Dirty Betty Makes Meat

[Hammond79]

I'd fix the rifle or trash it.
Congratulations all the same.

Thank you, I'm going to see what I can do.

 

[Hammond79]

Thank you, I'm going to see what I can do.

This may make a good experience to document for another thread.

Thinking of a couple things to do.
1. Cold clean group from the bench
2. .451 ball vs. .445 for first shot to see if it changes POA closer to the fouled shots
3. Artifical fouling
4. New sights.

Open to suggestions.

 

[Eterry]

So I have a .45 Pedersoli percussion "Kentucky" I have been looking forward to hunting with for almost two years. I did a water test this spring and was pleased with the results. I shot a couple of the forum's mail in matches and was quite pleased with this rifle's accuracy.

I took the rifle to Arkansas this weekend to hunt the new "Alternative Weapons" season. This was the first time I have hunted the Arkansas muzzleloader season in at least 15 years. My primary objective was to harvest a deer with this little .45.

The first morning I am in my ladder and at the corner of a woodlot and well overgrown pasture. I get there about an hour before legal light. The morning is quiet. Then, right at 9am I see a medium size buck (6-8 point eastern count) ghosting through the cedars on the edge of the woodlot. He comes down a trail and stops to check sent on a cedar sapling right in the middle of my shooting lane... it's like he read the script. He's 40 yards away, broadside and I stop him with a mouth bleat. My sights find his "knuckle" and I focus in. Blam! The shot feels perfect, no flinch, no hangfire, my call of the shot was dead on. The buck ran directly in my direction. Just a slight curve in his path like a runner rounding first base. Then up into a thicket. I didn't hear him crash so I reloaded, waited about 20-25 minutes and went to look for sign at the shot. Nothing. I follow the path he took to pass my stand no blood... there's no way I missed. This is a "gimme" shot. There were no obstacles in the path of the ball. I was hitting 1.5 inch dots at 25 yards in the mail in matches very easily. I an convinced the ball didn't pass through and he's not bleeding. I wait an hour then start looking in his direction of travel.... still no blood and no deer. I zigzag and grid search probably 20 acres of pasture land that has been left wild for the last 25 years, not easy going at all. Blackberries, saw briar, elm and ash saplings... awful. Then I cross the road and search a pine plantation on a 50' high ridge... pretty steep and overgrown as well... another 10-15 acres. As I am returning to my stand in the woodlot and cottontail hops by and stops about 20 yards away. I debated for a second then decided I needed to check my zero. I take careful offhand aim. Blam! I hit that rabbit exactly where I was aiming right at the bottom of his ears. Needless to say the results were telling. So I called my brother to come help with the search. While I waited for him to arrive I took the opportunity to shoot at a target I had handy and shot it at 40 yards off hand. The ball hit about 3" high and right of the bull. I told myself even if the first shot was twice that far off it's still a killing shot. We spent another 3 hours scouring the area going out from the shot no less than 300 yards in a semi circle and at least 400 in the direction he ran... no sign at all.

I began to wonder how far off could the "cold clean" bore shot be? So I did a quick field cleaning... poured a few ounces of water down the bore then some 91% rubbing alcohol. Swabbed with coton sheet material until clean/dry. Reloaded and took another shot at 40 yards off hand. The target board fell... but when I looked at the target, no new holes. What? Then I saw the mark in the limb above (I had placed the board in a fork of an old crape myrtle bush). My clean bore shot was somewhere around 10" to 12" high and right from the "dirty" shot. I reloaded the rifle and gave her a new name "Dirty Betty" because she likes it dirty.
I did a couple more sits Saturday evening, busted one when I stood up to leave at last light. Got winded Sunday morning. Went and sat on a piece of public land Sunday night. Had another hunter sitting about 200-250 yards away. No deer sighted.
Then this morning: Monday the 21st I went back to the ladder stand. The wind was favorable and again just like Saturday a young buck this time a fork horn comes down almost the same path the first buck did and at almost exactly the same time right around 9am. Almost like they're punching a timeclock. This buck is about 10 yards further away and I stop him with a mouth bleat when he enters a shooting lane. He stops quartering to me at 51 yards. I draw a bead on the point of his left shoulder. I know the angle is not favorable but it's the only shot I will get before he's out of my lanes and gone. Blam! He bolts back away from me and about 10 squirrels jump up from the ground in the area and start barking like crazy as they scramble up the nearest trees. I listen...no crash. I reloaded and wait about 25 minutes then climb down. I find sign of a hit right away. There's a piece of bone and a spot of what looks like lung tissue on the ground and quite a bit of hair. A few yards over there is a spray of blood, bright red some with tiny bubbles, so far so good. The blood trail goes about 15 yards and stops. Not good. Should be a solid hit. I return to the house for some TP... wasn't prepared, but it gave the wounded animal more time. By the time I got back it had been over an hour since the shot. The direction he went was towards another pine plantation. Thankfully on flat ground. Unfortunately the trees were spaced about 10 yards apart and all manner of brush was present. Including the confounded blackberries. I did a loop in the pines and on my return I spot a drop of blood about the size of a match head in the hardwoods. It's 50 yards from the last blood. I follow it up and find a fairly steady trail of similar drops for about 25 yards with drops every 3-6 feet. The trail fades just at the edge of the pines. I look at the trail of white toilet paper behind me and walk into the pines. There not 20 yards from the edge is the buck in a small depression about the size of a bathtub and 6" deep. It's just about noon and he's already stiff. He died within minutes of the shot. He went right at 100 yards from the shot. Interestingly there was the skeleton and skull of another buck right there with him. I guess this hiding spot was well known. It makes me wonder if does hide their fawns there and these wounded bucks sought it out because they hid there as fawns?

The little. 45 did great. The lack of pass through and blood trail are factors of the shot angle not the power of the gun. My load was 65 grains 3FG Schutzen with a .50 lubed felt wad, .018 oxyoke prelubed ticking patch,.445 speer ball, and a CCI magnum #11 cap. The shot hit just behind his left shoulder and about 2/3 up. The ball was just under the hide right against the last rib on his right side. It got a lung, diaphragm, liver, and the stomach. The ball passed through about 24" of deer. The recovered ball is amazingly similar to the one recovered in my water bottle test. The .45 is a pleasure to shoot and I look forward to contuing to hunt with Dirty Betty in the future.
Pictures to follow.

PS: first deer with PRB and real black.

Nice job! Did you foul the bore before loading? When I shot BP competition we always fired a blank charge before loading. I still do it when hunting. Some barrels don't care, some, like Dirty Betty, really like it dirty.

 

[Eterry]

I'd fix the rifle or trash it.
Congratulations all the same.

Brit, I've seen many match shooters shoot a blank charge before loading, for the same reason, but never that far off POA.. Dirty Betty is rather extreme, maybe she needs a good reaming with a scotchbrite pad.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Brit, I've seen many match shooters shoot a blank charge before loading, for the same reason, but never that far off POA.. Dirty Betty is rather extreme, maybe she needs a good reaming with a scotchbrite pad.

Sure, when trying for itty bitty groups.
They don't do it because there is an issue!
Like 10-12"!

 

[Hammond79]

Nice job! Did you foul the bore before loading? When I shot BP competition we always fired a blank charge before loading. I still do it when hunting. Some barrels don't care, some, like Dirty Betty, really like it dirty.

On the first day I did not...and missed my first shot. For the rabbit and the buck I killed on day 3, I did and she shot true. I will see what I can do to tame the difference. It will be a fun experiment. I have used Scotch Brite already but maybe more wouldn't hurt. Lots of options to try.

 

[Eterry]

On the first day I did not...and missed my first shot. For the rabbit and the buck I killed on day 3, I did and she shot true. I will see what I can do to tame the difference. It will be a fun experiment. I have used Scotch Brite already but maybe more wouldn't hurt. Lots of options to try.

If you have an android phone you can get a camera with 6'cord that plugs into your phone and your see on your screen what's going on in there. I bought one on Amazon a few years ago, pretty cheap as I recall. I've had a few new rifles with burrs in the bore, they needed attention to improve performance.
Honestly never saw one THAT far off with a clean bore.

 

[Eterry]

Sure, when trying for itty bitty groups.
They don't do it because there is an issue!
Like 10-12"!

Dave you're correct. That's a LOT of real estate. I'd go back to the bench and figure it out.

 

[Hammond79]

If you have an android phone you can get a camera with 6'cord that plugs into your phone and your see on your screen what's going on in there. I bought one on Amazon a few years ago, pretty cheap as I recall. I've had a few new rifles with burrs in the bore, they needed attention to improve performance.
Honestly never saw one THAT far off with a clean bore.

This rifle is far from new. It's a 1972 make. I think it sat in a closet quite a while. I've done a bit of work on the bore already but it has a "frosted" appearance. There is a noticeable difference about the bottom 3 inches of the bore as well. Sounds like a good winter project.

 

[hanshi]

Congratulations on your BP buck. That thrill of a first muzzleloader kill never leaves you. Just IMHO, any deer killed with a bp muzzleloader is a trophy.

 

[Hammond79]

Congratulations on your BP buck. That thrill of a first muzzleloader kill never leaves you. Just IMHO, any deer killed with a bp muzzleloader is a trophy.

Thanks, far from my first muzzleloader deer, but first with PRB and holy black. My others have been with conicals, unmentionables, and substitute power (Pyrodex). The photo below is from the 2012 inaugural "Traditional" muzzleloader season on Fort Sill, OK. Load was 75 grains Pyrodex P, with a 240 grain PA conical from the Lyman Deerstalker pictured.

 

[LME]

So I have a .45 Pedersoli percussion "Kentucky" I have been looking forward to hunting with for almost two years. I did a water test this spring and was pleased with the results. I shot a couple of the forum's mail in matches and was quite pleased with this rifle's accuracy.

I took the rifle to Arkansas this weekend to hunt the new "Alternative Weapons" season. This was the first time I have hunted the Arkansas muzzleloader season in at least 15 years. My primary objective was to harvest a deer with this little .45.

The first morning I am in my ladder and at the corner of a woodlot and well overgrown pasture. I get there about an hour before legal light. The morning is quiet. Then, right at 9am I see a medium size buck (6-8 point eastern count) ghosting through the cedars on the edge of the woodlot. He comes down a trail and stops to check sent on a cedar sapling right in the middle of my shooting lane... it's like he read the script. He's 40 yards away, broadside and I stop him with a mouth bleat. My sights find his "knuckle" and I focus in. Blam! The shot feels perfect, no flinch, no hangfire, my call of the shot was dead on. The buck ran directly in my direction. Just a slight curve in his path like a runner rounding first base. Then up into a thicket. I didn't hear him crash so I reloaded, waited about 20-25 minutes and went to look for sign at the shot. Nothing. I follow the path he took to pass my stand no blood... there's no way I missed. This is a "gimme" shot. There were no obstacles in the path of the ball. I was hitting 1.5 inch dots at 25 yards in the mail in matches very easily. I an convinced the ball didn't pass through and he's not bleeding. I wait an hour then start looking in his direction of travel.... still no blood and no deer. I zigzag and grid search probably 20 acres of pasture land that has been left wild for the last 25 years, not easy going at all. Blackberries, saw briar, elm and ash saplings... awful. Then I cross the road and search a pine plantation on a 50' high ridge... pretty steep and overgrown as well... another 10-15 acres. As I am returning to my stand in the woodlot and cottontail hops by and stops about 20 yards away. I debated for a second then decided I needed to check my zero. I take careful offhand aim. Blam! I hit that rabbit exactly where I was aiming right at the bottom of his ears. Needless to say the results were telling. So I called my brother to come help with the search. While I waited for him to arrive I took the opportunity to shoot at a target I had handy and shot it at 40 yards off hand. The ball hit about 3" high and right of the bull. I told myself even if the first shot was twice that far off it's still a killing shot. We spent another 3 hours scouring the area going out from the shot no less than 300 yards in a semi circle and at least 400 in the direction he ran... no sign at all.

I began to wonder how far off could the "cold clean" bore shot be? So I did a quick field cleaning... poured a few ounces of water down the bore then some 91% rubbing alcohol. Swabbed with coton sheet material until clean/dry. Reloaded and took another shot at 40 yards off hand. The target board fell... but when I looked at the target, no new holes. What? Then I saw the mark in the limb above (I had placed the board in a fork of an old crape myrtle bush). My clean bore shot was somewhere around 10" to 12" high and right from the "dirty" shot. I reloaded the rifle and gave her a new name "Dirty Betty" because she likes it dirty.
I did a couple more sits Saturday evening, busted one when I stood up to leave at last light. Got winded Sunday morning. Went and sat on a piece of public land Sunday night. Had another hunter sitting about 200-250 yards away. No deer sighted.
Then this morning: Monday the 21st I went back to the ladder stand. The wind was favorable and again just like Saturday a young buck this time a fork horn comes down almost the same path the first buck did and at almost exactly the same time right around 9am. Almost like they're punching a timeclock. This buck is about 10 yards further away and I stop him with a mouth bleat when he enters a shooting lane. He stops quartering to me at 51 yards. I draw a bead on the point of his left shoulder. I know the angle is not favorable but it's the only shot I will get before he's out of my lanes and gone. Blam! He bolts back away from me and about 10 squirrels jump up from the ground in the area and start barking like crazy as they scramble up the nearest trees. I listen...no crash. I reloaded and wait about 25 minutes then climb down. I find sign of a hit right away. There's a piece of bone and a spot of what looks like lung tissue on the ground and quite a bit of hair. A few yards over there is a spray of blood, bright red some with tiny bubbles, so far so good. The blood trail goes about 15 yards and stops. Not good. Should be a solid hit. I return to the house for some TP... wasn't prepared, but it gave the wounded animal more time. By the time I got back it had been over an hour since the shot. The direction he went was towards another pine plantation. Thankfully on flat ground. Unfortunately the trees were spaced about 10 yards apart and all manner of brush was present. Including the confounded blackberries. I did a loop in the pines and on my return I spot a drop of blood about the size of a match head in the hardwoods. It's 50 yards from the last blood. I follow it up and find a fairly steady trail of similar drops for about 25 yards with drops every 3-6 feet. The trail fades just at the edge of the pines. I look at the trail of white toilet paper behind me and walk into the pines. There not 20 yards from the edge is the buck in a small depression about the size of a bathtub and 6" deep. It's just about noon and he's already stiff. He died within minutes of the shot. He went right at 100 yards from the shot. Interestingly there was the skeleton and skull of another buck right there with him. I guess this hiding spot was well known. It makes me wonder if does hide their fawns there and these wounded bucks sought it out because they hid there as fawns?

The little. 45 did great. The lack of pass through and blood trail are factors of the shot angle not the power of the gun. My load was 65 grains 3FG Schutzen with a .50 lubed felt wad, .018 oxyoke prelubed ticking patch,.445 speer ball, and a CCI magnum #11 cap. The shot hit just behind his left shoulder and about 2/3 up. The ball was just under the hide right against the last rib on his right side. It got a lung, diaphragm, liver, and the stomach. The ball passed through about 24" of deer. The recovered ball is amazingly similar to the one recovered in my water bottle test. The .45 is a pleasure to shoot and I look forward to contuing to hunt with Dirty Betty in the future.
Pictures to follow.

PS: first deer with PRB and real black.

Nice shot placement! I always have said M.L. hunting is a lot of fun when you see you figured everything out.

 

[Eterry]

Congratulations on your BP buck. That thrill of a first muzzleloader kill never leaves you. Just IMHO, any deer killed with a bp muzzleloader is a trophy.

I agree.

 

[mtfishn]

Congratulations on your success and appreciate your diligence in tracking/following up!

 

[Hammond79]

Congratulations on your success and appreciate your diligence in tracking/following up!

Thank you!

 

[Sniperdoc]

The pic of the dirty vs cold bore shot is pretty extreme, any chance you flinched? Possibly a bad (out of round) ball?