Dead Horse

[Walks with fire]

Let's beat a dead horse for a while. Consider a 50 caliber barrel in the flintlock persuasion with a 1/48" twist rifle barrel of say 28".

How good does such a rifle shoot conical bullets? In other words what size groups at 100 yards could one expect with an average rifle and shooter?

Is more powder and velocity and/or faster rates of twist better to stabilize this type of projectile?

Is a shallow groove depth better for conicals or are deeper grooves better?

Who uses a conical for deer and what do you think about it's performance vs. the performance of the round ball?

 

[Mad Professor]

Conicals shoot best with fast twist and shallow grooves. For deer sized game you will get pass throughs almost every time unless you hit both shoulders (lot of wasted meat) and/or the spine. Look for a conical with a hollow point so it expands a bit and transfers some energy rather than just poking a hole through. Most 1-48 will shoot conicals O.K. but a faster twist will stabilze the bullet better. I belive both the TC and Investarms/lyman/Cabelas in 1-48 are shallow grove so with a little tinkering you should find a conical that shoots well. Try a wonder wad over the powder, in most cases accuracy is better and cuts down on fowling.

PRBs have the advantage that although they carry less energy they transfer it better to the target once hit. They are also a lot less expensive to shoot and the recoil is not as hard. If your 1-48 is shallow grove the lighter charges will probably be more accurate.

 

[ss1]

What you said makes perfect sience, however ,didn't the civil war rifles have a slow twist for shooting mini balls? Enfields and etc.

 

[Walks with fire]

How tight should the conical bullet be when loading? In both of my barrels they seem a bit loose. They don't fall down the barrel but it does not take much to push them down either. They don't seem to be ingraving the rifleing much and the groups are straight enough but spead up and down some making me think there is some blow-by and a change in velocity. Should they be lubed a lot more to tighten them up a bit.

Would a over the powder wad help much in tightening the groups up? Do you just push the wonder wad down the barrel with your ramrod? Is there a trick to keeping it straight and not turning sideways in the barrel? How thick of a wad should the wad be? Should it be lubed as well?

I really want to experiment with conicals in my flintlocks. I have 1/66, 1/28 twist barrels and was considering buying a 1/48 twist to shoot conicals but might find that my current rifles would shoot them well with the right stuff. Any tips would be appreciated. I want to try the wads just don't know what thickness would be best.

Thanks to all.

 

[arquebus]

You're right about the CW Rifle-Muskets having a slow twist & shooting long heavy Minie Balls. The reason being, a Minie is different to a true conical bullet; by having that deep cavity in the base it is of a weight-forward design & behaves more like a RB. My repro. Zouave (.58) & original 1858 Amberg (.56) both shoot heavy Minies (612gn & 555gn respectively) very accurately & 100yds+. I tried a shorter lighter Minie in the Amberg thinking that it's slower (1:70") twist should stabilize it better.....it didn't!

 

[Slamfire]

Is more powder and velocity and/or faster rates of twist better to stabilize this type of projectile?

Acutally, yes. Rpms does the stabilizin', you can get the required amount with either of those choices.
Shallow riflin' allows the lead to fill the grooves, while deep riflin' makes room fer the excess patch material.
I don't know about usin' conicals on deer, I bought a fast twist rifle for hog huntin', ain't had a chance to use it on either, yet!
:v

 

[Napper]

I used a 1-48 cva 50 for years got mostly pass through with it I then went to a 58 cal big bore T/c with 115 of ffg for elk. worked better but bouth shout about 2" at 50 yards. Never did get an elk with the 58 a lot of deer though now use a 50cal GPH and use 85 grains of fffg.

 

[spud]

last year I used 500gr.451/.45 cal. creedmore slug in a 1-21 twist tyron target rifle (60 gr fffg) to take a feral hog near Old Town Florida.hog never knew what hit him :grin: