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Explain the differences in lead shot

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colt100

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I have a Pedersoli 12 gs SxS BP shotgun and was wondering about the different types of lead shot out there.

Basically, I want to know about the differences between chilled, magnum, field grade, plated (I know that they are plated with different materials, just the differences between copper, nickle ect.) or any other shot I didn't think of.

I just want to make sure I shoot the correct shot out of it. Thanks
 
Those terms all have to do with the hardness of the shot.

If I remember correctly, in order from softest to hardest:

Field, Chilled, Magnum, Copper then Nickel is the hardest. The harder the shot, the better it stays round during firing and produces tighter patterns and better penetration.
 
colt100 said:
I have a Pedersoli 12 gs SxS BP shotgun and was wondering about the different types of lead shot out there.

Basically, I want to know about the differences between chilled, magnum, field grade, plated (I know that they are plated with different materials, just the differences between copper, nickle ect.) or any other shot I didn't think of.

I just want to make sure I shoot the correct shot out of it. Thanks

Lead shot is basically made in two forms:
Pure, soft lead....and lead with 5% antimony added to make it harder for less deformation, thus truer flight and better patterns.

Field grade is normally used to refer to pure, soft lead shot;

Chilled shot, hard shot, magnum shot are all names used interchangeably when referring to shot which contains antimony.

Plated shot is primarily plated to provide even more protection to the lead from deformation than if it was simply 'hard' shot.

All of them shoot out of shotguns with equal safety.

There is one however that does require a special shot cup and that's solid steel shot.
 
So I could use copper or nickle plated lead shot without damaging the bore of my Pedersoli? I don't use any sort of shot cups and use bismuth for non toxic applications.

Thanks
 
Yes, both copper and nickel plated are safe in your muzzleloader. I wish I was rich enough to afford bismuth! I really want to use my trade gun on ducks this year but I can't bring myself to pay for bismuth and I don't want to ruin the barrel with steel.
 
Yea, I hear ya on the bismuth cost. I figure that it cost just over 1/shot for the bismuth.

I normally pay about 15 to 20 dollars a box for 3 1/2 inch steel. I don;t hit awhole lot some days and have gone through several boxes in a hunt to bag 2 or 3 birds :redface: . I don;t sky bust either.

I figure that when I normally go out, I only fire a few rounds. Figuring that I'll most likely shoot less with my muzzleloader, and may take more time knowing I can't reload as fast or easily, I won't waste as much ammunition.

I bought a bottle last year but only took my muzzleloader out for the last few days. Never fired a shot at a duck. This year it's coming with me opening day so it will get some trigger time.

My muzzle loader is also coming out to S. Dakota for Phesants this year and non-toxic shot is required out there where we hunt. So it's bismuth or bust as far as the muzzle loader goes.

If I was worried much about the cost of hunting, I would just buy beef, chicken, ect. It would be cheaper, espically with the gas prices.

Just think, two tanks of gas would pay for 85 shots of bismuth (which is about how many you get in a 7# jug).
 
So Roundball, where did you get the information of chilled and magnum shot containing the same amount of antimony? I was under the impression that magnum contained more than chilled and chilled had only 2 or 3%. I'm not trying to dispute your figures, just verify them. :thumbsup:
 
This is from the Ballistics Products website:


Lead pellets are classified by their alloy content. Antimony is a brittle flaky, crystalline metal. It looks like a raw coal with a bluish whitish metallic hue. Antimony is toxic. Lead, when alloyed with antimony, becomes a better pellet. Modern drop shot is alloyed about .5% antimony. With antimony, hardness is relative to the percentage of antimony added, and antimony improves surface tension, creating a rounder pellet.

Chilled shot is about 98 percent lead and has an antimony content from about .5% to around 2%. Magnum shot has between 3% and 6% antimony added depending on size. Smaller pellets have higher percentages while larger sizes have smaller percentages. It’s hard to nail the exact antimony content, as manufactures purchase their ingots in pre-alloyed lots. Secondly, when rejected pellets are remelted the antimony content is altered. So, in order to have an exact reading, we would have to exclude all the rejects. To keep prices reasonable there’s a bit of “guesstimation” based on pellet hardness.

As you can see, chilled lead is generally softer and more susceptible to deformation. For this reason, we limit our use of chilled shot to spreader loads and close-range sporting shots when “flier” pellets can actually work to the shooters advantage. For hunting, always use magnum or plated shot.
 
Slamfire said:
"...where did you get the information of chilled and magnum shot containing the same amount of antimony?..."
Simply the understanding I had gathered over the years in conversations with people...never heard any anyone make a distinction between chilled vs magnum...the references always seemed to be used in the context of distinguishing between shot with antimony, and shot without...
 
The ballistics Product site probably has the most detail information on lead content.

As to plated shot, copper plated shot is usually only a wash, or very thin layer, and while it does harden the surface, the soft core of the pellet still allows the pellet to expand and deliver shock energy when it hits a bird. The copper lets the pellet get through feathers, and the thin skin before the pellet upsets. Winchester has been selling Lubaloy, copper plated shot since about 1930, and it has an admirable track record for bringing down ducks and geese.

Nickel plated shot is the hardest shot, partly because the plating is thicker, and therefore represents a greater percentage of the pellet.

Next up in hardness are the non-toxic shot pellets, which DO NOT contain lead. Bismuth has been mentioned, but we have " steel" shot, shot made of iron, or zinc, combined with other compounds, etc. These can only be used in barrels made from steels designed to shoot hard shot like steel. Do NOT use them in Black Powder guns, unless the manufacturer specifically authorizes their use.
 
Those antimony numbers are very close to the ones I got on the west coast, don't recall the brand name, Lewis maybe. Chilled 2% max, Magnum 3% min.
 
not surprised at the similar numbers. While lead is an important metal, there is just not enough of a market for the different alloys to come up with a greater variety of numbers. As the military has gotten more and more away from using lead in projectiles, the companies have had to turn to civilian markets, and overseas. Right now, I understand that China is buying as much lead, copper, and otther metals as it can, while it has its currency rate of exchange fixed artifically low against the dollar.
 
Hi, Paul (and everyone).

Shot types, differences, performance, and cost effectiveness get discussed on some of the modern shotgun boards occasionally. What I've gathered from eavesdropping on a few of these is that there is a LOT of variability in plated shot nowadays. It was alleged by some who take this very seriously that no-one in North America was making a decent nickle-plated shot, that the only good shot with hard lead and thick, even electroplating was imported from Italy. This was a few years ago, so maybe this has changed, but at the time, I managed to piece together that one prominent supplier's nickle-plated shot had a rather thin plating over 2%-Sb-alloyed lead (don't have the details at hand, and I won't say who in public). The situation for Cu-plated shot was reported to be better - there were supposed to be at least a few manufacturers making good well-plated hard-lead shot.

The consensus was that a good high-(enough)-alloy "magnum" shot would outperform lower-quality plated shot, and that there were more suppliers of good magnum shot out there. A corrolary of this consensus was that it is not worth the extra cost to get plated shot unless you can get the specifications, OR unless it has a good reputation among knowledgable shooters. This caveat applies to the "magnum" shot, too, since some is more advertising than alloy, or has poor consistency, but apparently, most makers turn out a decent product.

Some folks may not realize that all you need to comparare the hardness of different shot is a pair of pliers and a caliper or micromerer, if you can get some of the same size in each shot type. Take one pellet of each of two types and set them against each other in the jaws of the pliers, so that when you squeeze the handles, the shot squash each other. Then measure the thickness of each pellet - the softer (lower alloy) pellet will have been crushed more. Just check the shot diameters before-hand to make sure they are actually the same size, or the test isn't valid.

Hope this helps,
Joel
 
Joel: The real problem with people wanting to use plated shot is that they think they can fool mother nature, and get a smaller, denser pattern, at longer ranges. They can't. The reason Magnum( High Antimony) shot works so well is that the people who use it don't try to shoot it at high velocities, as they know the kick in the pants on firing is what misshapes the shot, while the plastic shot cup and collar does a pretty good job of protecting the shot from rubbing against the walls of the barrel as the shot travels on out the muzzle.

Because of the aero-dynamics of a round ball, if you want to keep a bunch of round pellets to stay closer together over a longer period of time, and hence distance, you REDUCE the velocities of the shot, and use a slower burning powder so the shot is not misshappen on ignition. With BP, you use 2Fg, or even 1Fg to accomplish this, rather than the ever popular 3Fg used in rifles. Most BP shooters understand that 3fg powder burns faster, and gives higher pressures, all other things being equal, than 2 Fg.

I am still trying to find the source of this again, but years ago, I read an inciteful article about shot pellets and patterns, where the author compared shot in the air to round balloons. He said the reader should blow up three round balloons to the approx. same diameter. In the house, so he doesn't have to put up with wind as a factor, take one balloon at a time and try to throw it as hard and fast as he can. Mark the spot on the floor where the balloon lands. Then reduce the force needed to push the balloon until you find the amount o pushing needed to make it hit the furthest away on the floor. Its usually only half to 2/3 of the speed of that " fast pitch ".

He didn't stop there. He then wrote to take 3 balloons in one hand and throw them the same amount that sent the single balloon the furthest. Mark where each of the balloons landed. Then reduce the amount of thrust until you find the speed that allows the balloons to land the closest together. This speed will be less than the speed needed to send a single balloon the furthest.

His point to this exercise is to teach shooters how air affects shot, in both slowing it down, and dispersing it, into a wider " pattern ". Those are the unchangeable Laws of Nature with which you can not fool. It does not matter if you throw balloons, or plated shot, or lead shot.

Harder shot will allow the shot to maintain its original shape better than soft shot. That is why antimony is added to the lead. Plating shot, with copper, or nickel, will help make the pellets smoother,( less wind resistance) and will give them surface strength to DELAY, but not prevent, pellet deformation when it hits a target. That is why Winchester plated shot with copper so many years ago, and developed a following of shooters who preferred to use copper plated shot in the fields. Nickel-plated shot has gotten a fad quality to it because Europeans were using the stuff in the new Intenational Trap, and Skeet competitions, that now are the Olympic style events, too. The purpose of nickel plating is not to give you tighter groups, but simply to reduce pellet deformation on ignition. However, if you up the velocity of the shell, you quickly negate any benefit of the nickel plating on shot patterns, because the AIR pushes the pellets away from each othr FASTER( Whatever goes fast, slows down fast.) The current Olympic Trap load is 3 1/4 drams equivalent of smokeless powder under 24 grams( about 4 pellets shy of 7/8 oz.) of shot, usually #7, 7 1/2, or #8. #7 shot seems to be the most popular, and actually has caused some manufacturers to beginning making this sized shot again, here in the states. Its still hard to find, and expensive.

I know of one man who has a barrel with a long choke to it, that has shot 98% patterns with the Olympic loads at 40 yds. The lighter quantity of shot( 24 grams) allows a higher velocity, while not distorting the shape of the shot at ignition. The shot gets to the target faster, before it has time to dispurse in the air. At bunker trap( Olympic style trap shooting) you stand at about 17 yds, and the shot gets to the clay target so fast, you don't want to lead the clay target very much at all. Its easier to miss if you shoot in front of one of these targets than to miss it shooting right at it. The targets are being broken at about 30 yds, and not the 40-45 yards seen in American style trap. So, those performances can mislead people to think that nickel plated shot will allow them to hold tight patterns at 50, 60, and more yards, to kill geese, ducks, and other birds. It doesn't. That 98% pattern my friend gets at 40 yds, is breaking up nicely, just like his standard American trap loads by the time it gets to 50 yds, and at 60 yds, he can't tell the difference between the two loads.

I hope this additional information helps everyone understand how to go about getting tighter patterns. Plated shot can help. But, reduce the velocity to maintain the dense shot patterns. At the ranges we hunt with shotguns, the increase in number of pellets on target will give you the edge to make a clean kill.
 
Yup - no argument on the deleterious effects of excess in either velocity or acceleration, from the shot deformation due to setback, and from the higher drag at higher velocity. There is a another but related factor favoring lower muzzle velocity.

It has often been noted that patterns tend to open up more quickly when the muzzle velocity exceeds the speed of sound, in part because of the trans-sonic turbulence early in the trajectory, especially when you shoot a cylinder bore and give up the partial control you get from a choke. Both smoothbore and rifle shooters have observed the same thing (even with modern bullets) - for the best accuracy you should either start subsonic (e.g. .22RF match ammo) or start fast enough that it's still supersonic at the target, but that's hard to do with shotgun pellets in muzzle loaders. The dynamics of a choke seem to do better with somewhat more velocity, but there's still a trade-off involved.

There is one area of terminal ballistics for good plated shot that most people agree on. Because of the smoother, harder surface, there tends to be less "balling" of feathers around the shot, so they tend to penetrate better than plain shot, on average, at a given velocity.

Regards,
Joel
 
Very good posts on this subject!
very refreshing to see folk Not reccomending great big powder charges!
I sort of grew up under the tutelage of the late great GT Garwood, a very wise chap when it comes to shotguns & cartridges, Some may remember him as 'Gough Thomas' from 'the shooting times"
GT would have been very happy with the common sense and wisdom offered in the above posts!

Pukka.
 
It's been a while, but there was a careful metalugical and patterning analysis of various premium types of shot in Shooting Sportsman. In that study Magnum Shot, such as Lawrence did the best of all lead base shot on maintaining tight patterns. The revelation was that most plated shot is washed not plated, and that the premium nickel plated shot from Italy turned out to be nickel plated chilled shot, and it deformed and patterned less well than the Mangum. It also tested softer.

My own more limited patterning was consistent with there results. (They have all killed birds though.)
 
Although I never tested it to see, I always wondered if the plating actually increased the resistance to deformation. :hmm:
 
If you look at the Periodic Table of the Elements( Oh, God! Does he mean that there is actually a use for that darn thing we had in high school science classes?) Nickel(Atomic number 28) is softer than Copper(29), which is softer than zinc(30), then tin(50), Antimony51), Lead(82),and finally Bismuth(83). It should come as no surprise that nickel plating is softer than copper plating on shot. It is when elements are joined in an alloy that they tend to make a much stronger product than the sum of the parts would indicate. Antimony, although softer than lead, makes lead harder, and that is why it is used for that purpose.

Stick with Magnum shot, or go to the non-toxic shot options of you are looking for a harder pellet. Make sure the gun you are shooting this in is designed of an alloy tough enough to take these harder kinds of shot.
 
Copper is softer than lead? :shocked2: My tumb nail has been lyin' to me for goin' on 50 years. :shake:
 
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