Drinking habits, then and now.

[TN.Frank]

http://homedistiller.org/methanol.htm
"Some fruit juices are naturally high in methanol - for example apple juice can have 0.2-0.3% methanol, or if derived from pulp by enzymatic degradation, the levels can be 2 to 3 times higher."
This is one of my favorite web sites since I like to distill and otherwise ferment stuff to drink.LOL.
Here's more info from the site.
"Methanol is a by-product of fermentation; more methanol is produced in fruit fermentation than in grains. Brewers do not remove the methanol in beer and wine because methanol is not especially toxic at low concentrations. You are looking at between 0.4%-1% methanol in wines and brandies and smaller amounts in beers. Distillers remove almost all the methanol in most cases. Ever notice how vodka produces clean hangovers and wines (particularly reds) give you very nasty hangovers? Methanol. That, and dehydration!"

 

[AZ-Robert]

The Triangle Trade was rum from New England to Africa, traded for slaves; slaves transported to the Carribean, traded for molasses ( also known as the Middle Passage); molasses carried to New England to be converted to rum.

The version shoved down my throat several decades ago in a one-room school house in rural SC included cotton & tobacco.... cotton, tobacco, lumber, sugar and molassas from the Americas to England.... textiles, guns, and rum from England to Africa.... all of that plus the slaves from Africa to the Americas.

Re the shift from cider to beer, I have read somewhere (source forgotten) that beer's popularity surged around the time of the Civil War and after. Partly a result of new immigration from beer-drinking parts of Europe, but also because of new tech... refrigeration allowed brewing in the summer and pasturization aided transport beyond local markets... which figures in to the shift towards large regional breweries Brawdhead mentioned.

 

[Yagee]

What a wonderful post, very interesting. I am enlighten and astounded by the amount of knowledge available on this forum. :applause: The only information I can add to this post is, reading all of this has made me thirsty. I do enjoy my Wild Turkey and Bass Ale. Well I have to go now. I need to get a refill.

Thanks for the info. and the thirst.
Yagee :hatsoff:

 

[bezoar]

The methenol is technically present in the fruit, but not as methenol. The fruit such as apples, plums, pears, cheeries, etc contail a compound called pection. Most of you who make your own jelly at home know what pectin is used for. However when fermented, pectin produces alot of methenol. Hence lots of distillers in new zealand discovered that when making a fruit based mash for the still, that adding pectic enzymes at the start of fermentation will reduce/prevent the formation of methenol, and the resulting distillate will be extremely soft on the brain the next morning.

 

[Henry]

Now I know why a hangover from Calvados is
much less painfull than one with hard cider
even if both are made with the same apples .

Today there is no more good hard cider in Québec
and with the money conversion Calvados is out
of my budget ....

Well, thanks anyway , I am going to bed
smarter than when I got up .

 

[TN.Frank]

Down here in the States we get Hornsby's Pub Draft Cider, it's 6%(the highest legal limit in my County) and is pretty good but at $7 bucks a six pack it's much cheaper for me to just make my own.

 

[graybeard]

All this talk about what causes headaches is enlightening. :v I've been under the impression for more than 50 years that sleeping in log cabins or tents gave me headaches. :haha: You mean to tell me some other factors are involved? :shocked2: graybeard

 

[Brawdhead]

http://homedistiller.org/methanol.htm
Here's more info from the site.
"Methanol is a by-product of fermentation; more methanol is produced in fruit fermentation than in grains.

Thanks for that link. I see the site perpetuates the notion (inaccurate, as far as I've been able to determine) that methanol comes from fermentation (the anaerobic conversion of carbohydrates into carbon dioxide and alcohols or acids), even though the material they quote says it is actually a product of pectin degradation (either from heat or enzymatically via pectinase).

However, I do see where the confusion comes in. Additional pectin degradation and subsequent hydrolization into methanol can occur during fermentation (I suspect similar may also with other polysaccharides), but the process neither is part of nor is caused by the fermentation any more than putting up Halloween decorations causes birds to migrate; they just often coincide.

Fermentation and other processes of yeast metabolism can produce hundreds of different types of alcohols, but I don't think methanol is among them, at least not at the concentrations we're talking about.

Dan

 

[TN.Frank]

One thing I've learned as I've gotten older is DON'T DRINK SO MUCH. That helps me to avoid hangovers even from homemade hard cider. I generally have a 32oz mug or two in a nights drinking and not much more, back in the day I'd have drank several mugs and paid for it the next day. With age comes moderation. :hmm:

 

[laffingman67]

I see the site perpetuates the notion (inaccurate, as far as I've been able to determine) that methanol comes from fermentation (the anaerobic conversion of carbohydrates into carbon dioxide and alcohols or acids), even though the material they quote says it is actually a product of pectin degradation (either from heat or enzymatically via pectinase).

:shocked2:

 

[Vagabond]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that the alcohol to weight ratio favores the harder drinks. I don't know about anyone else here, but when I'm out in the backcountry I don't lug aroung a few cases of beer, just a pint or two of whisky (not a huge fan of rum, but it gets the job done. :winking: )

 

[Seamus]

Keep in mind that the beer consumed in early America was different from most of what we consume today. It seems that most malting was done in large towns or well financed plantations. I have found several old recipes that use molasses rather than malted barley. It actually makes a pretty good beer, I prefer it with hops.
BTW, hops act as a preservative as well as adding bitterness for flavoring.

The story I heard about rum is that it could be made drinkable faster than whiskey which had to be aged. At that point in history molasses was cheaper than corn, plus corn was more valued a a food. This story comes from some information that I picked up while in the Virgin Islands. It sounds plausible but I don't have any documentation.

 

[cheapeats]

I don't remember the source but I read somewhere that one of the reasons hard cider was dirven out of the market is because of "apple Jack" a rough cousin to the calvados which was produced by freezing cider and draining off the liquid which was higher in alcohol content. Because it was not distilled taxes could not be collected on it.

 

[rabjr]

What about Mead? Was that ever fashionable here? I always wanted to brew some up and just might this winter when things calm down.

 

[renovato]

I've brewed mead in the past. If you get the chance, definately try it. It's not that hard to make and is really tasty. With so many English settling here, I would imagine mead was popular if they had access to enough honey.

 

[rabjr]

I'm thinking of trying the Dry first Plink, which type have you done?

 

[renovato]

I've only ever made the dry. I don't much care for sweetness in my drinks. I think that's what appeals to me the most about it. It has the distinct aroma and taste of honey, without the sweetness. Very satisfying!

 

[rabjr]

Thanks Plink, thats exactly what I would be looking for as well. We have several kinds of apple trees on our place in the Adirondacks and thought we'd try brewing up some Hard Cider using our apples. So we went ahead and ordered a Hard Cider and Mead kit tonight. :haha: Should be interesting in a couple of months.

 

[renovato]

Hey good luck on the brewing. I've never brewed hard cider. I did do something hilarious when I was a kid of about 10 though. I was always a book worm and had read that yeast caused fermentation, and that cooling steam was distillation.

So, one summer I picked a BUNCH of peaches from our trees, snuck them out to the shed and juiced them into a drum. I added baking yeast from the kitchen and a few days later, bubbles! It smelled terrible and I had no idea what I was doing, but when the bubbles stopped a week or two later, I improvised a "still" using a pressure cooker and copper water line that is used to feed evaporative coolers.

Well, what came out smelled nasty, but sure enough, it lit on fire! It tasted just as nasty, but 10-12 year olds aren't that picky when it comes to booze. I made a fortune selling the stuff to my school friends a pint canning jar at a time. I'd push the lawnmower down to my friends house and we'd go out selling peach hooch for the day, then come home telling our parents we had been out mowing lawns for money.

We fermented and distilled for several weeks and demand for our product was high. I remember buying myself a pellet gun, one of those LARC BB machine guns (I miss that thing), a bicycle and some other stuff that year!

My dad found out some years later, and laughed about it to his dying day. My mom still teases me about it. :rotf:

 

[rabjr]

:rotf: