Escutcheon plates

[Dalekg6]

Hi,

I just got my Armstrong kit from Pecatonica River yesterday. I have a couple of the how to books and a general pretty good idea how everything goes together. However the Escutcheon plates are a big question mark. I know on some, especially Hawken style rifles they are screwed on. Is that the same for an Armstrong?

Are the pin holes drilled first then the plates drilled and put on top or are the plates installed on the stock then holes drilled through plates and stock all at once?

Thanks,
Dale

 

[paulvallandigham]

Drill the pin holes first in the wood. Then install the escutcheon plates, one at a time, and use the hole in the wood to guide your drill as you drill the plates, one plate at a time. Don't try to drill both the plates and the wood all at once unless you have a very good drill press and jig set up to do this. All the escutcheon plates I have seen are screwed in place with very small screws. Some are then filed flush to remove the screw slots, but most have visible screw slots remaining.

 

[Mike Yianopoulos]

I'm pretty new to this hobby as well so correct me if I'm wrong and maybe either method is accepted. I am just putting the finishing touches on my J. Armstrong long rifle. The info I got was use small silver nails (if your plate is silver) to secure the escutcheon plate after inletting. I got mine from Muzzleloaders Builders Supply. Drill holes for the nails and slightly countersink. Tack in place and file nail heads flush.

 

[Slash]

We use the silver nails, too. They are really hard to see after installation.
Slash

 

[paulvallandigham]

Nails were used, particularly in the early period when screws were made by hand. By the time of the late Hawken building, of the 1840s, screws were more commonly used, because they were among the first items that were mass produced by machines.

Use whatever is appropriate to the period your rifle represents. Be sure to drill holes where you want those nails to go, a bit undersized, so you don't split out the thin wood along the barrel in the process of nailing. Those " silver " nails mentioned were square or rectangular in profile, and not round, as you find nails today. Keep that in mind. Builders used Brass " nails" -- usually hand cut from sheet brass with either a chisel or shears-- for brass escutcheon plates, and silver nails for silver ones. They hammered them close with lots of little taps, and then filed the head flush with the plate.

You might want to countersink the pre-drilled holes in the plate--- round or square or rectangular-- by beveling the edges with a file( jeweler's files work great) or with a sharp chisel or knife on the soft metal, before hammering in the nails.

This kind of craftsmanship was seen on the " Golden Age " guns, but rarely on working firearms. This is your gun, however, and make it as nice as your talent can allow.

 

[Harddog]

Hey guys,

Most inlays and escutcheons on the early period rifles were nailed on with iron nails. Iron nails were used for silver and brass inlays. The idea of using silver nails for silver and brass nails for brass is much a modern thing although it was sometimes employed on high art French, English and other foreign guns.

For American made guns - iron nails.

Randy Hedden

 

[rabbit03]

Hola Amigo how is it going up north?

I was reading your post on the escutchen plate thing and noticed you said drill the wood first and use it for a guide???

Drill the pin holes first in the wood. Then install the escutcheon plates, one at a time, and use the hole in the wood to guide your drill as you drill the plates, one plate at a time.

And I am not trying to be critical but shouldn't it be the other way around? Drill the metal first and use those holes as a guide to drill the wood? :hmm:

rabbit03

 

[paulvallandigham]

obviously it can be done either way. The brass escutcheons I have used, and held were so thin, that they could be easily damaged if I tried to use them as a drill guide. That is why I drill the wood first, and then the plates. I worry even more about using silver escutcheons, because they are even more soft than brass. Now, when using steel escutcheons, I do drill the steel first, and then use them as drill guides for the holes through the stock.

Before any drilling is done, the inletting of the escutcheon plates has to be completed. I drill the holes, then leave everything off the stock until I complete staining and finishing the stock. Then the plates go on, and the pins, or wedges are inserted with the barrel in place. I keep the drill bit handy so I can use it by hand to clean off any burrs or splinters, or dried globs of stock finish that are in the holes in the wood.

 

[rabbit03]

Gotcha! I was just wondering how you would drill through them using the wood as a guide but I guess you could go from the othe side all the way through.

I think I was thinking about the heavy steel type on my Hawken.

:hatsoff:

rabbit03

 

[shootrj2003]

Imade mine pf silverand drilled them as a group wired together then made the wedge hole after that i shaped them i am atill debating nails or screws buut thinking silver or iron nails oh and epoxy to bed and keep them still I know, not hC but they will stay long enough to become HC!

 

[user 34300]

John Armstrong used wedges on the the rifles I have pictures of. He used nails, no screws. Today you can rough up he back of the escutcheon and use epoxy.

Order of operations. Inlet the barrel. Mark for the wedge positions on the outside of the stock based on the barrel lugs. Drill straight across with a drill press or mill and stop when to touch metal. Make three side by side drilled holes. Take the barrel out, finish the holes out the other side. Do not drill the barrel lugs and wood a the same time. Go easy as to not blow out he wood on the other side. Make your rectangular wedge hole in the lug favoring the barrel side to make it tighter. Remove the wood to allow the passage of the lug, but center on the holes. Once the wedge passes through the wood try the barrel, file the lug for a snug barrel fit. Finally, use the wedge to guide inletting the wedge escutcheons.

John Armstrong did not always use escutcheons. See the attached photo of an earlier rifle. The lock looks more like a Siler too.

Or use pins, much easier! Still do not drill the barrel lug and wood a the same time. IT will wallow out the wood if you do.

Jim Kibler is now including a brass tube device to center a smaller drill bit in the stock for drilling the lugs. The system works great because it will not wallow out the stock wood.

 

[Vaino]

After the escutcheon is inletted, the holes are drilled using the holes in the escutcheon to guide the drill. The drilled holes in the escutcheons have a ctsk or if a rounded head "nail" is used, the ctsk is omitted.

 

[user 34300]

CTSK????

The "nails" are hand made and wedge shaped. There is no bulbous head.

 

[Grenadier1758]

CTSK = countersink

 

[Col. Batguano]

Unlike nails in inlays, the fasteners in estrucheons are functional rather than merely decorative.

A good alternative to trying to make your own silver nails is to use sterling silver earring studs from jewelry supply houses like Rio Grande Jewelry Supply. Use a pin vice and small bit to drill your holes. Drill the estrucheon first, and then go through in to the barrel channel. Take your time in locating those holes because those estrucheon plates are pretty small. If you're off center even just a little bit it's going to really show. It won't affect their function, but it will be one of those things that really bugs you--forever.

Once they're through there you're going to bend them over (to provide actual holding power), so a small trough for them to lay in is a good idea. You don't need a lot of length laying in there (1/8"- 3/16" should be fine) so you can cut them pretty short. Then you can super glue them in place, and take your file to flush up everything in the barrel channel. One other thing that's a good idea is to scuff up the shafts with rough sand paper so as to increase their holding power.

An alternative of course is to make yourself a sterling silver rivet like you used for your muzzle cap. I wanted the decorative effect of the round heads showing last time so opted for the earring studs. I tried and tried to make nail heads and rivets like they showed how to do in the books, and every attempt resulted in copious usage of words normally only heard on the golf course.