Elephant Powder

[Rifleman1776]

This talk about preference between brands is making me chuckle. Albeit, I participated and have preferences. But, I remember in the mid-70s bp became near impossible to purchase. The serious target shooters greatly bemoaned the unavailability of DuPont. I had an ml gunshop at the time and was able to purchase two 50 lb. kegs of bp, one 3Fg, the other 2Fg. I have no idea who the manufacturer was except the kegs said "Made in Scotland". I repackaged into 1 lb. boxes and sold. It worked just fine.

 

[B P Maniac Shooter]

Try Swiss and you won't shoot Goex.

Yep...Swiss is 1st...then Schuetzen & as a last resort shoot GoeX.
In that order......especially when its time to clean the gun.

 

[user 51067]

Pics, or it didn’t happen.

Ooh! Definitely NOT something you might want a "visual" on. Blindness would ensue immediately thereafter!

 

[mtsage]

Just wanted to thank all for the reply posts on my Elephant black powder issues. Many different opinions of course which was too be expected with my question. Time will tell what happens with this powder I have.

 

[3 trees]

A few months back I ran into a old muzzleloader who I shoot with many years ago. He told me he had 4 pds of powder to sell. I bought all 4 pds sight unseen….15$ a pound… turned out to be Elephant 3f… no complaints I will store it for use down the road!!

 

[Two Feathers]

For what it's worth. Do you like Fireworks? I'd make some 1/4 sticks or M80's out of it, just to get rid of it. Then buy some GOOD Goex or Shuetzen. BUT be darned careful with them!!
Again...just my $0.02.
God bless:
Two Feathers

 

[Notchy Bob]

This talk about preference between brands is making me chuckle. Albeit, I participated and have preferences. But, I remember in the mid-70s bp became near impossible to purchase. The serious target shooters greatly bemoaned the unavailability of DuPont. I had an ml gunshop at the time and was able to purchase two 50 lb. kegs of bp, one 3Fg, the other 2Fg. I have no idea who the manufacturer was except the kegs said "Made in Scotland". I repackaged into 1 lb. boxes and sold. It worked just fine.

Maybe Curtis & Harvey? They were said to have made very good powder in their time. I think they were based in Scotland, but my memory is frequently faulty.

I got really low on powder some time around 2002 or thereabouts. It was hard to find. A club member had somewhere purchased two cases of Elephant, one case of FFg and one of FFFg, which he was sharing with club members at cost. I bought a pound of each, in the steel cans. I don't remember what I paid for it. Anyway, I was aware of Elephant's legendary dirtiness, and I was able to find some Goex before tapping into the Elephant. The upshot is that I still have two pounds of Elephant, as a "reserve stash" or "last resort," depending on how you look at it. However, I wouldn't hesitate to shoot it if it was all I had. I would try to learn how to accommodate its quirks. I don't think I would waste it. Powder is too valuable.

Regarding the OP's ignition problems, a duplex load, consisting of a few grains of better powder under the Elephant sounds like a good idea. If you have a dry sunny day with low humidity, putting the container out with the lid off to evaporate moisture sounds like a good idea, too. In early times, military installations stored bulk powder in "magazines," or secure, designated storerooms. Over time, the powder could and did absorb some atmospheric moisture. Personnel were detailed periodically to take the powder out for "sunning," spreading it out in the sunshine to dry.

I would be reluctant to enlarge the flash hole in the nipple. You don't want it so big that powder will get up into the nipple... You would get a "fuse effect" and more or less of a hangfire, and likely hammer blowback. Squint ( @Howard Pippin ) provided some good flash hole dimensional parameters if you want to try it.

I wouldn't throw that Elephant powder away, though. It has its faults, but plenty of people have made it work.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[Rock Home Isle]

I bought a nice hefty supply of Elephant powder, spread over a couple orders, back in the late 90’s or early or 00’s…

I loved Elephant Brand. I never had issues with the powder, solid ignition and very reliable groups from all my guns. I never noticed undue fouling…even out of my .32 calibre. I shot Elephant right alongside GOEX. I started stocking up on GOEX in the mid 80’s and mid 90’s…

By the time my supply dwindled to the point that I needed to buy more…Elephant was no more, no big, I had plenty of GOEX.

So…based on what I’m reading in this thread, Elephant Brand Powder was great for at least 1 year…

 

[BP Addict]

I've had really good luck with Spitfire nipples. I'd try that. I would not enlarge the hole in the nipple. They're the size they are for a reason.

Powder is hard to come by. I say shoot what you've got.

Walt

 

[nhmoose]

When I started shooting Meteor was the powder available. I lived in MA and could find NONE in state. I could buy it in NH where my sister lived, and Wife and I had a summer camp. I bought 5 pounds of 3fg. It worked for the summer, so I bought another 5 from the same dealer. (first purchase he did not want to sell me any until I showed him my property tax receipt. He wanted an electric bill or phone bill but it was a camp with neither.)

I had to keep it at the summer camp as I could not get a permit to store it in my own state. Even as a FF/INV I could not get a needed fire permit to store BP. I could get a purchase permit but none for storage. The powder had to be expended the day it was bought.

No wonder when my wife could not , in the 1980's get a pistol permit for CCW I had her carry anyway. 6-7 months after an arson attempt on our house we left MA to NH. She had a ccw license in 2 weeks.,

Got very interested in BP competition as one of my nephews was into it and worked in the trade. Used BP for competition and hunting since. In the last 35+ years I have only taken 1 deer with a modern firearm. The rest have been with a flintlock. I feel like I am cheating when I use my 1st Allen conversion 50-70 to deer hunt.

Sorry for the wandering going off topic post.

 

[necchi]

So when cleaning out the drum and nipple there was some fouling chunks and almost a wall of thin powder where hole goes into the breech. ,,,,,,,,,,,
So the question is, is there a solution to this issue of "fouling".

Yes. It's NOT the powder. It's the barrel/breech system, with issues of previous care,
,,and it's common.
pm if interested in stepping outside the rules of common practice and finding the fix.

 

[necchi]

Yes. It's NOT the powder. It's the barrel/breech system, with concerning previous care,
,,and it's common.
pm if interested in stepping outside the rules of common practice and finding the fix.

 

[toot]

Yep...Swiss is 1st...then Schuetzen & as a last resort shoot GoeX.
In that order......especially when its time to clean the gun.

ROGER THAT! GOOD ADVISE. but at times some of the brands aren't available.

 

[flconch53]

Sold some elephant powder when I had my shop. It was dirtier but went off fine. I still have a can of 5f elephant priming powder it is good for using in a nipple primer to get a reluctant charge out of the barrel

 

[Snydly]

Waaaay back in the day Elephant brand was the only stuff we could buy for about 4 months. I was in need of some powder for a shoot coming up. Bought 2lbs of FFFG and 2 of FFg. Slightly dirtier but no big deal. I still had to clean my rifles no matter what powder I shot. Only slightly less powerful according to my test shots through my chrono. I would still shoot it if that is all I could get. anything is better than fake powder.

 

[DuncNZ]

Back in the 80's here in New Zealand we got some SNPE powder from France ( part of Vetcan powder) , it was a multi grade powder which went from dust to lumps like ¼ of a match stick , funny thing it worked well and was as clean as any ,although it had a bad habit of settling into different grades in the can, so a group of us got some sieves and broke it down into priming powder , fffg ffg fg and lumps , it all worked just fine , the lumps were used in 12 ga shotguns .

 

[toot]

Waaaay back in the day Elephant brand was the only stuff we could buy for about 4 months. I was in need of some powder for a shoot coming up. Bought 2lbs of FFFG and 2 of FFg. Slightly dirtier but no big deal. I still had to clean my rifles no matter what powder I shot. Only slightly less powerful according to my test shots through my chrono. I would still shoot it if that is all I could get. anything is better than fake powder.

ROGER THAT! so true!

 

[rp77469]

Since we are widening the discussion to other brands... I still have an unopened pound of Golden around here someplace. When Gander Mountain shut down, the store in SW Houston had Triple 7, Golden, and a couple other substitutes for $7-8 each on close out. Gave the T7 to a friend who uses the substitutes, kept the Golden and one other substitute for my own curiosity. Packed it away and forgot about it until this thread. Wonder where I put it?

 

[Rifleman1776]

"Slightly dirtier" is what toot said about Elephant powder.
I disagree strongly. It was much-much dirtier than the popular brands of bp. I dumped a couple pounds into my wifes garden to dispose. But, I still have two pounds on the shelf. They will stay there until the bitter end if all other sources dry up.

 

[toot]

Since we are widening the discussion to other brands... I still have an unopened pound of Golden around here someplace. When Gander Mountain shut down, the store in SW Houston had Triple 7, Golden, and a couple other substitutes for $7-8 each on close out. Gave the T7 to a friend who uses the substitutes, kept the Golden and one other substitute for my own curiosity. Packed it away and forgot about it until this thread. Wonder where I put it?

I have some of it. and GOLDEN is GOLDEN!!