Dutch' s ratio 7:1 ???

[longcruise]

Maybe, but he was talking about domestic swat teams. The average shot taken by a domestic "sniper" is 45 yards. They can jump through all the hoops they can imagine, but in the end, any discount ammo from Wally World would do. :haha:

A swat team works out at my club on regular basis and I've had many opportunities to see their results. Not impressive at all, but they could certainly do their jobs out to about 200 yards.

 

[Jim C]

"If the flyer isn't caused by a hangover or nervous twitch, what could cause them?"

Would definitely have to be some sort or other of an inconsistency in that particular load or loading process that the shot was fired from.

 

[Dr5x]

I've always compared ML Riflemen to reloaders.
We do exactly the same things as they do except that our cartridge is the barrel of the rifle.

A man who used to do printing for me as a side job worked at an ammunition factory and he told me that they check every 10,000 round produced.

This same factory acquired some fame by shipping a very large load of .50 ammunition to Iraq that proved to have no propellent powder in them..

I lack faith in some American products.

Dutch

 

[jamesthomas]

I've always compared ML Riflemen to reloaders.
We do exactly the same things as they do except that our cartridge is the barrel of the rifle.


This same factory acquired some fame by shipping a very large load of .50 ammunition to Iraq that proved to have no propellent powder in them..

I lack faith in some American products.

Dutch

It makes me wonder if they did it on porpose?.

 

[Billnpatti]

I don't see how that procedure is going to be easily repeatable.

It would seem that you are progressing from a 4:1 to a 9:1 mix, but each time you soak a patch you reduce your quantity of mixture but you are not reducing the amount of water with each additional ounce. Somewhere in the six different ratios may be the perfect combo, but you will never know exactly what it is.

I always made separate batches. Actually, I never saw much difference between a 5:1 up to a 10:1 ratio.

When the solution is prepared, it is an homogenous solution. You are only going to dip enough patch material in it to make 5 or so patches. You will be removing both water and Ballistol but you will be squeezing out any excess liquid back into the original container of the mixture. You will not have changed the dilution significantly. At least not enough to make any difference. Each subsequent dilution will not vary significantly either. I suppose that if you did a chemical analysis of each dilution, you may find a variation from the expected dilution ratio but I suspect that it would be within the expected variation one would get when using a shotglass to measure the ingredients. The tiny variations in the dilutions are simply within the expected error for the method and will not be significant.

Certainly, if one were to use calibrated pipettes to measure each of the ingredients and make several separate dilutions, each dilution would be much closer than the shotglass method of measurement. Would one likely see a significant difference? I have not done an experiment to compare the two methods but doubt it make a significant difference. Many shooters over many years, who have used Dutch's method, find that it works. Not everyone does but many more find that it does work than find that it doesn't work for them. But, in the final analysis, do whatever feels good to you. :hatsoff:

 

[longcruise]

Would one likely see a significant difference?

Not IMO, as I stated above. But, if you are in a search for the ideal mix, then I see no reason for self sabotage. I would mix very small batches (simply for economy) that would soak enough patches for 25 shots each and go to the range. Done Deal in one trip!

 

[M. De Land]

I'd feel better about mixing the rations separately an individually.
I'm experimenting with some felt wads soaked in moose milk and dried out to see if it will work in revolvers.
Kind of a home made "wonder wad" to see what happens.
So far all I have tested is felt wads soaked in my home made BPCR lube and am favorably impressed with them to this point.
Need to do some more accuracy testing of them against cream of wheat loads for match work but I sure like the convenience of how they load and each chamber getting the same amount of lube.

 

[okawbow]

I tried a 6 to 1 mix of Ballistol and water. I used denim that was .023" compressed, with a .283 ball in a .300 bore. The groove depth is .012".

I soaked the washed denim in the mix, and lightly pulled the strip over the edge of a baking pan to wring off excess liquid. I let the cloth dry and put it in a zip lock bag.

Previously, I tried my Tennessee rifle with a spit patch and various patch thicknesses. I did ok at 25 yards, but was all over the place at 50.

Here are the results of 10 shots with the thicker denim "dry" patch. I wiped between shots with a slightly damp patch. The ball loaded easily with my hickory ramrod. The first 6 shots were aimed at the center. The last 4, in the 10 ring, were aimed at the 8 ring at the bottom of the bull. The barrel is a Charlie Burton, square groove, 3/4" slightly swamped, 42" long. The L&R flintlock went off fast, every time.

This grouping seems better than I can actually see at 50 yards. I'm sure if I fired off a rest, the group would be even smaller.
50 yard target 30 cal by okawbow, on Flickr

P2120645 by okawbow, on Flickr

 

[Dr5x]

The Gov't thought it might be sabotage but it was. It was just a lackadaisical approach to work ethic.

Dutch

 

[Dr5x]

If you are trying to judge a patching or a lubrication don't base your results on offhand shooting.
Do all your testing bench rest so you can learn how the rifle performs. Shooting off hand you add in the major variable of your own personal swaying about.
Once your bench rest shooting shows your rifle is getting pleasing groups you can then graduate yourself to offhand secure in the knowledge that all the variations are the fault of your wife;s husband.

Dutch

 

[okawbow]

Thanks, Dutch

I know I can't shoot as tight groups offhand as I can from a bench. However; I only shoot this rifle in off hand matches or squirrel hunting. I need the off hand practice, and the changes I made in my patch and lube made an obvious improvement in my grouping.

I'm sure the bench would cut those groups in half. I certainly can't see any better than that, any way. When I get more time at the range, I'll work on fine tuning the load on the bench. I haven't even tried different powder charges yet. I used 30 grains, 3F Goex for that target. By the way, the patches look perfect after the shot. No burning or fraying at all.

 

[Dr5x]

A PARTIAL SOLUTION FOR A WEAVING FRONT
Shooting offhand we (or at least I diid) are faced with the front sight not being rock steady but weaving a bit front left to right and back again. We have to learn when to fire as the front sight approaches the center of the target so that the rifle goes off just at the right time when the front sight is momentarily right where we would want it to be.
Everybody knows that, I think.
I don't know where I got it but I have a little video game sort of thing that replicates the experience of the weaving front sight.
It comes from Russia and there isn't a word of English on it but it allows you 3 shots in 30 seconds. The weaving increases as time passes. You will be scored but more importantly there is a small green target that shows where your hits would have hit. About 20 minutes with this and my groups began to tighten nicely.

If anyone is interested in a copy of this.
Email me at
[email protected]
And I'll send a copy to you no charge. I think its a neat way to practice for a problem that doesn't cost anything.

Dutch Schoultz

 

[Grumpa]

Front sight...front sight...front sight!

 

[Crewdawg445]

Aim small, miss small! :thumbsup:

 

[Dr5x]

Few were interested so I am withdrawing the Offer.
It's good to see so many are rock hard and unsaying when hold on an offhand target./

Dutch

 

[Dr5x]

I had long wondered what the effect of recoil would have on accuracy. I went to some lengths to restrict the effect of recoil by use of slings etc similar to the Army's 1940's instruction.
Just today I have learned that the bullet of ball patched or naked is apparently long gone before the recoil effect would have any effect on the trajectory.
There have been many high speed videos showing the effect of projectiles hitting all sorts of target.
A subscriber pointed out that the thing to watch is not the effect of the projectile hitting the target item but to watch the action of the barrel after the projectile has gone down range.
Apparently the projectile is some yards away before the recoil even begins to move the barrel.

Very interesting

Dutch

 

[Joe Zakas]

I have been wondering about that also. Perhaps the gas expansion in the barrel pushing the ball has no effect until ejected out the muzzle. At that point the barrel is a "jet" engine pushing towards the shoulder. :hmm:
slojo

 

[Grumpa]

deti.mil.by

 

[Skychief]

Tonight I have prepped some patching strips from 1:4-1:7.

I simply used the Ballistol cap to meter out the ratios into a bowl.

Anxious to give them a workout. I will try to report back here with findings.

Depending on how wet the leftovers of "tropical depression Bill" are, it may be as early as tomorrow or as late as a few days before I can try them.

Best regards, Skychief.

 

[Dr5x]

SloJoe,
Your thinking on the cause of recoil is amazingly obvious and I am embarrassed to admit that it never occurred to me.

I have tried to apply logic topmost aspects of the sport but it never crossed my mind to consider the reasons for recoil.

I guess I was blaming The Great Hunting Spirit.

Thank you for the clarification

Dutch Schoultz