased risk of losing the brush.
Get copper or bronze wool and use that on your jag. It will really rip through rust.
Scouring pad works well too but is aggressive. Very aggressive

 

[mkpatrick]

I'll look for evapo-rust.
I have a loop, that I pushed some 00 steel wool through. I was considering using that too.
I have worried about the brushes. On a modern rifle, you can just push them through but on this, wow, trying to get that brush to reverse directions, it would take a lot of force it seems like.
Are there brushes specifically for muzzle loaders? Are they just a softer bristle so they can reverse directions?

Thanks so much for all the tips, I'll be working on this tomorrow pretty hard.

M

 

[LawrenceA]

There are brushes that loop at the base.
These are what you need. Twisting turning the brush in the bore allows you to reverse it.

 

[Widows Son]

I’m sorry for your loss regarding your uncle. This gentleman was important in your life. All will be well. All will be well and all manner of things will be well.

I have a cva Pennsylvania .50 flintlock. Its a Spanish made barrel and truly good quality. That quality means some corrosion resistance. There is hope.

All the advice given is correct. Oil soaking and scrubbing is required. You can plug the nipple with a toothpick and fill the barrel with white vinegar. Its a good rust remover and neutraliser. Let it soak for a week if required.

A pitted barrel in a patched round ball muzzleloader is not necessarily a ruin.

 

[Flinty Scot]

If it's really badly rusted/pitted, having the rifling freshened might be an option for you.

 

[Grenadier1758]

CVA/Traditions rifles have that drum drilled through the breech and Bobby Hoyt won't freshen or rebore a CVA with that integrated breech.

It will take a lot of rust removal solvent and scrubbing with steel wool. It might clean up well enough to shoot.

 

[mkpatrick]

Thanks guys, I'll keep working on it and report back.

 

[mkpatrick]

OK so I bought some Birchwood Casey rust removal solution. I also got the finest steel wool I could find. 00 was the finest that I could find.
I followed the directions to the letter. I degreased first using patches.Then applied the rust remover with a mop.
I set a timer and waited the 2 minutes it said to wait.
Then with the 00 steel wool in a loop, ran the loop up and down while twisting as I went. I did that for about 15 minutes about the time my arm was wore out.
I then ran a new mop down and back several times to soak up the rust remover.
Then ran a degreaser patch down and back several times.

Guess what mentors.....
No more brown on the patch!
It looks like trace amounts of what powder fouling looks like (dark grayish) on the patch and that's it. Cleanest patch I've seen in a long time.

I put some foaming bore cleaner in it for a bit and will run patches some more until its clean.

Is it recommended to leave oil in the barrel between shooting sessions or something else to prevent rust?

Does it look like I am out of the woods with this now?
Am I missing anything?

M

 

[Zonie]

It is recommended to use a good protection against rust when the gun isn't being used. I've had excellent results using Birchwood Casey Barricade.
Barricade forms a very thin rust proof coating which drys. You don't even have to wipe it out before loading the next shot weeks down the road.

It is also highly recommended that if you use some sort of non-drying oil, you store the gun with the muzzle pointed down.

If the gun is stored with the muzzle up, the oil will accumulate in the breech where it will contaminate the flame channel that connects the nipple with the bore.
Once that has happened, the next time you load the gun, the fresh powder will start to enter the flame channel where it will become saturated with the oil.
Saturated powder is very hard to ignite so in effect, the fouled powder will end up plugging up or damming the flame channel and the gun won't fire.

 

[PastorB]

I have an old gun, a cheap CVA Kentucky Rifle in .45. It was given to me some time back, so i had no monetary investment in it. It was neglected, and the bore was pretty much ruined despite my best efforts to clean it up. It would shred and burn patches due to pitting and the rough bore, and the round ball would wander aimlessly, rattling down the barrel. I cast some Lee REAL bullets for it, and get ragged one hole groups at 50 yards. No patch to burn. Might give it a whirl if the bore doesn't clean up well.

 

[mkpatrick]

Well I put some more foaming bore cleaner in there and let it sit for a bit.
I got brown patches again.
So I repeated the process. I made a mistake on the steel wool, its actually 0000, not 00.
Once again, no brown on the patches after repeating the process.
So I'll keep repeating this until its right.

One thing to note, ever since I got this gun, patches got almost stuck in the last few inches of the barrel towards the flash hole.
I could feel a detent almost. When I got into that last 2-3 inches I felt a resistance and then it was very very hard to get that patch moving the other direction back out.

Now, I do not feel that sort of detent anymore after this cleaning process I've been doing. And although patches are still hard to get out, it can be done with one hand and not me straining and reefing on it to get the patch back out.

So perhaps a ridge of fouling or something had formed? And now its gone?

Next time I'm at the store, I'll pickup that Barricade. That sounds like a good product.

So these Lee REAL bullets, are they balls? Or are they conical? Can a conical projectile be fired out of these?
Whether or not the bore can be saved, I'm still interested in a more accurate projectile.
Do you have to cast them yourself?

Thanks for the tips!

M

 

[Grenadier1758]

The Lee REAL bullets are conical. REAL is the acronym for Rifling Engraved At Loading. The bullet needs to have the top band diameter slightly larger than the land to land diameter of the barrel. Use the shorter length version of the REAL. This can stabilize a bit easier than the longer version of the REAL.

Finding a mold may require some searching. Lee Precision shows them out of stock in their inventory.

Mold D C 50cal-250 - Lee Precision