"Fake" Douglas XX Barrel

[jonboyb]

I'm desperately wanting to replace the barrel on one of my flintlocks and have found a matching Douglas but it has 2 random spaced, individual X's instead of the circled XX. Seen gobs of XX Douglas barrels but NEVER seen or found another with the 2 random placed X's. Anyone ever seen such as this on a real one or did someone have the bright idea to "make" theirs a "XX" barrel :haha:

Thanks.

 

[jonboyb]

Also, no "XX" on the muzzle end with the caliber and twist, most I've seen also had it marked on the muzzle.

Honestly being a standard Douglas or "XX" Douglas makes no difference to me....but want to make sure the oddball X's don't mean something else...like cull barrel for instance....LOL.

 

[larry wv]

I know nothing about Douglas barrels. Hope some one can help you. Good luck. Larry

 

[bpd303]

I would give them a call to be sure. http://www.douglasbarrels.net/ourbarrels/

 

[galamb]

The XX barrels were their premium barrel having less or no run-out as compared with the standard offering.

Perhaps someone is trying to squeeze a premium price for a standard barrel by striking a couple x's on it.

Their regular barrels were still of decent quality - kinda the Green Mountain of their day - you simply had to be careful to orient any run out at the breech end "down" so it wouldn't shoot left or right (also common with Large barrels).

 

[jonboyb]

Talked to them a few years ago and was told the old blackpowder employees were long gone. Almost certain way more knowledge of their BP barrels here than within their entire company now

I already have a couple of their barrels but this one in particular is the right size for a gun I want to rebarrel. I'm fine even if it's a fake "XX".....just want to make sure it was NOT a flaw barrel meant for the scrap pile

 

[jonboyb]

On the topic of runout, I know Douglas stamped their barrels on max runout side so they could be indexed as the top or bottom flat, but does anyone know if Bill Large did that as well? I'm doing a Bill Large build right now (or commissioning a build I should say....my skills are far lacking to chance on of his barrels) and the barrel already has sight dovetails installed but orients the W.M Large on the visable angled flat like a current production muzzleloader. And I know the history of this Large barrel back a good 25+ years.....Mr. Large himself installed the dovetails..

 

[user 2647]

I have one of Bill's barrels in a hawken I built. I checked the runout and with .001 runout the Large stamp was on the left side top angled flat. Not sure about others but that was where mine indexed at.

As for the Douglas I have only seen the XX mark together.

 

[jonboyb]

Thank you sir....EXACTLY how my Large is indexed. Max runout of .001 ain't too shabby. Is it one of the "JJJJ" barrels or standard out of curiousity?

And regarding the 2 X's on the Douglas barrel in question, it seems if someone was trying to make a fake, the X's would have at least been close together and aligned. These are caddy-wompus and probably 1/2" offset from each other. The "GR DOUGLAS" and ".45 CALIBER" are legit.

 

[user 2647]

It's JJJJ with an L under them, I'm not sure but I believe the L stands for a lapped bore.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Too far back in my memory bank to recall circled/not circled is correct or otherwise. Where on the barrel are they stamped?
IMHO, a Douglas barrel would not be faked. They were mass produced and not considered a treasure like a Large or Pope. They were great barrels but not considered premiums. It would be like faking a TC 'hawken' rifle. Pointless.

 

[faste350]

my barrel has xx in a circle. nothing at the muzzle.

 

[Wayne R Scott]

For what it is worth, I have two Douglas barrels that are stamped GR Douglas with XX in an oval. They are not stamped at muzzle.

Wayne

 

[Rifleman1776]

Those "at the muzzle" thing puzzles me.
I'm not a builder, but long ago was taught that all new barrels (might be exceptionf or custom stuff) should be cut back a little because they might not be perfect and need to be trued. That would delete any markings in most cases.

 

[Mike Payne]

I have an old Douglas barrel I got around 78or79 that is marked Douglas GAA.

 

[plmeek]

I have a .54 caliber Douglas barrel that is 1-1/8" x 36" straight octagon. It is stamped "G R DOUGLAS" and "54 CAL" on a flat near the breech end. The muzzle is stamped with the a "54", an "XX" (no circle), and either a "36" or "66". The latter either refers to the length or the twist, depending on what the first digit is. The X's are close together, but not perfectly aligned, indicating they were individually stamped.

The muzzle has a shallow recess for protection and the rifling is slightly tapered for about 3/8" instead of the more common radius crown.

I haven't mic'd for run out, but visually, I don't see any. The shoulder at the bottom of the thread section in the breech is a uniform thickness, so when it was milled and threaded, it was perfectly aligned with the bore.

This is the only Douglas premium barrel I have, so I don't know if the markings are typical or atypical. Hope the description is of some help when comparing to your barrel.

 

[Birddog6]

The XX barrels were their premium barrel having less or no run-out as compared with the standard offering.

Perhaps someone is trying to squeeze a premium price for a standard barrel by striking a couple x's on it.

Their regular barrels were still of decent quality - kinda the Green Mountain of their day - you simply had to be careful to orient any run out at the breech end "down" so it wouldn't shoot left or right (also common with Large barrels).

That would be my guess. Someone is trying to make the barrel a Premium grade.

ALL of the Douglas untouched barrels I have owned (and had over 30 of them) had the cal & ROT on the end of the muzzle. If they don't have it, they have already been trimmed off.

All of them were stamped close to the breech GR Douglas by a machine, not hand stamped.

Keith Lisle