Double barrel flintlock shotgun question

[Pukka Bundook]

Feltwad,

I just wrote a reply and lost it.

Small world.
I have a French double on its way at present, and the locks are Also marked Labarde, Paris!
It has very similar break-off to yours, but is not in nearly such good condition, and re-stocked in England.
The manner you describe of the barrels being secured is to me completely new! I wonder if mine are /were the same? I can see no barrel key in the fore-end, but mine has the entry pipe broken, so again will require work.
Barrels on this one are marked Luis Santos, and am told by someone that should know, that the marks are genuine. This means they were made 1721 at the latest. (the year he died)so V early for double barrels.
Said barrels are short. either chopped or ?? The muzzles are not thick, so do not Appear chopped... Will know more when it arrives.
A few photos for you;

 

[F.G. Ford]

Hello RJ,
If you can sketch me an exact copy of your entry pipe,( that is the remaining part that is still on the gun ) I would be glad to make you another one.
NO CHARGE!
You can't beat that.
I would need the length of the missing pipe and copy as close as possible to the piece that is still there.
Also if you could measure the inside diameter of the other thimbles would help me with the proper diameter of the entry pipe.
I am not a registered gunsmith, but have been repairing guns for over 55 years.
I live 70 kms. south of Ottawa, On.
Best regards!
Fred

 

[Pukka Bundook]

That is a very kind offer, Old Ford!

Thank you for that.
I have not received it yet, but will keep in touch.
It sounds like we are about the same, I also am no gunsmith, but have been making and fixing since before I was a teenager, so I might be all right.

I suppose our annual shoot here in Alberta is a bit far for you to come? It's a Victorian setting, and we make a weekend and a bit of it.
It's the last full weekend of June, so 23rd & 24th I think this time.

You would be more than welcome!

All the best,
Richard.

 

[F.G. Ford]

RJDH
A few years back, I would gladly take you up on your kind on your kind offer.
My mobility has gone down hill since, so I don't travel too far from home.
I am pleased that you can fix that fine looking shotgun.
Please show it to us when you get it.
All the best!
Fred

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Thank you Fred,

I will indeed let you know when it arrives, and up to now, it is a bit of a mystery.
(Spanish/French /English..)

If you ever Do wind up over this way, look us up!

Richard.

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Rifleman,

Here are the fresh took photos of my double.

18 bore & 1811 hallmarks on the entry pipe.

 

[Feltwad]

Mine is an 18-bore, not named on the locks but a Birmingam job, Nice twist barrels and hallmarked on the entry pipe for 1811.
French cocks, roller frizzens and waterproof pans.
I will take some photos one day. Only had it since 1982!

Richard.

Nice piece like the French detachable locks for the case ,most were cased like that I see the case has been relined maybe the moths got the original lining which is common .
I must not forget the top hat , hope you have the black frock coat and black boots with the brown leather tops to match . I still have mine but doubtful if they will fit me now around the middle
Feltwad

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Mr. G,

The black boots /brown tops Would be a very nice touch! It seems there is always something missing .....and yes, clothing Always shrinks around the perimeter it seems...

The case is an old Joe Manton, from his days in Hanover Square. It came from Bert Hartley's wood shed. Did you know Bert? He was a gamekeeper at Thurlby, bottom of Sutton Bank.
It had rot on one corner, and the lining was all eaten up. I re-lined it with baize and managed to save the original label.
Made keys for it as well.
The gun I acquired from old man (John) Bulmer, Lord Mayor's walk. I am sure you would know the shop!

Sat up in his office and had tea whilst we figured which one to buy. Nice old fashioned way of doing business..
This was about 1982.

All the best,
Richard.

 

[Feltwad]

Mr. G,

The black boots /brown tops Would be a very nice touch! It seems there is always something missing .....and yes, clothing Always shrinks around the perimeter it seems...

The case is an old Joe Manton, from his days in Hanover Square. It came from Bert Hartley's wood shed. Did you know Bert? He was a gamekeeper at Thurlby, bottom of Sutton Bank.
It had rot on one corner, and the lining was all eaten up. I re-lined it with baize and managed to save the original label.
Made keys for it as well.
The gun I acquired from old man (John) Bulmer, Lord Mayor's walk. I am sure you would know the shop!

Sat up in his office and had tea whilst we figured which one to buy. Nice old fashioned way of doing business..
This was about 1982.

All the best,
Richard.

Yes I remember those days well I also rescued a double oak box by Boss from a wood shed it was in good condition today it is worth a lot of money
I also made a visit to Bulmer shop when in York can you remember the hand rail on the stairs which was made from punt gun barrels ,he also kept me supplied with sand castings which cost me 7 shillings and 6 pence each. Do you remember when he had a table at the old Nottingham Arms Fair
We are now getting away from the main subject of this thread with our reminiscing .
Feltwad

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Feltwad,

It seems no-one else is playing on this thread, so I will answer your last message;

No, I do not remember the bannister for some reason! I wish I did! Don't know how I missed that.

That Boss case wouldn't be for gun number 149 would it? (1837) If so, I might want to do a deal!

I didn't go to every Arms fair at Nottingham, but do recall Bulmers there. V nice old fashioned firm.
I also recall being crowded out of that tiny shop front, when the York Arms Fair was cancelled,...and no-one knew until they got there.
Then, as a bit of a palliative, everyone and his uncle descended on Bulmers!

Richard.

 

[F.G. Ford]

Really nice find!
Thank you for sharing.
Fred

 

[Pukka Bundook]

Hello Fred,

Trust all is well with you.
Pleased you like it.

I found this one about 36 years ago, but still enjoy looking at it. I should use it more! Haven't fired it for years.

All the best,
Richard.

 

[bpd303]

I know this thread is a year older, but so am I and I haven't been on the forum for some time various reasons got in the way of my muzzleloading addiction.
I noticed Spence and I both have flintlock doubles made by J.T. Phillips with Cochran locks. Maybe Spence will see this and put his pictures back in. (sad we lost so many pictures). Here is the thread about mine. Sorry to say I haven't shot her in a long time, maybe I'll get the chance to take her out and bust some clay birds again.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/double-barrel-16-gauge-flintlock-shotgun.95853/

 

[Rifleman1776]

I know this thread is a year older, but so am I and I haven't been on the forum for some time various reasons got in the way of my muzzleloading addiction.
I noticed Spence and I both have flintlock doubles made by J.T. Phillips with Cochran locks. Maybe Spence will see this and put his pictures back in. (sad we lost so many pictures). Here is the thread about mine. Sorry to say I haven't shot her in a long time, maybe I'll get the chance to take her out and bust some clay birds again.
https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/double-barrel-16-gauge-flintlock-shotgun.95853/

Randy, wondered where ye went, glad to see ye back. Might see you at Berryville. Some guys there who might be able to give you info on that nice shotty. G. Gedny Goodwin, and as much as I hate to say it, Danny Caywood or 'Hawk' Pierce. If Charlie Caywood is still around he might have good info also.