Dangerous game with a .54 cal.?

[john12865]

I've never hunted Black Bear before so I thought maybe I'd get some thoughts on this.
I shoot a .54 with PB. I get clover leafs with 5 shots at 50 yrds. The sweet load is only 60 grains 3f Goex, which drops a deer like it's head was slammed in the barn door.
I also have a .54 pistol as a side arm loaded with 30 grains of 3f Goex.
So what do you guy's think?
Is a .54 suitable for bear?
I have two shots and a 12" knife.
I'd really rather not go hand to claws with a bear with a 12" knife.
Is a .54 with a well placed shot good enough?

 

[Rebel]

Plenty good for bears. Been a lot of them killed with a .50 cal and rd balls. You might up the load to 80 grs though since your shots will most likey be close and you won't need 50 yd accuracy.

 

[GrizzlyBear]

Let me start by saying I have NO IDEA.

But if a 54 PRB is good enough for elk then it ought to be a cinch for a bear weighing at least half the size or less of an elk.

Let me know how that works out for you.

 

[john12865]

Let me start by saying I have NO IDEA.

But if a 54 PRB is good enough for elk then it ought to be a cinch for a bear weighing at least half the size or less of an elk.

Let me know how that works out for you.

Well Elk don't have claws and teeth and maul people when you wound them. :grin:

 

[Sharp Shooter]

54cal is plenty for Black Bears. My state even alows 40cal for black bear.

 

[szihn]

I think your 54 is fine but I would up the charge to about 90 grains, and shoot a hard ball.
(wheelweight)

 

[jernestc]

Bears do have teeth and claws so I understand your concern, but black bears are more like deer than they are like grizzly bears. If you wound a black bear you'll have to concentrate on finding it again rather than protecting yourself.

Mtn. R.

 

[john12865]

I think your 54 is fine but I would up the charge to about 90 grains, and shoot a hard ball.
(wheelweight)

Hard ball would give better penetration with less expansion, Am I following you right?

 

[biliff]

A .54 works fine for bear, been there done that. As others have said, I'd up your powder charge some just in case you run into a real good size one.
One thing to keep in mind when shooting, is a bears vitals are a tad bit further forward than on a deer. A google search should turn up one of those "see thru" bear diagrams so you can see what I mean.
As far as your back up pistol goes, if you think you're going to need one, get a S&W 629. When things get serious, PC goes out the window.

 

[Protrucker]

A .54 works fine for bear, been there done that. As others have said, I'd up your powder charge some just in case you run into a real good size one.
One thing to keep in mind when shooting, is a bears vitals are a tad bit further forward than on a deer. A google search should turn up one of those "see thru" bear diagrams so you can see what I mean.
As far as your back up pistol goes, if you think you're going to need one, get a S&W 629. When things get serious, PC goes out the window.

I'll second what Bakeoven Bill said about P/C, but I don't think that you need to be too worried about beefing up your load too much. I've taken one black bear with a muzzleloader(T/C Renegade .54 flint) so far with very good results. Using a Hornady swaged ball & 80 grains of Goex FFg my shot went clear thru both sides & it was end of story for that bear.

 

[PitchyPine]

I don`t know about shooting one with a ML either but i know quite a few people that shoot them with a bow, they all say they`er just as easy to kill as a deer. As said the vitals are up front quite a ways.
Good luck and i too agree about the back-up gun, pc won`t do ya bit of good if your dead.

 

[szihn]

That'as right John.
A 54 is big enough already. It doesn't need to expand. It does sometimes need to break large bones. That's why you should use wheelweight instead of pure lead for hunting larger animals.


In the old days the balls were commonly hardened with mercury. VERY bad stuff when it fumes.


Air cooled W.W. is far better at breaking bone than pure lead. It's cheep, and still soft enough to grab a patch. If you want to be extra sure, roll the balls on a file to texture the surface so the patch holds them even better. I have won some rifle matches in the past shooting W.W. so don't believe the BS that only pure lead will shoot accutately.
:thumbsup:

 

[paulvallandigham]

AN alloy ball will weigh less than one made from pure lead. Check the weight, and sort them for air bubbles. etc. It will probably shoot to a differentPOI than the RB made of pure lead, but Steve is right about using the harder lead balls for heavy skinned, and heavy boned animals. They do stand up much better, when breaking bones, to penetrate farther. At the ranges you are likely to get a shot at a bear, I would not worry about the ball hitting 1 or 2 inches higher at 50 yds. These are big animals, with large Chest areas to hit. Test fire these different balls on the range, just so you know for sure where they hit, compared to your normal lead balls. But then go on and use them for hunting bear, moose, elk, caribou, and mule deer.

 

[BrownBear]

I think I can amplify Paul's point a bit. Yesterday a friend took a large Sitka blacktail buck with his 58 cal Hawken and PRB. Shot was at about 65 yards and was a "high shoulder" shot, taking both shoulders and the bottom of the spine. The RB (pure lead) split in half, with one half just making it through the spine and the other half lodging under the hide on the far side.

In contrast, my own similar buck dropped with a lung shot hitting ribs on both sides and exited. I was shooting a 54 at similar velocities and the shot was at around 50 yards.

Shake those together and pour out this insight: If your shot on a bear is ribs/lungs only, you can expect good performance from a soft RB. But if the shot takes in heavy bone of the shoulders too, I doubt you will get nearly as good penetration.

I'll still use pure lead PRB's for deer, but agree with the others that a little harder would be better if heavy bone is a consideration along with fangs and claws.

I'll experiment with wheelweights, being familiar with that alloys performance on game using cartridge handgun bullets.

Be aware that balls cast from alloy are likely to be a bit smaller in diameter, and may require a little thicker patch. I also anticipate that you will probably need a really tight fit in the bore to get the kind of accuracy you have come to expect with a pure lead PRB.

 

[longcruise]

Well Elk don't have claws and teeth and maul people when you wound them. :grin:

Pretty unusual for a black bear too! :winking:

 

[three otters]

John,

I've taken two black bears with a muzzleloader, both were shot within 40 yards (over bait) in Ontario. Both were shot with a 50 cal., loaded with 70 grains of FFF under a .490 patched round ball. The 170 sow flipped over backwards like she was doing a cartwheel, she let out one small moan and it was over, second bear a 309 lb. boar turned broadside at the bait (same load same results) it looked as if someone pulled the rug out from under his feet. Both were complete pass-through shots double lung hits. When the outfitter dressed the boar he couldn't beleive that ther was hardly any lung material left intact :shocked2: . Both lungs had turned into a black gelatinous mess, he commented that he had never seen lungs vaporize like that before. So in my opinion I beleive your 54 will be more than enough gun with a well placed shot. :thumbsup:

Kevin

 

[jbg]

Bears do have teeth and claws so I understand your concern, but black bears are more like deer than they are like grizzly bears. If you wound a black bear you'll have to concentrate on finding it again rather than protecting yourself.

Mtn. R.

Not all that long ago I would have agreed with you. But occasionally they can and do act like a grizzly. A couple years back we had a healthy black bear kill a baby here. The bear came out, and the mother grabbed the 2 kids closest and got them in the house, came back out and it was too late. This fall we have had bears attack and kill a Labrador Retriever a couple miles from my house, and another bear killed and partially ate a 300 lb. bull calf.
I have hunted black bear with a .62 flintlock. Haven't had the chance to shoot one yet. But I always make sire I hunt with at least one partner. Someone considerably slower than me. That way I don't have to outrun the bear. I just have to outrun him.

 

[Flint311]

I've shot two Ontario bears with a .50 cal. flintlock. A 200 lb. and, this year, a 490 lb. bear. Shot placement means more than the calibre. Both were shot with PRB, pillow ticking, and 80 gr. black. This load combination actually had better penetration and bullet retention than a .30-06 with ballistic tips another guy was shooting. I've got deer with a .54 and you won't have any trouble, but up the powder a bit. Good luck.

 

[MercerLake]

Over the years I've shot several blackbears with Bp rifles, and all of the advice given above regarding PRB is very good. Most of my hunting is real close in the black-berry patches, I now use a double .72 for more sleep at night. I would add that all the bears that I have shot bolted in the direction they were looking when hit unless they were hit in the head/spine,( generally run 50 ft or so). Good reason to avoid head-on shots, unless you want to be run-over. A .54 with PRB, hard lead (W-W), with 80-100 grains of powder is plenty big enough, but try to break bones and get the lungs. Believe me a bear is a bear when they are hurt, they all have teeth and claws, they all can hurt you very bad. A bear has a body remarkably like most of us if you take the hide and hair off, a long wide shallow chest. Study a diagram of the bear's body very carefully and go have some excitement.

 

[Headhunter]

It also depends where you hunt. I hunt black bears in Montana, No baiting there. All spot and stalk hunting. For this type of hunting with your 54, I would say to shoot as much powder you can and still maintain acceptable accuracy is a must.

For bait hunting out of a stand, your load of 60 grains would roll him like a sack of taders.

There is nothing wrong with more powder and powder. You might have to plow through a bone or two.

Headhunter

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