English Fowler

[mastrsgt]

This gun has been on TOTW site for some time now. What do those of you familiar with fowlers think of it? Is is worth the price? is the architecture what it should be? Would it be a good investment?
[url] http://trackofthewolf.com/(S(...CATID=12&SUBID=81&STYLEID=284&PARTNUM=AAC-178[/url]

I don't know if I will go for it, but it certainly does appeal to me.

Don R

 

[ronrryan]

Can the trigger be re-pinned? I would be cautious about a gun which will fire from the half cock position. Good smoke, Ron in Venice

 

[mastrsgt]

Ronrryan,

I have been wondering about that as well. I'm hoping some of the experts on the forum will let me know if that's a major problem, or something that can be fixed.

Don R

 

[Okwaho]

I too wonder about the idea of carrying a gun which will fire from half cock.That's downright scary. I think also that an English fowler would be more authentically stocked in English walnut rather than American black walnut.The side plate may be correct{I didn't check thoroughly}but I don't care for it on an English gun and the guard definitely puts it in the last half of the 18th century. These are just musings but he asked.
Tom Patton

 

[Mike Brooks]

A good english fowler at a give away price. Good english archetecture.
I can pick nits if you would like..... :winking:

 

[rabjr]

Please do Mike.

 

[guncobbler]

"Can the trigger be repinned?"

Can you tell me how you figured out if this gun will fire from half cock and what the pinning has to do with it? I must be missing something in the pictures or description. Thanks, GC

 

[rabjr]

Track says this about it,

Ignition for the fowler is provided by this L&R Queen Anne style flint lock. Finished dark to match the barrel, the lock is well made, the frizzen face is still clean and smooth having not yet been fired. Properly tuned and assembled the lock functions very well. We did note on inspection that the trigger is pinned a touch too high and provides enough leverage to fire the lock from the half-cock position.

 

[Eric Krewson]

I have a Customsky trade gun that wil fire at half cock, more trigger pressure than full cock. Never been a problem.

 

[Shelby Skinner]

Walnut was a very common wood on all early guns. Though Walnut is one of the few woods where an expert can often discern its point of origin--(Europe, America etc) Many many fowlers were no doubt either shipped as parts or re-stocked here using the wonderful wood of the black walnut tree... Grinsdale's book shows more than a few New England fowlers stocked in Walnut.

RE: the trigger--Sometimes you can work over the half cock notch on the tumbler to make it more secure. Sometimes you might have to alter or replace the sear or the tumbler. The way the trigger is pinned is important mainly because the location will determine how much leverage the trigger[url] has...in[/url] short the trigger is a lever and the pin point is the fulcrum. Move the fulcrum one way or the other and you change the leverage (pull). Its most probably fixable...how much it costs depends of how much work/parts it takes.

 

[tg]

Probably not a bad price for what you get, I don't know what time period they place it at, with the Queen Ann lock and what looks to be a browned barrel? the only thing I see is that it looks like the forestock is rather high on the barrel to my liking I like to take the wood closer to the center line of the barrel but this may be the pic and not the real story on this gun, spend 700 on paarts and pay a smith for 50-70 hrs of work depending on how the parts set came and the math says it's not a bad deal.

 

[Doc Rogers]

What about the trigger guard "definitely puts it in the last half of the 18th century?"

I am still learning but I thought a guard like this would be good for the 1730 to 1750 timeframe? But, like I said, I am still learning?

Doc

 

[Roy]

Track says this about it,

Ignition for the fowler is provided by this L&R Queen Anne style flint lock. Finished dark to match the barrel, the lock is well made, the frizzen face is still clean and smooth having not yet been fired. Properly tuned and assembled the lock functions very well. We did note on inspection that the trigger is pinned a touch too high and provides enough leverage to fire the lock from the half-cock position.

That could be fixed without re-pinning anything.

 

[Mike Brooks]

Please do Mike.

OK.....
I see mostly positive things about this gun. The "nits" are just a few of my pet peeves more than anything else.
Over all it's a well exicuted english fowler.The inletting is fabulous. There are several items that place this gun in the 1780's. The first is the side plate, it's "horns" surrounding the rear lock screw is a post 1780 feature. The acorn finiall trigger guard is a post 1765 feature. The french round pillar at the front of the trigger is and even later feature, most common in the 1780's. The checkering is extreamly well done, the wide pattern was popular through the 1770's and 1780's. You do sometimes find earlier guns with this type of checkering pattern, but it was added later to keep the gun current with the new styles. The american black walnut doesn't bother me in the least. In most cases, when I build a gun in either american black walnut or english walnut, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference unless I told you which it was stocked in. Both can be about the same in appearance, generally the english is harder and works better. It's hard to tell, but it looks like the buttplate and trigger guard bow have some nice period engraving on them.
Now for the "nits". The barrel could stand out of the wood a bit more. This would give the forestock a slimmer appearance. I've never seen an original english fowler with front lock mouldings. The carving at the tang could be far more english in style too.That's about it for the negatives.
Now, "pet peeves". :winking: The shoulder on this buttplate where it begins to return on the top of the butt stock is about 3X as long as the originals were . I hate this butt plate for that reason. I used to use it alot, but 95% of the time I would modify it to appear more as the originals were.. The Queen anne lock is a bit early for all the other later features this gun exibits. The Durrs Egg lock may have been a better choice. I really can't beat it up more that that, it's a good gun.
I like this gun. :thumbsup: It's well made, and far more historically accute than many guns I see for sale. And, it's hard to beat that price for a high quality gun such as this one is.

 

[rich pierce]

Mighty fine gun. I know it's not fashionable to spend that kind of money on somehting that needs tuning, but that is a mighty nice looking gun.

 

[Stophel]

I find it a surprisingly attractive gun! I doubt seriously that the half-cock problem is caused by the trigger being too high! The half cock notch probably needs to be deepened and worked on a bit. L&R Locks can have pretty shallow tumbler notches anyway. Of course, many locks will fire from half cock if sufficient pressure is applied. It is not meant to be an absolute safety.

 

[rabjr]

Thanks Mike for learnin me somethin. :hatsoff:

 

[BRUN]

I have a Customsky trade gun that wil fire at half cock, more trigger pressure than full cock. Never been a problem.

Never been a problem :hmm: Seems kinda unsafe,well for me atleast. :v

 

[Okwaho]

I actually agree with Mike and Chris on this gun. I wasn't sure about the sideplate and would still worry about the half cock firing especially were I to use it in reenacting. As to the walnut,I just like to see English walnut used on "English" guns and they did say an "English fowler". Unless the gun has a very dark finish it's not too hard to spot English walnut which is a favorite of mine.I doubt very many high grade English fowlers were built in America from parts shipped over.As to Grinslade's book,Tom refers to "British-style Fowlers"which were built emulating fine English fowlers for which English enjoyed an almost total monopoly until after the Revolution.There were a few Kentucky style fowlers before 1775 but they were't at all common.The earliest documented evidence of fowlers being made in Pennsylvania is in an advertisement of Thomas Palmer which appeared in the March 7,1773 edition of the "Pennsylvania Gazette"., Henry J. Kaufman,"The Pennsylvania Kentucky Rifle", PP.102-103, @102
Tom Patton

 

[robinghewitt]

I like this gun. :thumbsup: It's well made, and far more historically accute than many guns I see for sale. And, it's hard to beat that price for a high quality gun such as this one is.

Hi Mike

I can't argue :hatsoff:

I've never seen an original full stock English fowler so I really don't know what they look like :thumbsup:

best regards

Squire Robin