Diagnosis on shooting

[KHickam]

Well, I got to go out to the range today. I shot at various ranges. My first group was at 25 yds off a bench - it resulted in 5 shots that were just a big hole. The load I was using was 70 gr 3F, fiber wad, with a .18 cotton patch and a .600 RB. I was pretty impressed.

Then I shot various shots off hand at 35, 40 and 45 yds off hand.

I then went back to the 50 yd line and shot from the bench - I fired a string of 5 rds and 2 were shots touching in the upper right of the target and 2 were nearly shots touching in the lower left of the target, and the other went who knows where. I was pretty disappointed with that.

I then shot a group from the sitting un-supported position and my group was better than when I shot from the bench.

I cleaned between strings of 5 shots. Targets are below. This is the on going saga and was hoping wise men would have suggestions to ease this dilemma.

Keith

 

[paulvallandigham]

Try cleaning between shots. You need to give yourself all the help you can get, using any smoothbore. Not cleaning between shots allows crud to introduce variables you cannot control.

Also try using 2 fiber wads. I don't know your bore diameter, or the diameter of the wads. But sealing that bore is critical to get consistency. You also don't say what lube you are using. Try lubing the bore after seating the PRB in addition to what you are doing now.

 

[bart_anastasi]

I am not sure what you are usig for a barrel but I have had good results out to 50 yards using 80 gr of Goex 3F a .600 rb and a .010 patch using wonder lube and not wipe between the shots.

Works dont know why but it does for me good luck

 

[Lonegun1894]

safe to guess that you found the range ok? And you picked a good day to do it. Wish i could have been there.

 

[KHickam]

Yes I did - thanks I had seen it several times in the past, I sometimes work dogs out there off the old Markum ranch rd.

Anyway, I will get out again sometime in the next month.

Keith

 

[tg]

I have had better luck from a standing position with a rest for the gun with smoothbores,I cannot get a good normal position when sitting down.

 

[xxgrampa]

greetings kieth,

check your patchs for two sidedness. if it has a ruff side and a smooth side, make sure you always put the same side to the bore.

most guns shoot best with the ruff side to the bore.. quite often it does make a differance..

..ttfn..grampa..

 

[Britsmoothy]

In your last posting with reguard to your troubles I asked some question about your gun but you have not answered them, any particular reason?
Please read them. :hatsoff:

 

[KHickam]

I answered them below - didn't see them earlier. This has been an ongoing thing since last summer. While I was in SD, I practiced lots from bench and off hand and I never have been able to get it to shoot. Based on those suggestions from last year - I took it to a very good local gunsmith in Glen Cross, SD - although he specializes in precision silhouette guns - he has built a couple traditional muzzleloaders (caplocks) and he found no outward or glaring problems in the fit, finish or workmanship.

So, the conclusion that I came up with is the it is more shooter or load related than gun related.

I have tried various loads - and different brands of powder (Graf and Goex) although I only have tried 3F. I have tried different patches and wad combinations and I have come up with some very good ones that print well at 25 yds - but at 50 yds everything goes walleyed on me.

Granted I am much older now (early 40s and had a 12 yr lay off from MZ) but I have owned and shot flintlocks since my early 20s and muzzleloaders since my middle teens - including 3 smoothbores - 2 (TOW and Centermark fusils de chasse) and 1 Brown Bess (Pedersoli) - with both my Tulle's I was exceptionally good with them.

The Bess hurt me everytime I shot it with more than a 60 gr load - so that was a short lived thing.

The only thing I can think of is the stock architecture is wrong for me - but the gun seems to fit well and doesn't hurt me - but unlike both my Tulles if I throw this one up with my eyes closed the front sight is not where I want it I have to cheek down into it to see the sight picture that I have been used to seeing in the past.

Anyway, it got me stumped and I was hoping that by posting pics - someone would be able to tell me what was up. :surrender: :hatsoff:

 

[Mike Brooks]

Take the barrel out and check the lugs. make sure the holes are elongated so the barrel can expand and not bind on the pins. also make sure there is enough room for the lugs to move in the barrel channel with out binding on wood too. Do you have good wood to metal contact at the breech? Is your bore leaded up from shooting shot? Do you have a front sight you can see well?
I'm with TG. I could never shoot a smoothbore off the bench worth a damn. When I would wring a new one out I'd do it off hand and sitting, and maybe leaning against a tree.

 

[matt denison]

I think Mike has some good suggestions. By checking the things that he mentions you can eliminate the gun/barrel as the culprit. Next I would consider the consistency of your loading and priming procedure. This can be very important with any gun and espesially with a flintlock. Too much priming powder can (and will) cause slow lock time giving the shooter time to flinch or drop the muzzle. I've demonstrated this to others who were struggling by using one of those funny little primers that dispences a given amount of 4Fg each time. Use the same amount of horsepower each time you ram the ball down. Watch out for glare on your front sight on a sunny day. Shoot the gun often even if you aren't getting good groups. The more you shoot it the more it will become comfortable in your hands and will "come up" on target. There is no substitute for practice.

L. Dog

 

[ronrryan]

Keep a positive attitude, remembering that your initial 25 yard group at the bench was one hole. That is VERY good news, and means that everything else afterwards is going to be tinkering plus practice until your downrange groups tighten up. Lots of good advice to follow here. Good luck and good smoke, Ron in FL

 

[Many Klatch]

I think Mike has the right idea. It looks like your barrel is binding when it gets hot. If it can't expand due to tight pins then the barrel gets weird and throws the shots off. I know guys that couldn't get their gun to shoot after 5 or 10 shots. We pulled the pins and then shot a few more and it put the ball right where it was supposed to.

Many Klatch

 

[MacTavish]

I have noticed that some rifles will group differently when supported in different locations along the forearm.
When you shot from the bench, then sitting, then offhand, was your hand/support in the same place?

Some people tend to crowd the rear sight a bit when shooting from the bench. Was your cheek weld the same in all three postitions? Maybe your retreating youth makes the sights clearer if you are just that little bit closer.