If ya can get hold of the recent issue of Early American Life magazine there is a great article with a bunch of pictures about F&I n colonial powder horns. They are beautiful n offer a slew of ideas for guys that want to carve on their horns. The horns will also give an idea of just how a horn from those time periods should look. BUT YA GOTTA REMEMBER THOSE HORNS ARE 200 YEARS OLD n the horn you may carry would not have that depth of patina on it even if ya had carried it for a good many years.Many want to cary items that look old n used n thats ok but sometimes I belive we all fall into the trap of carrying items that would look totally out of place if we were transported back in time. Having items that look used is one thing but they also carried new stuff very often n we need to remember that too.That stuff got old looking through use n many many years of age and the patina could only come long after the original owner was probably long dead. makeing an item look old is fine by me but maybe we try to make things that look TOO old to be realistic-- just some thoughts YMHS Birdman :hmm:
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Early American Life
- Thread starter Birdman
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If they're F&I they'd better be 250 years old. :wink:
True, though. Your gear should look new to 40 years old. Though I deer hunt with a bolt-action rifle that's 70 years old. I still shoot my Grandfather's .22LR - and that's 100 years old.
:haha:
True, though. Your gear should look new to 40 years old. Though I deer hunt with a bolt-action rifle that's 70 years old. I still shoot my Grandfather's .22LR - and that's 100 years old.
:haha:
Yes Sir, I like new items that replicate old school.
If you actually use the stuff it takes on a broke in/used look by itself in just a few short years.
Getting something that looks really antique, is likely something that would have bee thrown away and replaced back in the day.
Or, belongs on a shelf to be admired as an antique,,
I know it's Hollywood, but the movie Jeremia Johnson makes the point. He showed up on the egde of the frontier, bought all new gear and headed out. As he learned new skills, his new things wore out or lost, it ends with him in a bear skin coat.
p.s. I DO tarnish new brass though, don't like shiney :shake:
If you actually use the stuff it takes on a broke in/used look by itself in just a few short years.
Getting something that looks really antique, is likely something that would have bee thrown away and replaced back in the day.
Or, belongs on a shelf to be admired as an antique,,
I know it's Hollywood, but the movie Jeremia Johnson makes the point. He showed up on the egde of the frontier, bought all new gear and headed out. As he learned new skills, his new things wore out or lost, it ends with him in a bear skin coat.
p.s. I DO tarnish new brass though, don't like shiney :shake:
troutabout
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Here is a horn I bought off ebay. Someone had started it many , many years ago and it got abandoned. The only thing that had been done to it was the wooden base had been carved from some aromatic wood (smells like sandalwood) and the eagle had been etched and a hole started in the end of a long narrow pointed end. Since the horn was solid for a good 4 inched at the pointed end I had to cut that off to get within an inch of the cavity. Then I bored out the hole to almost 1/2 inch and glued in the brass tube ( a cut-down .45 shell). I relieved the wood base to fit it deeper - glued it in and pre-drilled the holes for the brass brads to eliminate splitting. I use a violin tuner for the plug.
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Aging anything like leather, guns, knives and powder horns today is a preference, not a suppose to do thing.
Aging HC accutrements is a type of art form today! Yes, the old boys of 200-250 years ago probably bought new equipment, but a lot of their stuff was handed down and some bought used as they could obtain. Powder horns for example came dyed sometimes from some Trader's, Horner Shops, Gun Makers and Horn Factories, as research in modern sources tell us, but also many were left basically as they came off the cow and not colored. Horn can take on a tan, brown or yellowish tone over time.
Birdman, you mention about having things look too old, but you have to remember, that those years way back when were hard on life and individuals equipment. During the F&I War, Revolution and just daily life of a farmer on the frontier would sooner than you think make his equipment show quick hard use in appearance and battle scars very similar to adding that aged look we sometimes like on our plunder! ... That's what living history is all about and that's the reason behind people wanting that old timey look on their items today!
Patina is not just the color of age, but the general surface condition of an object as well.
There is no right or wrong way in having today's contemporary equipment look new or beat-up and discolored or well used. ... It's just an individual choice!
Rick
Aging HC accutrements is a type of art form today! Yes, the old boys of 200-250 years ago probably bought new equipment, but a lot of their stuff was handed down and some bought used as they could obtain. Powder horns for example came dyed sometimes from some Trader's, Horner Shops, Gun Makers and Horn Factories, as research in modern sources tell us, but also many were left basically as they came off the cow and not colored. Horn can take on a tan, brown or yellowish tone over time.
Birdman, you mention about having things look too old, but you have to remember, that those years way back when were hard on life and individuals equipment. During the F&I War, Revolution and just daily life of a farmer on the frontier would sooner than you think make his equipment show quick hard use in appearance and battle scars very similar to adding that aged look we sometimes like on our plunder! ... That's what living history is all about and that's the reason behind people wanting that old timey look on their items today!
Patina is not just the color of age, but the general surface condition of an object as well.
There is no right or wrong way in having today's contemporary equipment look new or beat-up and discolored or well used. ... It's just an individual choice!
Rick
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Dead on Rick. :thumbsup:
It's natural for us to think everything looked old back then- it was a long time ago! I remember being shocked (awakened)when I saw the movie "The Black Robe" and the cabins being built were all fresh-peeled, naked looking wood. I guess I wasn't thinking there was new wood back then, lol.
grandad has a barn shotgun. it's maybe ten years old. Leave it out half exposed to the elements and seldomly oiled that patina comes quick.
I agree with Rick Here!
Aging is a preference, and has become a sort of art in itself, while not always neccesary, we do have to remember that the items in question were used and a whole lot more than we use them today. We may use our stuff alot, but I can almost garauntee that our things are better cared for and less used overall than anything from that time!
We also have to remember the Horns in museums an' sech is the stuff that survived how many other horns got tossed out/ turned into something else after they wore out or broke? what kind of age and patina did those have?
Obviously you bought what you could afford. So when discussing Age and Patina on these things you should remember what(or who) your representing. If your a middle class "Merchant" or Trader etc. then you could afford a new Horn and Gear (If you so choose), if your a dirt farmer, then you probably either made it yourself or Bought/Traded for what you could get Be it new or Used. So it comes down to persona and preference!
Aging is a preference, and has become a sort of art in itself, while not always neccesary, we do have to remember that the items in question were used and a whole lot more than we use them today. We may use our stuff alot, but I can almost garauntee that our things are better cared for and less used overall than anything from that time!
We also have to remember the Horns in museums an' sech is the stuff that survived how many other horns got tossed out/ turned into something else after they wore out or broke? what kind of age and patina did those have?
Obviously you bought what you could afford. So when discussing Age and Patina on these things you should remember what(or who) your representing. If your a middle class "Merchant" or Trader etc. then you could afford a new Horn and Gear (If you so choose), if your a dirt farmer, then you probably either made it yourself or Bought/Traded for what you could get Be it new or Used. So it comes down to persona and preference!
Just so, Rick. The very nature of peoples lives has changed, in that there is less...harshness and physicality to life. Both people and objects were more vigorously used than today.
I do a lot of duplication of historic metal objects, and it is plain taht the surfaces of old objects are produced by original frequency of use, use environment AND by the fact of often long periods of non-use. :yakyak:
I have read that the most skilled Japanese sword polishers, who serve lengthy apprenticeships, can look at a very old sword and repolish it to the way it would have looked originally, given different schools and styles of both sword making and polishing.
As modern makers of old-style objects, we are looking through a glass, darkly, at the lives of our ancestors.
I do a lot of duplication of historic metal objects, and it is plain taht the surfaces of old objects are produced by original frequency of use, use environment AND by the fact of often long periods of non-use. :yakyak:
I have read that the most skilled Japanese sword polishers, who serve lengthy apprenticeships, can look at a very old sword and repolish it to the way it would have looked originally, given different schools and styles of both sword making and polishing.
As modern makers of old-style objects, we are looking through a glass, darkly, at the lives of our ancestors.
Now iffen ya'all go back n reread my first post, I mentioned not having any problem with somebody ageing something. Heck I've done it here n there myself. What I mentioned was more about "how much" ageing we sometimes do. Granted many items were used hard n worn out quick AND some were handed down through the family or purchased in a used condition. All I was thinking about is having an item that looks 200 or LOL 250 years old, I've got stuff thats better then 30 years old n used pretty hard, but it comes nowhere near looking 200 years old. Ageing is up to the individual , I was just mentioning maybe not ageing something quite as much. Useing gear thats new , a little used n well used looking (to me anyway)would be a truer LOOK n closer to what may have been, then having everything looking like antiques from the git go. To each his/her own for sure, just sort a expressing a thought or two is all. YMHS Birdman
AS A HISTORICAL CRAFTSMAN WHO MAKES LONGRIFLES,HORNS,KNIVES ,HAWKS AND HISTORICALLY CORRECT WOOD CHESTS, I CAN TELL YOU THAT HORNS ARE AGED AND COLORED BY DUNKING THEM IN WARM
YELLOW (OR WHATEVER COLOR NEEDED )RIT DYE...AND REMOVING AFTER THE DESIRED COLOR IS REACHED. THEY MUST BE SHAPED AND CARVED IF NESSASARY PREVIOUS TO COLORING.
I THINK AGING IS A NESSASARY EVIL, A TWO SIDED SWORD, ON ONE HAND, YOU LOOK PRETTY STUPID WALKING AROUND A RONDYVOUZ WITH SHINY NEW BRASS AND SPANKIN NEW LEATHERS, KIND OF A DIME STORE COWBOY LOOK IF YOU GET MY DRIFT..AND ON THE OTHER SIDE, YES STUFF USED THEN WOULD HAVE MOSTLY LOOKED NEW, I KINDA FEEL ITS A MENTAL THING..IF IT LOOKS OLD THEN ITS MORE...PART OF THE PAST..
WELL THATS MY 2 CENTS WORTH..LOL
YELLOW (OR WHATEVER COLOR NEEDED )RIT DYE...AND REMOVING AFTER THE DESIRED COLOR IS REACHED. THEY MUST BE SHAPED AND CARVED IF NESSASARY PREVIOUS TO COLORING.
I THINK AGING IS A NESSASARY EVIL, A TWO SIDED SWORD, ON ONE HAND, YOU LOOK PRETTY STUPID WALKING AROUND A RONDYVOUZ WITH SHINY NEW BRASS AND SPANKIN NEW LEATHERS, KIND OF A DIME STORE COWBOY LOOK IF YOU GET MY DRIFT..AND ON THE OTHER SIDE, YES STUFF USED THEN WOULD HAVE MOSTLY LOOKED NEW, I KINDA FEEL ITS A MENTAL THING..IF IT LOOKS OLD THEN ITS MORE...PART OF THE PAST..
WELL THATS MY 2 CENTS WORTH..LOL
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swamp.fox said:
I don't think anyone looks stupid walking around at a RENDEZVOUS or other reenactment wearing clean new period clothing and accutrements. .... Heck, I'm happy and proud to see this as a sign that there are new folks joining our ranks and helping advance the future in our pastime! .... I guess I don't get your drift, as you put it!
Rick
I get the point, but then again, not everything you carry has to be new! as I said before aging is a personal preference, I like some of my stuff "well aged" and others I would rather it be newer, I figger it was as much the same back then as now. :wink:
